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Messages - Pmt111500

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1
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2017 melting season
« on: July 19, 2017, 03:42:45 PM »
Have you taken into consideration how there has not been any growth to speak of in 2017? There has not been one month of 'normal' ice since about mid September 2016. So if 2017 would have to pick up in being cold enough for new ice, it sure is taking long..
Last years October figure was a consequence of an exceptional decline in the September Ice in the Antarctic and an exceptionally low rate of growth in the Arctic in October.  I expect both areas to be more normal this year with the likely extent reaching about 25 million in October.  Not as high as previous years but higher than the low of 2016. which after all followed on the end of a long and virulent El Nino with global sea temperatures well above previous records.
We'll see if the Weddel and Ross Gyres partially responsible for the flatlining last autumn have recovered to their former levels of ice. I wouldn't be surprised by large gains there compared to last year. But arctic is another matter. I expect the autumn peak be a bit higher than 2016 but not back within the main pack.

2
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2017 melting season
« on: July 18, 2017, 10:38:41 AM »
Surprised people haven't commented on the upcoming PAC2017


And there goes the north polar cell. :o 8) ::) wacc works also on summers, but the result is a bit different than in winter. Hot times ahead.

3
Arctic sea ice / Re: IJIS
« on: July 17, 2017, 05:50:59 AM »
<snip;N.>
... what?  This forum's OK with casual racism now?

That comment earned him a spot on my "Ignore List". He should feel honored. It is a select group, only three others, two of whom no longer post here.

I've come to expect comments like that on forums having moderators getting their proper sleep. Forums that are open only when a moderator is awake, are unsurprisingly better moderated, but gather quite a little number of followers.

4
I believe an ice shelf is not uniform nor strong enough to amplify the wave it generates in a collapse. But, if you lose the buttressimg shelf fast enough the glacier (and the ground it resides) can become unstable and generate a land/ice slide tsunami. The main component here too would be land since it drops all the way to the bottom. So any tsunamis or waves involving ice are less damaging than tsunamis from plain landslides.

5
Antarctica / Re: Rift in Larsen C
« on: July 14, 2017, 01:43:57 PM »
It would be kind of fun if the sea ice charts would show 'very old ice' with an estimate of years to develop to such a berg. I guess in this case there should be a number of over at least 8200. Probably much more.

6
Arctic sea ice / Re: IJIS
« on: July 14, 2017, 11:00:36 AM »

Actually it is neither, it is a rolling 2-day average. Here is a copy of the relevant descriptive text...

Ah yes, then the double century would be a very rare occasion, triple century so far nonexistent.

7
Arctic sea ice / Re: Glossary ... for newbies and others
« on: July 14, 2017, 10:53:03 AM »
Can someone explain '  GARLIC PRESS '
Not the correct place for the question, but "garlic press" of the canadian arctic archipelago is just an euphemism for the structure  and currents of it. Sufficiently weak ice north of the archipelago gets broken by the combined effect of dominant currents from north, the assisting winds and the narrow channels in there providing grinding effect. The resulting mush of rather thick pieces of ice gets spread along the center of Northwest passage, and is still a hazard for weaker ships travelling there... Much easirr to say "garlic press" ;-).

8
Arctic sea ice / Re: IJIS
« on: July 13, 2017, 06:45:35 AM »
Please espen, could you speed it up? My guess is starting to be too low. :-P

9
Antarctica / Re: Rift in Larsen C
« on: July 13, 2017, 05:09:51 AM »
Proposing the name 'Reagan Iceberg' for the piece of ice shelf that irreversibly separated from the glaciers of West Antarctica. This would be because of the slow pace of heat accumulation in the ocean, the 'thermal inertia' which is too technical an expression for many. This just means that the water takes a while to warm up and the heat that was applied in 1980s would have done the same, though a bit later, possibly in 2030s. Thus we could expect the "Iceberg Tillerson of Drumpfistan" to be launched by the chinese conspirators in 2040s. This would be way larger since the ego size and stupidity difference.

10
Arctic sea ice / Re: IJIS
« on: July 06, 2017, 07:38:25 PM »
It's pretty well documented that 1979 was about the "iciest" in recorded history for arctic ice extent-it was likely lower before that but the data is sparse.

"Pretty well documented"? Huh? And why is it "likely lower" prior to 1979? The Hadley dataset (top graph) shows both that 1979 was nothing special, and that sea ice has been declining since at least the mid-1950s. An analysis of shipping records dating back to the 1700s show that there's less ice now then there has been in at least several hundred years. And the Kinnard paper (bottom graph) suggests there hasn't been so little ice in at least thousands of years.

