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SteveMDFP

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #450 on: August 23, 2018, 02:07:52 PM »

"Silicon Valley and the corporate media are far more effective in conjuring alternative realities than the chaotic Trump White House. Trump tells lies that are easily countered

This is not at all what I'm seeing in America.  Trump holds the "bully pulpit" of the White House, and his pronouncements inevitably carry great weight with vast swaths of the country, and even elements here on ASIF.

He claims elections have masses of fraudulent votes, and people believe him.  A lie believed.
He claims refugees from south of the border are "invading" and "infesting" the country, causing much crime.  A lie believed.
He claims the FBI and Mueller are partisan Democrats, corrupt and engaging in a witch hunt.  A lie believed.
He claims Russia hasn't meddled, or it may have been China, or others.  A lie believed.
He claims we need to place punitive tariffs on our allies because the US is being victimized in trade.  A lie believed.
He denounces long-time allies, Canada, France, Germany, UK, the EU as a whole and NATO as a whole, all as being against the US.  A lie believed.
He claims he's resolved the Korea crisis, even as NKorea advances its nuclear arms activities.  A lie believed.

He does this by repetition and simple emotive stereotypes.  For most of the public, this approach works and can't be effectively countered by dispassionate examination of facts and analysis.  He's honed the persuasion techniques of a narcissist over his whole life.  He knows on a gut level how to persuade--at least persuade those not of a skeptical mindset.

I try to keep one eye on the thinking of the rank-and-file Right.  Hard to get a picture outside of polling data, and obscured by pronouncements of the visible leaders of the Right.  The single best keyhole I've come across is at RedState.   A totally partisan right-wing website itself, it's commentating readership is limited to long-time conservative-leading regular posters, highly selected by having a limited number, getting in only after long waits on a waiting list.  So zero johnny-come-lately blowhards, paid trolls, unpaid trolls, or foreign agents in disguise.  None of these will wait months to get a chance to post a comment.  It's a more-thoughtful-than-average group of rather conservative-leaning Americans.

A year ago, I perused a wide number of comments on range of articles.  Widespread variety of opinions then on Trump and Trumpism.  Some lovers, some detractors, some thoughtful fact-based commentary.

It's all become a Trumpian echo chamber.  They all believe the demonstrable Trumpian lies.

Trump is at the "bully pulpit," he's using it aggressively, and the tactic is working.

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #451 on: August 23, 2018, 11:33:08 PM »
"bully pulpit"
hmmm shouldn't that read "bullshit pulpit"?

TerryM

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #452 on: August 24, 2018, 12:26:46 AM »
"bully pulpit"
hmmm shouldn't that read "bullshit pulpit"?
There was a time when we took pride in not stooping to 'their' level.
Terry

Martin Gisser

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #453 on: August 24, 2018, 01:35:59 AM »
"bully pulpit"
hmmm shouldn't that read "bullshit pulpit"?
There was a time when we took pride in not stooping to 'their' level.
Terry

https://press.princeton.edu/titles/7929.html
Quote
One of the most salient features of our culture is that there is so much bullshit. Everyone knows this. Each of us contributes his share. But we tend to take the situation for granted. Most people are rather confident of their ability to recognize bullshit and to avoid being taken in by it. So the phenomenon has not aroused much deliberate concern. We have no clear understanding of what bullshit is, why there is so much of it, or what functions it serves. And we lack a conscientiously developed appreciation of what it means to us. In other words, as Harry Frankfurt writes, "we have no theory."

Frankfurt, one of the world's most influential moral philosophers, attempts to build such a theory here. With his characteristic combination of philosophical acuity, psychological insight, and wry humor, Frankfurt proceeds by exploring how bullshit and the related concept of humbug are distinct from lying. He argues that bullshitters misrepresent themselves to their audience not as liars do, that is, by deliberately making false claims about what is true. In fact, bullshit need not be untrue at all.

