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Alphabet Hotel

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1900 on: June 20, 2019, 06:09:38 PM »
That shows The Nares has taken virtually no ice out of the Lincoln Sea for a week.

Instead, it is rapidly melting in the lincoln sea. WHICH IS WAY MORE CRAZY AND TROUBLING!

Now that I've watched the latest a few more times, I think you're right. You can see the floes starting to lose their shape in the last couple of frames. I didn't know that was not normal.

Tor Bejnar

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1901 on: June 20, 2019, 07:51:26 PM »
Also, melt ponding went from nil to very much happening.
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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1902 on: June 20, 2019, 08:51:21 PM »
'Normal' is a sheet of ice with some fractures .. Nares is mostly asleep on the surface in June .. b.c.
2007 + 5 = 2012 + 4 = 2016 + 3 = 2019 ...

Tor Bejnar

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1903 on: June 20, 2019, 09:19:36 PM »
Export from Lincoln Sea to Nares Strait has started up again.  GIF uses DMI Sentinel images from June 17, 19 and 20.

Viewing images at the DMI site down Nares Strait: Hall Basin got the memo and is filling up with ice from the north, but Kane Basin has a gyre recycling its few floes (for now).
« Last Edit: June 20, 2019, 09:25:44 PM by Tor Bejnar »
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b_lumenkraft

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1904 on: June 20, 2019, 09:23:26 PM »
Good, there is radar! In the visual, you can't see anything. All cloudy.

Thanks, Tor for the update. :)

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1905 on: June 21, 2019, 08:54:59 AM »
01.06. to 20.06. plus forecast 29.06. (the last still frame)

Mercator sees the current not to pick up again for now.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1906 on: June 21, 2019, 01:20:03 PM »
So the ice floes are now all the way down to Petermann.

I don't think though, there is a (strong) current ATM because when there is, the floe movement is normally confined to the right side of the strait.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1907 on: June 22, 2019, 08:47:02 PM »
Finally some nice cloud free frames in a row.

Tide pushed floes back into Lincoln, forming a polynya in the west again.

Still not looking like there was a surface current.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1908 on: June 23, 2019, 09:21:15 AM »
The situation is unchanged. Upper NS is full of ice floes, a few ones made it past Petermann - tidal driven. No surface current apparent.


gerontocrat

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1909 on: June 23, 2019, 10:44:01 AM »
The situation is unchanged. Upper NS is full of ice floes, a few ones made it past Petermann - tidal driven. No surface current apparent.
And yet if you look at Aluminium's latest gif in the melting season thread, the impression is stuff is charging down the strait. Illusion?
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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1910 on: June 23, 2019, 10:55:52 AM »
Idk really.

Possible explanations i can think of:

Floes are moving still due to tides, going in and out of the strait in the north.
Fast ice in the strait becomes loose.
The Kane gyre is still active, also causing floe movement.

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oren

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1912 on: June 23, 2019, 03:56:52 PM »
In Aluminium's animation I also noticed ice moving east instead of south at the Fram exit. I think there are some wind effects in the region negating the movement induced by the currents.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1913 on: June 23, 2019, 05:50:03 PM »
In Aluminium's animation I also noticed ice moving east instead of south at the Fram exit. I think there are some wind effects in the region negating the movement induced by the currents.
When Fram export reduces, Greenland melt increases.
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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1914 on: June 24, 2019, 08:37:28 AM »
A comparison upper vs. lower NS (22.06. 09:41h to 24.06. 01:27h UTC)

I see a surface current in lower NS.
The upper NS still looks like mainly tidal driven to me.

(click to play, both)

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1915 on: June 25, 2019, 02:06:52 PM »
What the heck are those (click GIF to unveil mystery)?

Someone lost their triangle ruler in Petermanns fast ice??

Tor Bejnar

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1916 on: June 25, 2019, 03:55:31 PM »
On the melting thread, a comment was posted that some might interpret as implying there has been continuous export.  Cross posted here:
Quote
steady Fram and Nares export
Actually, export via Nares Strait has been near 'squat' for two weeks.  Images from DMI Sentinel - June 15, 19 and 24.  There is a poll about the large floe "She" that sits at the top of these three frames (half cut off).
I make no comment about what export will look like this week or beyond.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2019, 04:56:30 PM by Tor Bejnar »
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BenB

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1917 on: June 25, 2019, 05:45:28 PM »
I should have expressed myself better. :D

But I think that overall Nares has been reasonably busy this season, and the ice hasn't been blocked on too many occasions compared with other years.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1918 on: June 25, 2019, 06:10:04 PM »
Tor, since we are at it pointing fingers, it also has to be mentioned that comrade Gerontocrat reported a low in Baffin and blames it all on the east Greenland current [1] totally not telling that there is no replenishment from NS at the moment and this might contribute to the situation. :o

While Nares Strait compresses his arse cheeks in order to keep dat ice in Lincoln, he doesn't even get praised. Poor narrow hero...