(Of course, if you're talking about previous interglacial periods--say, 125,000 years ago, for instance--there was indeed much less ice, maybe even none. But that meltout was for far different reasons than we're seeing today.)





Hey, would the little ice age be the max as we come out of holocene maximum, or is there another period such as 14th century that would be the max ice point in the historical period? Maybe 6th century?

IJIS extent is still hanging way up, from what i expected but there's still plenty of time for the halocline to break properly.

11
Yea, new record here too if i was unclear from my previous posts.

12
Arctic sea ice / Re: What the Buoys are telling
« on: July 01, 2017, 08:28:16 AM »
Just looking at the OB14 pitch and roll graphs:
http://obuoy.datatransport.org/monitor#buoy14/gps

Pitch fluctuates by up to 10 degrees, generally returning to zero.  Roll is only fluctuating by fractions of a degree around an average that is changing slightly.  Seems odd for one to vary by significantly more than the other.  Thoughts?  Malfunctioning sensors?
I don't see sensors malfunctioning, there's of course the m/s mark on speed graph on which the 's' should be something else than 'second'. Maybe 'meters per signal'? Then we would just have to know what's the data sending/receiving frequency on this metric and the true speed of the floe would be 'easy' to calculate...

The data looks like the the floe the Obuoy14 is on has cracked itself free of the neigboring floes on June 26th. Disintegration of the pack on the area would thus have begun. It's still a pack though and the continued returning to 0 would say the floe is one of the thickest up there. The tilt could soon change to show constant small tilt as the floe should capture loose ice to its nooks and crannies underneath surface. The wobbles in the tilt could just be the floes reaction to ice that's been pushed umder the ice by opposing forces of current and constant pushback by the lands nearby. 10 degrees isn't that much.

That the roll is near zero would (to me) say the neighboring floes are keeping the pack tight, so there could be several cycles of meltponds/draining ahead before final melt.

On the currents in the area, on the buoy location afaik they have still been towards east and Greenland and then turning south through the archipelago. Thus the buoy might end up near the shore of continental Canada.

13
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2017 melting season
« on: July 01, 2017, 07:47:30 AM »
Is it possible that the big discrepancy between the eastern Arctic, especially Greenland, and the western Arctic, that means the Pacific side, plays a role in the low temperature average? The Pacific side definitely is not cold at all, while the Atlantic side rather destroys ice by export and storms and not so much by heat (but both sides seem to work hand in hand in a way ... ).
It's the wind that blows from the Pacific across the Pole, by then has become cold North wind, over Svalbard and Greenland, all thru the Arctic losing energy to melt ice and heat cold ice, plus the remnants of the past storm.
2007 is the paramount example of this kind of circulation sustained for months since spring and all thru July. Have a look to 2007 DMI temps... Mostly negative anomalies for months. The year of so bad pacific side meltout.
DMI 80 N is not clearly correlated with melting, period.
Said so LMV is all right in pointing really anomalous cold dip. We will see.
Yep sis, (some speculative content follows) El Nino +1. The first year of the cycle ending with big release of heat through atmosphere, that's by happenstance been about 5 years apart past 20 years. Really the cycle could be shorter but the earth's axial tilt is a powerful regulator of cycles having a period of years+fraction. Still hoping this is a year of small melt, compared to the largest melt years.

14
The rest / Re: Arctic Café
« on: June 26, 2017, 07:26:44 AM »
This might be of some use in some threads, the friendly big red button: https://www.myinstants.com/instant/the-sun-is-a-deadly-laser-9036/

15
Arctic sea ice / Re: Stupid Questions :o
« on: June 22, 2017, 06:19:31 PM »
Stupid question thread:  Are cars the biggest co2 problem?  And is the best solution = electric cars like the tesla?

Cars a large problem, but not the biggest. Electrical generation takes that spot.

https://www.epa.gov/ghgemissions/sources-greenhouse-gas-emissions
Yep, and that's an issue that is quite large, though the link is for US numbers. Situation is a bit different elsewhere, but the situation in US underlines the issue pretty neatly.

16
Arctic sea ice / Re: Stupid Questions :o
« on: June 22, 2017, 03:30:27 PM »
Straight away a partial answer would be that the best solution would be walkable/bicyclable commutes and shopping trips. As the produce still needs to move then some electric van + electrified train is hard to beat. Then use Linux on difficult mode to do communication with people... But K' electric cars could be part of the system...

