Support the Arctic Sea Ice Forum and Blog

Author Topic: The Nares Strait thread  (Read 681322 times)

oren

  • Moderator
  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 6412
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 2385
  • Likes Given: 2031
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2150 on: September 28, 2019, 12:54:32 PM »
No chance of blocking now, the ice is not thick and strong, and the "arch" can't freeze deeply into place. This usually happens in Jan-Feb, though Dec is possible too (maybe even Nov?)

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2151 on: September 28, 2019, 02:15:58 PM »
Well, when the current is off, i could imagine a freeze over to happen quite fast if the temperatures are low enough. But once the current starts picking up again, the ice needs to be thick enough to not get sucked away.

I would love to know some real numbers on those variables.

How cold must it be for how long to freeze a sustainable sea ice surface? How does an active current influence these numbers?

Stephan

  • Nilas ice
  • Posts: 1409
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 502
  • Likes Given: 243
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2152 on: September 29, 2019, 09:25:29 PM »

I would love to know some real numbers on those variables.

How cold must it be for how long to freeze a sustainable sea ice surface? How does an active current influence these numbers?
This shouts out loud to establish a research station on Hans Island, doesn't it?  ;)
It is too late just to be concerned about Climate Change

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2153 on: September 29, 2019, 09:35:59 PM »
Couldn't agree more, Stephan!  :D

GAWLab

  • New ice
  • Posts: 24
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 87
  • Likes Given: 22
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2154 on: September 30, 2019, 06:23:01 PM »
Well, when the current is off, i could imagine a freeze over to happen quite fast if the temperatures are low enough. But once the current starts picking up again, the ice needs to be thick enough to not get sucked away.

I would love to know some real numbers on those variables.

How cold must it be for how long to freeze a sustainable sea ice surface? How does an active current influence these numbers?
All I know is, don't go looking for those temperatures today.  For most of the last 48 hours the temperature in Alert has been above freezing, hitting a high of 4.7 degrees the morning of the 28th.  Everything outside right now is melting, there's water dripping from the roof of the lab.  The forecast says we're going to see continued high temperatures through most of the week.

Admittedly my experience is limited, but I've never seen weather like this so late in the season.  5 degrees is warmer than most days in the middle of summer, and we're only two weeks away from the final sunset of the year...

I'm up here until the first week of January, I'll be watching this thread closely in the meantime.  Judging by the large area of open water visible off the coast here, I have serious doubts about the ability of the ice bridge to form this winter.  The floes are simply too sparse and thin.
- Kevin
Operator, Dr. Neil Trivett Global Atmosphere Watch Observatory
Alert, NU

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2155 on: September 30, 2019, 07:01:38 PM »
Hey Kevin, so nice to read you!  :D

So, in January, your watch has ended, eh? ;)

Don't forget to instruct the guy/girl replacing you to post here too.

ivica

  • Nilas ice
  • Posts: 1044
  • Kelele
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 56
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2156 on: September 30, 2019, 07:38:11 PM »
Hi Kevin,
can you tell us where is Alert N.W.T. weather station positioned (with respect to your location) ?
https://www.infoclimat.fr/observations-meteo/temps-reel/alert-n-w-t/71082.html#highlight=17
Temp there as presented by Infoclimat was -8 °C at 12h.

GAWLab

  • New ice
  • Posts: 24
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 87
  • Likes Given: 22
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2157 on: September 30, 2019, 08:32:21 PM »
Hey Kevin, so nice to read you!  :D
Thank you, likewise! :)

Quote
So, in January, your watch has ended, eh? ;)
For four months, anyways!  I'm on a four in/four out rotation at the moment, got back up here at the beginning of September.

Quote
Don't forget to instruct the guy/girl replacing you to post here too.
I tried, but she's not as interested, unfortunately!
- Kevin
Operator, Dr. Neil Trivett Global Atmosphere Watch Observatory
Alert, NU

GAWLab

  • New ice
  • Posts: 24
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 87
  • Likes Given: 22
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2158 on: September 30, 2019, 08:37:24 PM »
Hi Kevin,
can you tell us where is Alert N.W.T. weather station positioned (with respect to your location) ?
https://www.infoclimat.fr/observations-meteo/temps-reel/alert-n-w-t/71082.html#highlight=17
Temp there as presented by Infoclimat was -8 °C at 12h.
It looks like that's the data from the ECCC weather station near the main station complex, which is very near the shoreline and also close to sea level.  Because of proximity to the ocean, temperature readings can vary quite a bit from the ones we get here up at the lab, which is 180 MASL and also several kilometres from the shore.  They didn't register the dramatic temperature spike two days ago at all, the air mass didn't reach all the way down there.  I wanted to verify the data myself, so I actually drove up to the lab just to make sure it wasn't equipment failure, and sure enough, it was actually as warm as the data said it was...