[1] https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,2533.msg208224.html#msg208224

oren

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1919 on: June 25, 2019, 08:06:07 PM »
Strangely, despite the very active Nares, Baffin has been tracking low all season.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1920 on: June 25, 2019, 08:06:56 PM »
Oh, good point!

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1921 on: June 25, 2019, 08:23:28 PM »
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1922 on: June 25, 2019, 08:35:06 PM »
Yeah, kind of a flop my theory there.  :-X

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1923 on: June 25, 2019, 09:56:25 PM »
Yeah, kind of a flop my theory there.  :-X
You have company? SHE a bit of a flop too?
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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1924 on: June 25, 2019, 10:05:10 PM »
SHE a bit of a flop too?

I did say She will likely crack before even entering the strait, but boy did i thought in another direction. Who would have thought She would hang around for so long with us?

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1925 on: June 27, 2019, 08:13:28 AM »
DMI has posted new radar images, after a run of days without any. It looks like it's flowing again.

http://ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/lincoln.uk.php
Jun 19-20, 24-26

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1926 on: June 27, 2019, 07:30:16 PM »
OK, the first 'bulk' floes (the floes sitting around in the north for weeks) almost made it to Hans now.

She (or what's left of She) might enter the strait soon.

(Click to play)

magnamentis

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1927 on: June 27, 2019, 09:11:51 PM »
DMI has posted new radar images, after a run of days without any. It looks like it's flowing again.

touch-down (or collision) imminent, thanks for posting it.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1928 on: June 27, 2019, 10:25:29 PM »
I was just looking at the last sentinel images and see Lincoln flowing South.. Looks like the last hope floe has turned holy . Lincoln looks in good shape 'till you look closely .. it's just rubble , rubble everywhere . And only another 11 weeks of melting season to go .. b.c.
2007 + 5 = 2012 + 4 = 2016 + 3 = 2019 ...

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1929 on: June 28, 2019, 06:19:50 AM »

BenB

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1930 on: June 28, 2019, 05:06:22 PM »
Someone on the main melting season thread linked to the Sea Ice Outlook for June:

https://www.arcus.org/sipn/sea-ice-outlook/2019/june

I only skimmed it, but I happened to notice the following:

The arch typically breaks up in June or July, allowing ice to drift through the narrow channel. This year, the arch broke up by late March, much earlier than is typical. Since then, there has been a steady flow of ice through Nares Strait (download animation to view).

You should tell them off, Tor. ;) However, unlike me they could perhaps defend themselves with the argument that their report was written, if not published, before the recent hiatus.

Tor Bejnar

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1931 on: June 28, 2019, 06:05:02 PM »
Ben,
I'll be curious what (if anything) they write about Nares export in the July report that reviews what happened in (mostly) June.
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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1932 on: June 28, 2019, 06:08:23 PM »
latest pass just came online, hardly the size to make up for a cork.

Tor Bejnar

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1933 on: June 28, 2019, 07:56:22 PM »
But if "She" doesn't crack anymore, turns sideways and 'lands' gently on Hans Island's shore, She might block the strait for a day.  How many "if"s was this??? :o
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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1934 on: June 28, 2019, 08:19:21 PM »
Sounds plausible, Tor. Must be wrong.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1935 on: June 28, 2019, 11:24:59 PM »
Im not following the Nares much apart from the pain it inflicts staying open year round with a brief hiatus in March.

So I am really intrigued by this accretion of ice right where the Straight meets the Baffin polynya. It is the only place in the NH where ice extent has been really increasing in June.
It seems currents of both directions meet in this singular place and as a result a low velocity region emerges where ice floes stick to the accreting fast ice like glue.
Any insight on this is appreciated.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2019, 11:40:45 PM by Sterks »

magnamentis

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1936 on: June 29, 2019, 12:02:21 AM »
But if "She" doesn't crack anymore, turns sideways and 'lands' gently on Hans Island's shore, She might block the strait for a day.  How many "if"s was this??? :o

i was so totally sure that someone would say that LOL

however, seriously, i had that thought for a split seconds but there indeed are too many ifs and then it wouldn't hold and crumble on on impact on hans island LATEST which is why i kept the thought for myself.

but possible in theory it is as long as we don't know more about the integrity of the floe as a whole.