The most difficult human system to convert to solely use renewable energy would likely be farming/forestry, for the distances, but it cannot be the biggest problem i think as we need food and wood for construction...

17
Science / Re: Exiting The Anthropocene
« on: June 22, 2017, 11:33:25 AM »
It's not often life has morphed the planet to have radically different attributes but this anthropocene is to be one such period. The status quo between the bacterial and fungal decomposers, nutrient producing plants and animals has been altered by a species that can utilize the sort of organic stuff even decomposers have deemed to be waste or even toxic. We might add to the traditional carbon cycle the effect this species has, just like there's room in ecological models for the photosynthetic bacteria and unicellular algae, and the early land plants, which created the snowball earth periods. The unclear reasons for the Permian exctinction event may include also organisms, which would these be is unclear. This time around, the chemistry of earth is changing to hotter temperatures, which could be regarded 'natural' for the species responsible for the warming is of tropical origin. Thus it likes hotter temperatures than earth currently on average has. In doing this the species forces other species to adapt, but it maybe there are species that indeed are already better adapted to hotter and more humid conditions. Thus unexpected changes by other species such as the methanogenic bacteria may be in waiting. This though doesn't change the instigator of these changes.

18
Arctic sea ice / Re: Stupid Questions :o
« on: June 21, 2017, 08:47:03 PM »
One thing that puzzles me each year is the colour of the ice in the Foxe Basin - it is always a more creamy white than the rest of the sea ice (due to algae/diatoms?) yet drifts about and melts out later than I expect. Any reasons known?
Yes that's a puzzler. My understanding it gets some of its ice from the north, but this isn't nearly enough to explain the constant whiteness (seemingly) of the basin. There could be a sonewhat closed circulation within it but still it looks odd. It's one of the few areas keeping the cold better than normal if you ask me. Why tthat would be, it's odd. Not of course very significant wrt whole arctic but still an odd place weatherwise up there. Maybe the somewhat brackish waters of Hudson play an influence?

19
Arctic sea ice / Re: Stupid Questions :o
« on: June 18, 2017, 05:28:06 AM »
Why is it that seemingly every producer of graphs showing annual curves chooses a different color scheme from others?  One chart has 2017 in black, another in red; one chart's 2012 is yellow, another is red.

That's alternative science for you ;-)

20
The rest / Re: Paradoxically hoping for record low Arctic sea ice
« on: June 16, 2017, 08:32:49 AM »
I've been wishing weather related adversities and disasters to deniers, as they want to hurt nature and fellow human beings. But wishing a new record for a 10th of the planet is another matter, that will hurt also innocents, animals, plants, and eventually innocent humans too. The guilty deniers affected have probably flewn to another location to spit out their lies and misrepresentation by this time, to spoil another tenth of thebplanet.

21
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2017 melting season
« on: June 16, 2017, 08:12:48 AM »
It's of course possible the islands on seas bordering the CAB generate vortixes in the Ocean, the same way as they do it in the atmosphere, and let the halocline break on the already open locations. Thus the fresh water from Siberian melt would reach the CAB less efficiently and help in the later melt during summer. But I won't change my vote, as it is already closed, and imho this isn't yet the total melt year.

22
Arctic sea ice / Re: IJIS
« on: June 13, 2017, 06:08:34 PM »
The 2012 big early drop was largely for meltponding, how might this year fare looking at this. I won't check it but it might be interesting to compare.

23
Thanks Juan for starting this poll, this year indeed has lots of uncertainties so it's kind of fun to shoot in the dark. May I suggest for the sake of our psychology to make the bins overlapping? 2.75-3.25, 2.5-3.0 etc.?
I think that this is a really bad idea! it give people permission to be flaky. If people are in adjoining bins were they really voting for the same thing or not? Going to make for poor quality statistics is it not?
We no want statistics. This is the --------n way of settling things. Shoot fast and marginal hits count. If no hit target moved

24
The rest / Re: Arctic Café
« on: June 11, 2017, 11:27:00 AM »
Oops. Anthropomorphisms should probably be here

Pacific:"hey Arctic, could I shove this hot air and water to you?"
Arctic:"oh dear, why do you have to be so hot? I'd rather not."
Pacific:"it's nice you think I'm hot, here's a hug of hot air"
Arctic:"you're kind of warm hearted, but I'm not sure..."
Pacific:"enough talk, i'm ready, here i come".
Pacific then proceeds to inject warm waters to Arctic and Arctic shouts:"careful I'm pretty sensitive!"
5 months later Arctics father Atlantic says to her daughter,"i don't recognize you anymore, why are you so hot and fat and warm to strange animals?"