Rather, bullshitters seek to convey a certain impression of themselves without being concerned about whether anything at all is true. They quietly change the rules governing their end of the conversation so that claims about truth and falsity are irrelevant. Frankfurt concludes that although bullshit can take many innocent forms, excessive indulgence in it can eventually undermine the practitioner's capacity to tell the truth in a way that lying does not. Liars at least acknowledge that it matters what is true. By virtue of this, Frankfurt writes, bullshit is a greater enemy of the truth than lies are.

Harry G. Frankfurt is Professor of Philosophy Emeritus at Princeton University. His books include The Reasons of Love (Princeton), Necessity, Volition, and Love, and The Importance of What We Care About.

mostly_lurking

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #454 on: August 24, 2018, 08:10:24 AM »
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/mollie-tibbetts-death-russia-bots-alliance-securing-democracy-trump-cohen-manafort-a8505241.html

"A network of Russian-linked Twitter accounts have been disseminating divisive content about Mollie Tibbetts' death in an apparent attempt to divert attention from explosive news surrounding Donald Trump and his former associates. "

Give me a break. It's like they think EVERY Trump supporter or conservative is a Russian bot....


also - not every thing is a conspiracy theory:


magnamentis

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #455 on: August 24, 2018, 04:35:51 PM »
Quote
Rather, bullshitters seek to convey a certain impression of themselves without being concerned about whether anything at all is true. They quietly change the rules governing their end of the conversation so that claims about truth and falsity are irrelevant. Frankfurt concludes that although bullshit can take many innocent forms, excessive indulgence in it can eventually undermine the practitioner's capacity to tell the truth in a way that lying does not.

An accurate description of Martin's comments @ASIF? Or Rob? Or Jimmy Dore?

nice to see a it of a wakeup around, leaning back and chuckling and without going into details, because there rarely is totally right and totally wrong, i enjoy the straight forward posts agains conformists and establishments which, no matter to which group they belong, are resonsible big part that we have to discuss all the things here.

if everyone would speak out his genuine point of view and act accordingly we would have much less problems that are gaining in magnitude.

since i'm not an illusionist i'm quite aware we can't stop the herd of sheeps running over the cliff but it's still good to be aware and keep to the edge to be able to move in more than one direction.

jacksmith4tx

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #456 on: August 24, 2018, 06:46:46 PM »
Let's all pause a pico-second to morn the passing of Robin Leach, host of the long running TV series "Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous". Leach was one of the key architects of a decades long propaganda campaign to brainwash the masses to worship wealth and decadence.
https://www.rawstory.com/2018/08/robin-leach-died-heres-clip-trump-talking-infant-daughters-breasts/
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sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #457 on: August 25, 2018, 09:01:20 AM »
Steppling at counterpunch on the fracture of polity in the USA:

"Papers like the East Village Other, the L.A. Free Press. Berkeley Barb, et al had importance. People were rejecting the idea of ruling class privilege. They also understood the ruling class were the real criminals. Today Google would just erase them. Now we get Rachel Maddow, Fox News and Jordan Peterson. Where once Robert Bly and Alan Ginsburg gave readings to protest the war, in trips they paid for themselves across the entire country. Today were have celebrity war pimps like Angelina Jolie and George Clooney."

" ... when a society confuses the mythic with the real, it is a sign of terminal sickness in that society. "

"Hating Trump has become a of secret handshake among liberals. A part of spiritual self improvement, right alongside Yoga classes and TM."

"For the liberal, the educated classes in America, the status quo is sacred. And they would rather have any version of Brave New World, than to contemplate actual radical change. You know where the most rabid bulging eye, popping veins, hatred of communism can be found? In white liberal America. And it was Malcolm X. who said “The white liberal is the worst enemy to America, and the worst enemy to the black man.” It is the new fall collection for American Exceptionalism."