 8) 8) 8)

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1937 on: June 29, 2019, 12:15:07 AM »
An article (Maddie Stone):

The Gateway Protecting the Arctic's Oldest Sea Ice Has Collapsed Months Ahead of Schedule

https://earther.gizmodo.com/the-gateway-protecting-the-arctics-oldest-sea-ice-has-c-1835875727


Tor Bejnar

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1938 on: June 29, 2019, 12:25:55 AM »
Sterks,
Do you realize you posted a picture of Kane Basin?
Because of its gyre, it tends to accumulate floes when there isn't a strong Nares flow, and some of them originated in Kane Basin!
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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1939 on: June 29, 2019, 06:51:55 AM »
Im not following the Nares much apart from the pain it inflicts staying open year round with a brief hiatus in March.

So I am really intrigued by this accretion of ice right where the Straight meets the Baffin polynya. It is the only place in the NH where ice extent has been really increasing in June.
It seems currents of both directions meet in this singular place and as a result a low velocity region emerges where ice floes stick to the accreting fast ice like glue.
Any insight on this is appreciated.

This accumulation of floes in Kane is due to the fact that the current stopped for a few weeks. Movement in the strait was mainly caused by tidal waves during this time. Export to Baffin almost stopped.

b_lumenkraft

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1940 on: June 29, 2019, 06:54:10 AM »
Sterks,
Do you realize you posted a picture of Kane Basin?
Because of its gyre, it tends to accumulate floes when there isn't a strong Nares flow, and some of them originated in Kane Basin!

The Kane gyre was active, that's right. Not sure about its influence on this accumulation though.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1941 on: June 29, 2019, 07:51:38 AM »
Sterks,
Do you realize you posted a picture of Kane Basin?
Because of its gyre, it tends to accumulate floes when there isn't a strong Nares flow, and some of them originated in Kane Basin!
No. I didn’t realize.
So this is the famous Kane basin...
Well thanks to you all for the information.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1942 on: June 29, 2019, 03:06:18 PM »
From this post:

June 1-28

Trailing 5-day median

https://seaice.uni-bremen.de/databrowser/

Here you can see the abrupt stopping of the current and how the floes accumulated in Kane, Sterks.

gerontocrat

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1943 on: June 29, 2019, 04:02:56 PM »
From this post:

June 1-28

Trailing 5-day median

https://seaice.uni-bremen.de/databrowser/

Here you can see the abrupt stopping of the current and how the floes accumulated in Kane, Sterks.
You can also see a big lump of fast ice attached to the Greenland shore detaching, breaking up and drifting into the basin. Dispersion in action.

Note: In this case the amount of ice is the same (maybe even less as melting did occur) but got spread out over a much bigger area. This has happened quite a lot over quite a lot of places this season, distorting the data, especially NSIDC extent data due to the 15% rule and large 625 km2 pixels confusing the sensors.

But very soon - history.
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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1944 on: June 29, 2019, 04:50:27 PM »
From this post:

June 1-28

Trailing 5-day median

https://seaice.uni-bremen.de/databrowser/

Here you can see the abrupt stopping of the current and how the floes accumulated in Kane, Sterks.
Thanks, very clear now. Still fascinated how fast the accretion grew as soon as the current hesitated in direction.
But I assume this ice will go now that the pressure is consistent from floes from upstream CAB and temperatures to stay above zero

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1945 on: June 29, 2019, 05:00:26 PM »
Unless the current stops again, this will clean out sooner or later, i think so too.

But since we don't know what caused the current to stop, i assume it might happen again.

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1946 on: June 29, 2019, 07:48:37 PM »
NASA has done an article on the Arch. Says it's collapse was late March.

https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/images/145232/ice-arch-crumbles-early
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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1947 on: June 30, 2019, 02:08:46 AM »
I think Sterks and Tor and b_lumenkraft caught someone’s attention:
« Last Edit: June 30, 2019, 02:16:26 AM by Rod »

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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1948 on: June 30, 2019, 07:17:00 AM »
BTW, i back scrolled a bit in this thread.

Last year there was a current stop/reversal also:


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Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #1949 on: June 30, 2019, 07:18:10 AM »
I think Sterks and Tor and b_lumenkraft caught someone’s attention:

Well, he is rather late reporting this. We had this weeks ago!

Always remember: You heard it here first!