25
Arctic sea ice / Re: Siberian Arctic coast
« on: June 09, 2017, 07:29:48 AM »
made a cartoon of sorts about this, it's of course no good practice to anthropomorphize ice floes, but, as the idea came this is the result. Afaik, ridges nearer to the shore are on average higher than those out on the open seas.

26
Arctic sea ice / Re: Siberian Arctic coast
« on: June 09, 2017, 05:27:03 AM »
I cannot imagine how FYI could ridge to 10m thick ice. Could this be some of the last thick ice that huddled near the CAA that broke away several years ago and made a lonely journey to the ESS?
SH, this happens on occasion even in northern Baltic Sea, the trick to get a 10m thick wall of ridged ice is actually not as hard as most tend to think. You only need to wedge a somewhat thick floe, say 70cm, of say 20m in diameter, between two larger pieces of ice, at an angle. This then acts as an anchor point to the rest of the ice.
The trick is most of the wedged ice is still under water so the force making the initial ridge has not to be so strong as many would think. A strong winter storm exerting pressure on a vast field of ice behind the wedging floe can pretty easily push even a such a small floe at an angle. I've seen 10 m floes at 45 degrees over in the sea. A protrusion of 2 meters above smooth ice in pictures could have over 8 meters of ice in the ocean. No doubt some of the wedged ice can snap off the initial wedged floe so the ice-breaker captain must use his experience to estimate the true thickness of these ridges. Hope this helps.

I might add that the fact that there are few if any time-lapse videos of this process is likely due the fact that most people want to stay very closely inside in such weather and not risk losing their equipment. Likely over 15m/s winds + windblown snowcrystals would likely clog the view from a camera anyway if it's anchored strongly enough. Some o-buoy type of rig in a correct location could probably do it.

27
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2017 melting season
« on: June 07, 2017, 09:35:34 AM »
Just had a thought - melt ponding is reliant on the ice being solid and thick enough for a pond to form on top of it, right? If it's all fractured like it is in it's current state then there is less opportunity for a pond to form, as still water would filter through the cracks in the ice?

Would that be boosting previous years readings in terms of area melt?

This would be an issue that has occurred to me too. I don't have knowledge of this issue since the ice here on the southern extreme of the Baltic ice usually doesn't get thick enough to contain large melt ponds for long. The Arctic Ocean is also more restless than the shores here. It could be the meltponds nowadays just break a route and spill to the ocean straight away. My guess is we'll see melt ponding on the sat images soon but not in the extent of June cliff in previous years. I'd place the high nunerical drops in extent and area to July-August. Do we see over 300000 lost in a single day? Oh, the exitement. ???

28
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2017 melting season
« on: June 06, 2017, 07:03:13 AM »
Ball bearings at coasts somewhat less smooth rounded bearings elsewhere on the leads. Roundness in the darker areas would indicate leads not breaking ridges. Both let the IR dark of the ocean show up on channels of IR. The pack's on the move, how fast is a question as well as the thickness. Surprising open areas may start to show up B4 long.

29
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2017 melting season
« on: June 05, 2017, 05:55:20 AM »
North Pole today. Image: Worldview.

It is not the fracturing that worries me but the lack of those rhomboid floe structures that, if iirc, are evidence of thick, strong MYI.

*Exactly*, SH, exactly.
Is the summer short enough? I doubt it but there's always hope.

30
<clip>

 And that's not taking into account the odd way NSIDC actually  calculate it.
Oh yeah I forgot that particular piece of inaccuracy. Gotta move my vote one notch up.

31
It looks like I've regained the alarmist position comparing to majority on the site. Nevermind, the US prez election results show that majority doesn't always matter, as does the US decision to abandon an international treaty. I'm off to pollute so my vote has more chances to win and not punish the reputation of my votes. But I'm just a single person so my acts won't matter in the large picture, right?

32

Are you feeling ok?
This is not negotiable. Of course I am. How are you? Since you hide your location, the regular pleasantries and automatic responses to inquiries of personal info should be enough.