"The homeless encampments around every city in America are the legacy of so called American Century. That is the end of the line for Western capital and rugged individualism. The post script to Manifest Destiny is a nation of absolute misery, over medicated, and trying hard to NOT see the misery around them. To not see their neighbors have moved….to the nearest homeless encampment. Not see that yet more record days of heat have arrived. Not see that everything is poisoned and wrapped in plastic anyway. Of polluted lakes and scorched earth. A nation of narcissism and despair in equal measures. But at least they can hate Trump together. In that sense the Anti-President is a gift."

Read the whole thing. He has no mercy:

https://www.counterpunch.org/2018/08/24/the-anti-president/

sidd

Neven

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #458 on: August 25, 2018, 11:02:24 AM »
"For the liberal, the educated classes in America, the status quo is sacred. And they would rather have any version of Brave New World, than to contemplate actual radical change."

True, unfortunately.
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Buddy

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #459 on: August 27, 2018, 08:35:19 PM »
Just a friendly reminder as to just how AWFUL FOX News is.  Remember this:

1). FOX is the channel who helped to lie FOR Trump, and helped to cover up his lies.  Donnie’s Chief Of Liars at FOX is Sean Hannity, who with a little luck, will get charged with obstruction of justice himself.

2). FOX is the channel who is in the back pocket of the NRA and who wants as many guns as possible.

3). FOX continues to deny global warming is real .... and they have lied for decades.

People don’t understand just HOW BAD FOX has been.  That is going to become clearer and clearer as the coming months pass by.

FOX (RT) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

TerryM

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #460 on: August 28, 2018, 12:45:29 AM »
I wondered which books the Nazi's were burning in those very well photographed bonfires.
It turns out that the 2 most popular authors keeping the home fires burning that May night were Karl Marx and Karl Kautsky. Kautsky was many things, but foremost he was a Marxist theoretician. A list of 4,000 titles were consigned to the pyres.


After the May 10 ceremonies a redo was called on June 21st for areas that had been rained out. After that German book burnings cooled off until 1946, when the Allied Occupation Forces drew up a list of some 30,000 titles to be "confiscated and destroyed". School books, poetry and artwork were included in this oft neglected incident.


When Facebook, Google or U Tube blocks or shuts down sites whose message they've deemed to be pernicious they're following the same old, if not honorable traditions, once rightfully castigated when the DSt (German Student Union) sought to protect their fellow German Citizens from the Fake News that those books might have contained.

Terry
Data according to Wikipedia

mostly_lurking

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #461 on: August 28, 2018, 03:39:22 PM »
Who was worse?

Buddy

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #462 on: August 29, 2018, 10:50:29 PM »
FOX News quoting the Daily Caller regarding the Chinese hacking into Hillary Clinton’s email server.  So I guess it wasn’t the infamous 400 lb guy after all.  So when is FOX going to get their info from Infowars?

Donnie is losing it BIGLY now.  Just waiting for his next mistake.  Fire Sessions?  Fire Rosenstein?  He’ll do something drastic and stupid ...... you know it’s coming.  It’s just a matter of time.
FOX (RT) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #463 on: August 30, 2018, 04:32:06 AM »
He's a liar. But we'll put him on anyhoo. Good for ratings.

(The article carefully doesn't mention some other liars and torturers like Brennan,Clapper,Rogers ...)

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/08/29/lanny-davis-reporters-media-anonymous-sources-michael-cohen-white-house-803920

sidd


mostly_lurking

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #464 on: August 30, 2018, 08:06:19 AM »

Neven

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #465 on: August 30, 2018, 10:54:41 AM »
McCain is a hero, Cohen said Trump knew about the infamous Trump Tower meeting, and now CNN comes with this:



Quote
The irony is that when CNN posts an article like this, they're actually sowing discord and disinformation in the United States. That's the irony. They're the ones actually pushing propaganda in a political way to deceive people and influence people in a dishonest way. This is disinformation.