For comparison's sake, I've attached the current met plots from the lab.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2019, 08:44:14 PM by GAWLab »
- Kevin
Operator, Dr. Neil Trivett Global Atmosphere Watch Observatory
Alert, NU

oren

  • Moderator
  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 6412
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 2385
  • Likes Given: 2031
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2159 on: September 30, 2019, 08:46:10 PM »
Thank you for these updates!

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2160 on: September 30, 2019, 08:54:58 PM »
I tried, but she's not as interested, unfortunately!

That's a fucking bummer. :(

ivica

  • Nilas ice
  • Posts: 1044
  • Kelele
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 56
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2161 on: September 30, 2019, 08:56:47 PM »

GAWLab

  • New ice
  • Posts: 24
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 87
  • Likes Given: 22
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2162 on: October 01, 2019, 04:32:04 PM »
Kevin, thank you for the answer.
Other Alert's WS got the temp spike:
https://www.infoclimat.fr/observations-meteo/temps-reel/alert/71355.html

https://www.google.com/maps/@82.5033732,-62.3087138,3985m/data=!3m1!1e3
Yes, it's quite warm down here on station today.  The wind has finally pushed the warm front all the way down to the shoreline.  Melting snow everywhere...
- Kevin
Operator, Dr. Neil Trivett Global Atmosphere Watch Observatory
Alert, NU

GAWLab

  • New ice
  • Posts: 24
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 87
  • Likes Given: 22
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2163 on: October 01, 2019, 04:33:37 PM »
I tried, but she's not as interested, unfortunately!

That's a fucking bummer. :(
Haha I'll try again when she comes back in January!
- Kevin
Operator, Dr. Neil Trivett Global Atmosphere Watch Observatory
Alert, NU

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2164 on: October 01, 2019, 05:04:22 PM »
Good luck! :D

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2165 on: October 05, 2019, 08:27:46 PM »
Lincoln not looking healthy, fast refreezing in Petermann Fjord and Kane Basin, a lot of exported ice and what looks like a slowdown of export at the end.

Yep, export actually stopped for a few days, picking up this weekend but only a little following the wind pattern.

Today the GIFs are click to play since they are longer and therefore bigger in file size.

GAWLab

  • New ice
  • Posts: 24
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 87
  • Likes Given: 22
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2166 on: October 07, 2019, 10:54:37 PM »
The winds in the last 24 hours have opened up plenty of water off shore of the station.  I took this this morning on the drive to the lab.  The winds are supposed to continue the rest of the week, which could push things quite a ways out.
- Kevin
Operator, Dr. Neil Trivett Global Atmosphere Watch Observatory
Alert, NU

uniquorn

  • Young ice
  • Posts: 2822
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 1285
  • Likes Given: 258
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2167 on: October 08, 2019, 12:02:11 AM »
Thanks for the 'on the ground' image GAWLab. amsr2-uhh doesn't look quite the same :)
edit: added today's image (for yesterday) to the animation with the open water showing very clearly. Thanks for the 'heads up'.
oct1-7.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2019, 10:38:04 AM by uniquorn »

uniquorn

  • Young ice
  • Posts: 2822
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 1285
  • Likes Given: 258
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2168 on: October 08, 2019, 05:32:19 PM »
Clear enough weather over lincoln sea and part of ellesmere to take a look on worldview, viirsbt15n, sep oct6-8  https://go.nasa.gov/2odfrv3
« Last Edit: October 09, 2019, 12:39:09 PM by uniquorn »

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2169 on: October 18, 2019, 06:56:21 PM »
Long time no DMI crop post. Sorry folks.

Here is from Oktober 6th to 18th for Lincoln and to 17th for Kennedy and Kane.

Click to play.

Shared Humanity

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2170 on: October 18, 2019, 07:12:39 PM »
The condition of the ice off the coast of Greenland in that first animation is scary.

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2171 on: October 18, 2019, 07:40:01 PM »
Indeed. There is refreeze in Kane Basin but Lincoln seems stubborn.

Tor Bejnar

  • Young ice
  • Posts: 3717
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 650
  • Likes Given: 435
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2172 on: October 18, 2019, 08:14:34 PM »
GIF #2:  I 'like' the floe that was hiding in Lady Franklin Bay, then came out and danced a [jig] around Hall Basin.
GIF #3:  Mostly I've seen the Kane Basin gyre rotating counter-clockwise.  Nice to see it trying clockwise for a change.