33
Policy and solutions / Re: But, but, but, China....
« on: June 02, 2017, 07:21:21 AM »
 The costs of the reworking of the dikes and the Suez is of course a legal matter. Parties involved with these should sue the largest emitters of pollution in US for compensation.

34

The most intriguing part of that event is that warming exhibited a pretty large scale feature in the Arctic and the area was warmed by something very fast from 1920s to 1930s.  So causes  of this fast warming rate has puzzled me for a long time.

Reduction in global SO2 emissions


So the early 20th-Century UK initiatives to clean up the "Dark, Satanic Mills" and to banish the London "smog" could now be interpreted as having unintended consequences?

Don't let the Dirty-Coal lobby get wind of that one. Next thing you know DT will be tweeting that the librul tree-huggers _caused_ global warming.

I thought the coal-lobbyists lead by US government already did this? At least I've seen some comments claiming this. The best way to attack these assholes would be to pour sulfuric and nitrous acids to their yards and spray their houses with the stuff as they want the good old 1970s back, but as this is still illegal, we'd need to find something else for these asshats. Severe their US made cars and Ddos attack their servers? Still illegal, but less conspicuous.

35
It appears there are claims US is doing some things that could be in accord to the sensible policies for the planet. In the absence of official verificaton of thwse, from the highest levels of government, all these claims should be regarded as hear-say, thus untrustworthy without further validation. The sensible people of US, do not fall for your government propaganda. Verify, fact-check all these claims in real life for there are many who want to asure you don't have to and everything's ok.

(I'm off to write facts (not propaganda of course, oops) against US government.

For the younger generation, this has been a visit to rhe 1970s and soviet propaganda.

WTF?
The cold war was an interesting time. As US is now separating from international community wrt environmental policies, a new cold war wrt policies on enviroment could be an idea. Do not buy anything made in US, if possible. Their drones kill innocent civilians round the globe and their environmental policies are from the 19th century (exaggarating of course).

36
It appears there are claims US is doing some things that could be in accord to the sensible policies for the planet. In the absence of official verificaton of thwse, from the highest levels of government, all these claims should be regarded as hear-say, thus untrustworthy without further validation. The sensible people of US, do not fall for your government propaganda. Verify, fact-check all these claims in real life for there are many who want to asure you don't have to and everything's ok.

(I'm off to write facts (not propaganda of course, oops) against US government.

For the younger generation, this has been a visit to rhe 1970s and soviet propaganda.

37
I clearly need a discussion forum which bans all writers having an IP connected to the US. This is not as simple to do as many of their rogue companies/enterprises have offices outside their borders. Their internet connection should be monitored like their own nation does already, and any posts by the citicens of US getting through should be marked as propaganda against planet.

I'm not asking Neven to do this, it could be useful to have connections to the internal resistance movement of US, but the risk of US government infiltrators is too large if any messages from US are let through. Here's hoping for strenght for the resistance in the insurgency against the government of US. You may use Chevy Volt since you do not have access to better cars. Please continue to promote and act towards the destruction of the companies tied to the current destructive government of US.

38
This mainly means that United States government wants to keep secret how much they pollute their own citicens and the planet. They want to drown the low-lying deltas and ports, Netherlands and Miami. Thus every trade an military deal with them should be renegotiated with them keeping this in mind. The countries most hurt by this irresponsible action should sue US companies in every possibility for damages for lost land and production. This would likely best be done in both international and National courts as US does falsely extend its jurisdiction outside its borders.

Bettet of course if the economical ties to US could be totally cut and their ambassadors evicted as is done for some rogue nations. Ambassadors should not be invited to the parties of sensible nations.

US cars are bad. Now many should start to write propaganda against US, you do not even have to lie anymore.

39
Science / Re: 2017 Mauna Loa CO2
« on: May 30, 2017, 07:33:53 PM »
We've passed the Annual peak so it's going down until august-september. Sheesh. Government propaganda, hah.

40
Science / Re: 2017 Mauna Loa CO2
« on: May 30, 2017, 10:25:45 AM »
I think Scripps has a bit stricter elimination process for valid measurements than some other orgs, when that happens best likely linearly interpolate between.

41
Arctic sea ice / Re: How soon could we go ice free?
« on: May 28, 2017, 08:49:19 PM »
Nah, the blue ocean event would be the starting signal for the worse things to happen, will likely take a decade or two afterwards to have those all over globe. Of course it's pretty impossible to stop it once it starts. So i'd say 2040s-50s earliest decapita... No. Hopefully denialists will do it themselves.