Nutshell...
« Last Edit: August 30, 2018, 11:02:06 AM by Neven »
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Neven

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #466 on: August 30, 2018, 11:48:13 AM »
small extract from a long article by Dr. Joseph Dillard a psychotherapist

Our imprisonment by scripting

    "Most Americans have no idea that what we are fed by the news media is nothing more than a portrayal of what powerful corporations want us to believe, that what happens to pass as education is as often as not mere propaganda, that what we learn in church may have very little or nothing to do with the truth, that what our parents teach us may be nothing more than an accumulation of their own personal biases, no doubt a rather subtle modification of what they were taught by their parents. And through such a process, governments and nations around the world wield control as to what their citizens, believe, value, and do." -Doug Soderstrom

We grow up scripted into the role expectations of our families and cultures. We are saturated with the prevailing groupthink of our peers at school and at work. Power at all levels, by its nature, generates ideological narratives that manufacture our consent, and awareness of this process is generally understood as a transition into personal autonomy. The ascent from emotional, pre-rational childhood to objectification and reasoning can be viewed as a movement from internalized mass mind groupthink sleepwalking to rational discrimination based on what might be summarized as “Spockian” common sense.[5] Spock is an archetype of orange, mid-personal level, rationality. However, most orange rationality is in the service of vaguely perceived and largely misunderstood prepersonal beliefs, preferences, expectations, scripts, and emotions. We think we are at healthy orange when we are actually manufacturing our consent through the power of intellectual rationalization. While we have learned to use reason in its defense, our center of gravity remains emotional, enmeshed in cognitive distortions and biases.[6] We can see this occurring continuously in the “thinking” of others in the media and on blog posts, but we typically lack the objectivity to see it in ourselves. As we shall see, Wilber appears to be a victim of this common form of blindness, and if he is, you and I probably are as well.

Slaves to Groupthink
http://www.integralworld.net/dillard19.html

I'm re-reading Tolstoy's 'The Kingdom of God is Within You' this summer (yes, I know, Tolstoy is Russian, sorry) and it's in part about exactly this theme. Fascinating. I keep reading stuff in that book I would like to quote here, but my hands have started to hurt recently from typing, and so I try to give them a rest while on holiday. There's so much wisdom in that book, I could quote endlessly.

I said to my wife yesterday: I'm glad Tolstoy didn't live to see the 20th century, and how we're still in the middle of the same vicious cycle in 2018. Poor, brilliant guy.
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mostly_lurking

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #467 on: August 30, 2018, 12:55:19 PM »
McCain is a hero, Cohen said Trump knew about the infamous Trump Tower meeting, and now CNN comes with this:

...

Oh no! Jimmy called CNN fake news!
 ::)

Buddy

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #468 on: August 30, 2018, 02:46:00 PM »
Quote
"Most Americans have no idea that what we are fed by the news media is nothing more than a portrayal of what powerful corporations want us to believe

So ..... according to the above ..... in the US citizens believe what THE CORPORATIONS want you to believe.

But in Russia ..... citizens believe WHAT THE GOVERNMENT FUNDED RT AND TAAS WANT YOU TO BELIEVE.

Boy .... that's a tough choice.  Do I watch US television knowing that advertisers are trying to sell me products ..... OR ..... do I watch Russian government financed television where I would believe what the Russian government wants me to believe.

Choices .... choices ..... choices.  Boy ..... this is a tough one. ;)
FOX (RT) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

mostly_lurking

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #469 on: August 30, 2018, 03:05:51 PM »


Boy .... that's a tough choice.  Do I watch US television knowing that advertisers are trying to sell me products ..... OR ..... do I watch Russian government financed television where I would believe what the Russian government wants me to believe.

Choices .... choices ..... choices.  Boy ..... this is a tough one. ;)

You aren't that naive now, are you? This isn't about pushing products.