[Edit in brackets]
« Last Edit: October 18, 2019, 09:52:39 PM by Tor Bejnar »
Arctic ice is healthy for children and other living things.

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2173 on: October 18, 2019, 08:31:18 PM »
GIF #2:  I 'like' the floe that was hiding in Lady Franklin Bay, then came out and danced a around Hall Basin.

+1  ;D

Quote
GIF #3:  Mostly I've seen the Kane Basin gyre rotating counter-clockwise.  Nice to see it trying clockwise for a change.

It looks as if a wave coming from the south disturbing the gyre. Would fit the given the wind direction.

GAWLab

  • New ice
  • Posts: 24
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 87
  • Likes Given: 22
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2174 on: October 23, 2019, 12:12:30 AM »
GIF #2:  I 'like' the floe that was hiding in Lady Franklin Bay, then came out and danced a [jig] around Hall Basin.
Hah, that's kinda cute...  If an ice floe can be cute?
- Kevin
Operator, Dr. Neil Trivett Global Atmosphere Watch Observatory
Alert, NU

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2175 on: October 23, 2019, 07:47:40 PM »
There is no question!  ;D

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2176 on: October 27, 2019, 06:17:18 AM »
The dancing floe got too enthusiastic, bumped into a rock wildly and shattered in pieces (GIF 2).

The question came up if the NS is frozen over by now. In addition to the DMI crop, i provide a RAMMB-SLIDER GIF showing tidal action still (skipped stills and cloudy frames).

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2177 on: October 29, 2019, 04:27:02 PM »
Hey Kevin, someone forgot to turn off the lights at your site. I can see it from here.  8)

GAWLab

  • New ice
  • Posts: 24
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 87
  • Likes Given: 22
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2178 on: October 29, 2019, 04:30:10 PM »
Hey Kevin, someone forgot to turn off the lights at your site. I can see it from here.  8)
Very cool!  You can clearly see the main station and the airfield (the two large spots close together), and the small spot down and to the left of them is our lab! :)

Where did you get that imagery from?
- Kevin
Operator, Dr. Neil Trivett Global Atmosphere Watch Observatory
Alert, NU


ArcticMelt2

  • Grease ice
  • Posts: 929
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 192
  • Likes Given: 37
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2180 on: October 29, 2019, 05:28:48 PM »
Yeah, very cool indeed. It's from NASA Worldview, Kevin.

It's amazing what you can see via satellite. We found the Oden via Sentinel. JayW recently spotted the Polarstern lights via RAMMB-SLIDER with the JPSS satellite.

Link >> https://worldview.earthdata.nasa.gov/?v=-354648.7354030085,-835142.1726658549,-162769.01034700847,-728372.445177855&p=arctic&t=2019-10-28-T20%3A00%3A00Z&l=VIIRS_SNPP_CorrectedReflectance_TrueColor(hidden),MODIS_Terra_CorrectedReflectance_TrueColor(hidden),MODIS_Aqua_CorrectedReflectance_TrueColor(hidden),Reference_Features(hidden),Reference_Labels,Graticule(hidden),VIIRS_SNPP_Thermal_Anomalies_375m_Day(hidden),MODIS_Aqua_Brightness_Temp_Band31_Day(hidden),AMSRU2_Sea_Ice_Brightness_Temp_89H(hidden),AMSRU2_Sea_Ice_Brightness_Temp_89V(hidden),VIIRS_SNPP_DayNightBand_ENCC,MODIS_Terra_Sea_Ice(hidden),Coastlines(hidden),MODIS_Aqua_Sea_Ice(hidden),AMSRU2_Sea_Ice_Concentration_12km(hidden),MODIS_Terra_Ice_Surface_Temp_Day(hidden),MODIS_Aqua_Ice_Surface_Temp_Day(hidden),SSMIS_Sea_Ice_Concentration(hidden),SSMIS_Sea_Ice_Concentration_Snow_Extent(hidden),VIIRS_SNPP_Brightness_Temp_BandI5_Night(hidden),VIIRS_SNPP_Brightness_Temp_BandI5_Day(hidden)

On your exiled in sight very many other polar stations - Eureka, Nord, on Svabland and many others. An excellent illustration of the fact that the Arctic is becoming more crowded even during the polar night.

Greedy multinational corporations are trying to overtake each other in the desire to stake out their right to extract huge amounts of minerals in the Arctic.

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2181 on: November 03, 2019, 10:40:47 AM »
It's Sunday. Good chances @blumenkraft posts GIFs.

We had some export last week. Given the strong southwards winds no surprise. The new ice in Kane is still so thin, the wind has no problem taking it.

There was no picture for the 26th for Kennedy and Lincoln. So i included the 25th even though that one was included in last weeks GIFs.