Why not concentrate on the happier aspects of cc. Even now, you could grow elephants in southern europe if you had enough land... Oops. Troubling times ahead, i'd say, no way around it. There are some other more positive opinions on this. Maybe some descendants in the far future find a copy of H.G.Wells' "time machine" and start to think him as nostradamus or prophet.

42
Science / Re: 2017 Mauna Loa CO2
« on: May 25, 2017, 06:09:21 AM »
This should start going down now, though our government is (what I hear) doing plenty to cut down forests to increase the future growth... (hope the actors in this know that the better way to store carbon wrt is to store the felled wood, use it to build something durable f.e., and NOT burn it, like some have stated. That is, the size of the recycled human carbon pool depends partly on the amount of Wooden structures. There are other ways to store it yes. No, there are none which would allow you to burn the wood and rise the forest carbon pool at the same time. Unless you calculate it wrong and falsely. No, it does not help at all to burn wood only at nights, though the IR escapes to dark space. it does not do it ANY BETTER and you leave the CO2 to the atmosphere to block it more. No the fact that radiation is faster than gas movements does not help. Unless you have an infrared laser cooling system pointed out of your wood burning stove. No, you can't buy them anywhere since there are none that have been built. No you can't build those even if they were possible to build any cheaper than a fully electric car with an in-built noise maker so you can continue to disturb the neighborhood. (add insults to certain officials here)

Sorry for the rant.

43
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2017 melting season
« on: May 25, 2017, 05:54:24 AM »
Will it keep on keeping on?


At the surface that resembles the thaw on Siberian coasts. The thick ice looks like having been  gone to the seas (quite literally) and the thin 1st year ice is all that is left for polar bears to wade on. Soon nothing prevents nostalgic seal/polarbear/narwhale hunters in Greenland to move to CAA north shore and live happily (well, NOT of course ever after) for a while.

Summer's finally here in S.Finland. Leaves on trees have grown like crazy during the past week (only buds then, now maple leaves at ~4 inch width.)

44
Arctic sea ice / Re: IJIS
« on: May 17, 2017, 08:46:01 AM »
IJIS:

11,929,542 km2(May 16, 2017)down 90,700 km2 and 5th lowest measured for the date.
Is this the largest drop for the day of the year? #absolutelynecessaryordinals #notthefastestidontcare

Sorry, the denialist-me speaking.

45
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2017 melting season
« on: May 11, 2017, 07:06:17 AM »
Aren't above zero temperatures at 2m not highly unlikely when there is still a lot of ice, because the ice will 'absorb' the heat?
at surface yes, but at two meters the tenperatures can already be a bit above zero. By how much depends on winds/humidity

46
Here's how one of our tv-weather casters reacted to the temperatures this morning. https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10154301287600356&id=266438865355

I had to record this. Photo quality is bad. May 10th. 6 weeks to 'midsummer'

47
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2017 melting season
« on: May 09, 2017, 10:51:11 AM »
Now as the spring has warmed the ice up some, it came to mind to ask if there has been many Double Century (loss) days in previous years? 150000Km2/day losses are regularly seen these days. Some sort of breakdown (ha-ha) on these numbers would be nice.

48
Policy and solutions / Re: Becoming Vegan.
« on: May 07, 2017, 05:08:35 PM »
For the first time, saw 'pulled oats'- oat+bean mesh being sold at the local market. Was tempted to buy since it's been called 'the most chicken-like meat substitute' but was still deterred by the price. Will try it sometime. I've been using a couple of soy protein products mixed with minced meat every now and then and can say some of the dried ones preserve for aboiöut a year when kept dry.
Won't go totally vegan though admitting some of the vegetarian food is very tasty and filling.

49
This winter, the National Meteorological Office here could have been called by another name. As a proof of this I'll show the prediction for the next five days, the temperatures are in Celsius. The anecdote would continue with a picture of sleet warning at -4°C, but I didnt save that one.

Pmt., where is this happening?

southern Finland, we (again) had a winter when an image containing sleet and slush on the ground could have been taken during 2016 october - 2017 may. This would be entirely normal for the 1980s though, with the distinction that in this winter we have had maybe only 4-5 inches snow max.

50
This winter, the National Meteorological Office here could have been called by another name. As a proof of this I'll show the prediction for the next five days, the temperatures are in Celsius. The anecdote would continue with a picture of sleet warning at -4°C, but I didnt save that one.

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