Buddy

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #470 on: August 30, 2018, 03:30:07 PM »
Ron Desantis ...... Republican candidate for Governor of Florida ..... appeared on FOX news

121 TIMES

since Ron started his campaign for governor.  And that is exactly what Donnie and Sean wanted.  Because the Florida governor's race is HUGE for Donnie.  If the Republicans don't win the Governor's race and Florida Attorney General race ...... small hands Donnie is going to be spending a LOT of times at "the big house."  And I'm NOT talking about Trump Tower.  :o  I think Donnie and Sean are more than a little worried.  They HAVE to get Republican's in office to protect them in Florida.  The state of New York is already going after Trump ...... the last thing he needs is for the state of Florida to go after him and his crooked operations out of Mar a Lago.

http://fortune.com/2018/08/29/fox-news-ron-desantis-ads/

Now you understand why I equate FOX and Russia's RT (or TAAS).  And that is EXACTLY what Trump wants.

You see .... FOX has NEVER been a news organization.  It has been propaganda from day 1, as designed by Roger Ailes.  A news organization has JOURNALISM ..... and JOURNALISM is a search for facts and the truth...... which is CLEARLY what FOX does NOT DO.

Whether you are talking about Trump, global warming, gun control, ..... pretty much ANYTHING, FOX is never looking for the truth.

As a FISCAL CONSERVATIVE (and an Independent) it REALLY irks me that FOX lies so much, and pretends to be fiscally conservative.  Last time I checked ..... the following things ARE NOT FISCALLY CONSERVATIVE:

1)  A tax cut, primarily for the very wealthy, that increases the national debt by more than 1 TRILLION DOLLARS.

2) Ignoring global warming, so that the cost to fix things INCREASES EACH YEAR.

3)  To keep allowing the proliferation of guns in the US which increase the cost of law enforcement, the cost of medical care, the cost of infrastructure to guard against everyone and their cat having a gun (schools and other public places).

4) To maintain the MOST EXPESNIVE HEALTHCARE SYSTEM IN THE WORLD ..... and still gets pretty crappy outcomes. 

FOX ..... and the Republican party ..... have sold the US citizens a lie.  And it is a lie from the lobbyists that support the above interests.

 

« Last Edit: August 30, 2018, 03:55:15 PM by Buddy »
FOX (RT) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

jacksmith4tx

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #471 on: August 30, 2018, 03:51:13 PM »
Outfoxed - by Brave New Films - Robert Greenwald

You can't say we weren't warned about this. This was the ten year anniversary retrospect.
https://youtu.be/_2i_HH54BPk?list=PL54FC814AE797FA21

The original was made in 2004. One of the best independent film makers out there.
https://www.bravenewfilms.org/

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sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #472 on: August 30, 2018, 09:32:12 PM »
Tolstoy was a large influence on Gandhi, too.

sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #473 on: September 03, 2018, 09:50:27 AM »
The British ambassador to the US tells reporters that Syria is about to gas her own citizens, then explains that she knows this because Russia has warned of a false flag, so the exact opposite must be true.

https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/uk-syrian-terrorists-cant-possibly-be-planning-chemical-weapons-false-flag-because-russia-said-7d749d76ea00

Terry

jacksmith4tx

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #474 on: September 04, 2018, 06:28:01 PM »
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com

When someone quotes or links to a news source on the web (not social media or blogs) I recommend checking their bias rating at the above website. They cover both US and international news sources. This is completely different than sites like Accuracy in Media (https://www.aim.org/) or Fairness & Accuracy In Reporting (http://fair.org/).
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sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #475 on: September 06, 2018, 06:16:17 AM »
Kids don't beleive the media either, but i don't think Trump has much to do with it. They grow up faster now and see thru the lies younger. I was watching this happen from the '80s and early '90s when i was much closer to the groves of academe.

https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2018/08/trump-has-changed-how-teens-view-the-news/568783/

sidd


jacksmith4tx

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #476 on: September 06, 2018, 09:11:17 AM »
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com

When someone quotes or links to a news source on the web (not social media or blogs) I recommend checking their bias rating at the above website. They cover both US and international news sources. This is completely different than sites like Accuracy in Media (https://www.aim.org/) or Fairness & Accuracy In Reporting (http://fair.org/).