Click to play!
« Last Edit: November 03, 2019, 10:54:20 AM by blumenkraft »

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2182 on: November 03, 2019, 10:50:06 AM »
Bonus GIF!

The south part of the Kane Basin from 23.09.

Beware the file size, click to play.

JayW

  • Grease ice
  • Posts: 605
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 225
  • Likes Given: 280
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2183 on: November 03, 2019, 11:16:21 AM »
"To defy the laws of tradition, is a crusade only of the brave" - Les Claypool

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2184 on: November 03, 2019, 11:57:07 AM »
LOL, i never checked the other bands. Just assumed they were down because Day/Night is down. m)

Thanks for the hint, Jay.

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2185 on: November 03, 2019, 12:20:37 PM »
Testing other bands...

This is M15, saturation turned down, contrast turned high.

Enjoy this very long tidal.

Click to play.

uniquorn

  • Young ice
  • Posts: 2822
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 1285
  • Likes Given: 258
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2186 on: November 03, 2019, 11:45:21 PM »
No chance of blocking now, the ice is not thick and strong, and the "arch" can't freeze deeply into place. This usually happens in Jan-Feb, though Dec is possible too (maybe even Nov?)
Maybe not nov, though it's early days yet

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2187 on: November 05, 2019, 06:14:03 PM »
ITP116 headed towards Nares.

How awesome would that be, eh?  ;D




Shared Humanity

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2188 on: November 05, 2019, 09:31:08 PM »
Looks like fram

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2189 on: November 05, 2019, 09:52:42 PM »
What do you mean, SH?

nanning

  • Nilas ice
  • Posts: 2401
  • 0Kg CO₂, 37 KWh/wk,125L H₂O/wk, No offspring
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 304
  • Likes Given: 20397
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2190 on: November 05, 2019, 09:59:02 PM »
We had a provincial Frisian bus service once which was abbreviated FRAM. Lots of transport :).
"It is preoccupation with possessions, more than anything else, that prevents us from living freely and nobly" - Bertrand Russell
"It is preoccupation with what other people from your groups think of you, that prevents you from living freely and nobly" - Nanning
Why do you keep accumulating stuff?

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2191 on: November 10, 2019, 04:30:29 PM »
Lincoln becoming more 'static' now. Pieces are breaking out of an arch, getting sucked into the strait. As if it was winter...

There was a pretty constant northerly wind last week.

That huge part of new ice in Kane that broke loose the week before had only a short trip before the cold grabbed it again. Other parts made it into the Baffin Bay - the first considerable amounts this season.

Click to play

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2192 on: November 12, 2019, 06:52:22 PM »
There are harsh winds forecasted for Friday. Could blow quite some ice into Baffin Bay?

uniquorn

  • Young ice
  • Posts: 2822
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 1285
  • Likes Given: 258
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2193 on: November 13, 2019, 02:48:41 PM »
https://go.nasa.gov/2Xd9f3i , yesterday and today

uniquorn

  • Young ice
  • Posts: 2822
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 1285
  • Likes Given: 258
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2194 on: November 14, 2019, 12:40:58 PM »
Suomi NPP VIIRS Brightness Temperature imaging started in Sep2017.
https://go.nasa.gov/2CKFU6A , nov14, 2017-2019. click to run

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2195 on: November 14, 2019, 06:10:11 PM »


#hellyeah

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2196 on: November 15, 2019, 04:58:35 PM »
From today, the strait seems to behave winteresque.

GIF 1 >> As forecasted we are having strong winds ATM. Lincoln/Arch-ice moved quite remarkably today. Confinement of floes to the right side of the strait seems to establish - indicating a surface current (according to my pet theory (which belongs entirely to me)).

GIF 2 >> It looks to me as if the (first year) fast-ice in the north part of the Kane Basin has collapsed. I find this remarkable because this part froze early and i thought it should be frozen solid by now. (Or are those clouds?)

GIF 3 >> Big floes are now exported to the Baffin Bay.

(Skipped stills)


blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2197 on: November 15, 2019, 07:26:05 PM »
Nares had -ve temps recently BTW. (7day mean reanalysis)

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2198 on: November 16, 2019, 04:47:27 PM »
OK, interesting weather forecast for next week. It will not be windy at all, and rather cold.

Is there a current ATM? I guess we'll know when we still see export mid next week! :)

blumenkraft

  • Guest
Re: The Nares Strait thread
« Reply #2199 on: November 17, 2019, 07:26:46 AM »
Wow, a storm has blown into the other direction and took floes with it north. The strait looks very different today, no confinement to the Ellesmere side anymore. The arch in Lincoln is gone.