OK. Looks to me they rank sites based on user feedback - per that panel that exists on every page.

But where do I go to check the bias level, the objectivity, and reliability of conclusion's accuracy of mediabiasfactcheck.com? :)
Good question. Did you try to give feedback? I didn't try it myself. Maybe you should do like Real Clear Politics does with polls and rank the different sites that claim to rank bias. FiveThirtyEight does something similar with their polling sources but with more input variables.
I noticed each ranked source includes who the owners are and where they appear to get their funding. Nice to know that at least.
Frankly we could do what they do with a good AI program.
https://techxplore.com/news/2018-09-neural-network-knowledgeable-snippets-documents.html
Science is a thought process, technology will change reality.

jacksmith4tx

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #477 on: September 06, 2018, 05:20:04 PM »

Good to see you're not obsessed with AI at least. But can it slice bread and fry an egg too? Probably can because it can do everything else perfectly. :)
Completely avoided the topic Lurk. I only threw in the AI bit because it gets under your skin.  :)
You shop around for news sources like a Catholic picks and choses their ethics and morality.
 
There are two technologies that will define humanity in the not to distant future, AI and genetic engineering. Here's some more technology that's going to change reality.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/minibrain-human-brain-cells-science-ethical-research-university-of-pennsylvania-a8521091.html

Quote
Today, organoids that resemble different regions of the human brain are routinely spun up from stem cells in large batches in laboratories around the world. Researchers have refined their recipes since the technique was first described five years ago, but the process is surprisingly hands-off: after a few nudges from scientists, stem cells grow into spheres with about a million neurons through a naturally occurring choreography that mirrors early brain development in the womb. At Day 100, Mr Qian's minibrains resemble a portion of the prenatal brain in the second trimester of pregnancy.

The scientist interviewed for this story assured us we are a long way from creating synthetic brains.
Maybe in the US but I see no such restrictions for China or Russia.
Quote
"People are more worried about if they reach a certain level - if it's really like a human brain. We're not there; we're very far from there," said Hongjun Song, who leads the laboratory at Penn's Perelman School of Medicine, where Mr Qian works. "But the question people ask is, 'Do they have consciousness?' The biggest problem I have so far is I think, as a field, we don't know: What is consciousness? What is pain?"
Science is a thought process, technology will change reality.

sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #478 on: September 06, 2018, 11:41:46 PM »
Well heloo there: support for stripping GooFaceTwit of Sec. 230 protection from an unusual source:

https://original.antiwar.com/justin/2018/09/05/the-hi-tech-threat/

sidd


sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #479 on: September 06, 2018, 11:44:25 PM »
Warning: Satire

This is an absolutely accurate send-up of media as it exists today: to sell you your five minutes of hate.

"This is truly the worst of both worlds. The only thing more painful than listening to a relative spew ignorant, hateful views is not being able to leverage those outbursts for online attention."

"This is a devastating loss for the #Resistance. With a slightly more bombastic uncle, Zack could totally expose American racism for what it is and get nonstop likes and faves in the process, or even a retweet from Rachel Maddow."

https://resistancehole.clickhole.com/heartbreaking-this-guy-s-uncle-is-racist-but-not-quite-1826327542

sidd

mostly_lurking

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #480 on: September 07, 2018, 10:44:47 AM »
Multiple sources used this headline:

Elizabeth Warren: Time to use 25th Amendment to remove Trump from office

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/09/06/politics/elizabeth-warren-25th-amendment/index.html

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/405447-warren-senior-admin-officials-should-invoke-25th-amendment-against-trump

Actually she didn't say that. She said " "If senior administration officials think the president of the United States is not able to do his job, then they should invoke the 25th Amendment,"

Not the same thing.


sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #481 on: September 08, 2018, 08:06:17 AM »
Re: media not " telling you anything about anything."

Mmm. The media are quite useful in one respect. Their narratives are what they want you to believe.  So, qui bono ? who will benefit if the story is sold ? that points directly at their paymasters.

For much the same reason, i used to read the opinion pages of, for example WSJ,NYT,WaPo and the like. Apart from the whole "fascination of the horrible" bit, but i digress.

sidd
 

bluesky

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #482 on: September 08, 2018, 08:11:39 AM »
BBC is finally taking action to improve communication on climate change, after repeatedly inviting vocal climato sceptics ( e.g. Nigal Lawson a former conservative  Chancellor of the Exchequer, who is heading a climato sceptics think tank and has direct vested interest in coal industry) to debate with climate scientists , for the so called "neutrality" !!!

https://www.carbonbrief.org/exclusive-bbc-issues-internal-guidance-on-how-to-report-climate-change

Martin Gisser

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #483 on: September 10, 2018, 09:52:35 PM »
Four Days in Occupied Western Sahara—A Rare Look Inside Africa’s Last Colony

https://www.democracynow.org/2018/8/31/four_days_in_occupied_western_sahara

This hasn't been shared enough.
If catastrophic climate change doesn't scare you enough, think about peak phosphorus, which will be a multiplier of calamity. We are running against several walls simultaneously. For the time being, industrial agriculture still can feed us - at the cost of the people of Western Sahara.

Klondike Kat

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #484 on: September 10, 2018, 09:59:44 PM »
Re: media not " telling you anything about anything."

Mmm. The media are quite useful in one respect. Their narratives are what they want you to believe.  So, qui bono ? who will benefit if the story is sold ? that points directly at their paymasters.

For much the same reason, i used to read the opinion pages of, for example WSJ,NYT,WaPo and the like. Apart from the whole "fascination of the horrible" bit, but i digress.

sidd

I would agree.  The media is becoming less objective all the time.  Instead, trying to inject their own opinions and biases into just about everything.

sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #485 on: September 11, 2018, 09:04:12 PM »
Well, well, well. Google execs pushed for Latino voter turnout. Alas, heartbreak ensued when a third of them voted for Trump. And more damningly, Google was aware that the of the partisanship of the effort.

"openly admitting the entire effort to boost Latino turnout using Google products with official company resources was to elect Clinton "

"I sent Philipp a note yesterday to thank him because he and others voiced their support for this too, and we greatly appreciate it. Even Sundar gave the effort a shout out and a comment in Spanish, which was really special"

 “[Google] did not deny that the email was real or that it showed a clear political preference.”

“Ultimately, after all was said and done, the Latino community did come out to vote, and completely surprised us,” Murillo wrote. “We never anticipated that 29% of Latinos would vote for Trump."

“On personal note, we really thought we had shown up to demonstrate our political power against a candidate "

“But then reality set in. "

So sad.

https://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2018/09/10/silent-donation-corporate-emails-reveal-google-executives-efforts-to-swing-election-to-hillary-clinton-with-latino-outreach-campaign/

https://www.breitbart.com/video/2018/09/10/carlson-on-silent-donation-what-could-google-be-doing-this-election-cycle-to-support-its-preferred-candidates-what-could-they-do-in-2020/

sidd
« Last Edit: September 12, 2018, 07:39:16 AM by sidd »

TerryM

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #486 on: September 12, 2018, 01:40:39 AM »
sidd
I assume the machinery is still in place to Nationalize a corporation who has proven itself to be a pariah.


Google, IIRC is an International Corporation, (something to do with how their taxes are calculated). We apparently have an International Corporation admitting to many of the same charges that Mueller has spent Million$ trying to pin on other International Corporations.


Lock up the board of directors, slap Hillary and the DNC firmly on the wrist, Nationalize Google, declare victory & cast a jaundiced eye towards Facebook. 8)
Terry

sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #487 on: September 12, 2018, 06:27:53 AM »
Re: nationalization of goofacetwit, perhaps amazon

I do not trust the government with the power. Rather than nationalization, i think antitrust breakup, sherman act style. But not a conventional breakup like the ATT in the 1980s. (That's quite instructive, but not directly relevant)

Background:

Goofacetwit makes money by selling ads. How do they get those ads get in your face ? That's a long story.

Let's say, you are a typical person. You look at a typical site on your device of choice. There are around ten ad positions on the page displayed. Each ad in those ad positions has won an auction, before the page displays.

What is the auction based on ? You. The advertiser and the auctioneer have unnervingly close guesses as to your hat size and how long your dick is. (Apologies to the ladies.)

Time was that advertisers would just use the goofacetwit auction platforms. Not any more. They dont trust each other anymore. The ad placement has run thru two, three more internal auctions in shadow markets before it even gets to goofacetwit. Or amazon. For each ad placement position on the page you are looking at. And at the end of the line, the ad inflicts itself on your eyeballs.

Ain't technology wonderful ?

So how to fix ?

1)Privacy laws with teeth and effective enforcement

2)Split ad auctions away from goofacetwit and have the auctions run as a regulated utility, hiding viewer information from advertisers and goofacetwit. (This can actually be done in the context of differential privacy, i have been working on this for a couple years)

Do i think this will happen ? Perhaps in the EU, but not for a long time in the USA, where the legislators are bought and sold by the very entities we are trying to protect against. And that won't stop until Citizen's United and the Buckley decision are overturned.

Realistically in the USA, legislative and enforcement change will not happen until system shock. In the meantime, all i can say is, mask yourself. Use ad blockers. Disable scripting. Use VPNs. What the hell, use lynx in a text terminal. For the truly paranoid, there are further measures. 

But. remember, it ain't paranoia if they really are watching you.

sidd

jacksmith4tx

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #488 on: September 12, 2018, 07:08:08 AM »
Re: nationalization of goofacetwit, perhaps amazon

I do not trust the government with the power. Rather than nationalization, i think antitrust breakup, sherman act style. But not a conventional breakup like the ATT in the 1980s. (That's quite instructive, but not directly relevant)

Background:

Goofacetwit makes money by selling ads. How do they get those ads get in your face ? That's a long story.

Let's say, you are a typical person. You look at a typical site on your device of choice. There are around ten ad positions on the page displayed. Each ad in those ad positions has won an auction, before the page displays.

What is the auction based on ? You. The advertiser and the auctioneer have unnervingly close guesses as to your hat size and how long your dick is. (Apologies to the ladies.)

Time was that advertisers would just use the goofacetwit auction platforms. Not any more. They dont trust each other anymore. The ad placement has run thru two, three more internal auctions in shadow markets before it even gets to goofacetwit. Or amazon. For each ad placement position on the page you are looking at. And at the end of the line, the ad inflicts itself on your eyeballs.

Ain't technology wonderful ?

So how to fix ?

1)Privacy laws with teeth and effective enforcement

2)Split ad auctions away from goofacetwit and have the auctions run as a regulated utility, hiding viewer information from advertisers and goofacetwit. (This can actually be done in the context of differential privacy, i have been working on this for a couple years)

Do i think this will happen ? Perhaps in the EU, but not for a long time in the USA, where the legislators are bought and sold by the very entities we are trying to protect against. And that won't stop until Citizen's United and the Buckley decision are overturned.

Realistically in the USA, legislative and enforcement change will not happen until system shock. In the meantime, all i can say is, mask yourself. Use ad blockers. Disable scripting. Use VPNs. What the hell, use lynx in a text terminal. For the truly paranoid, there are further measures. 

But. remember, it ain't paranoia if they really are watching you.

sidd

You might also enjoy:
Schneier on Security https://www.schneier.com/
Krebs on Security https://krebsonsecurity.com/
Just Security https://www.justsecurity.org/

At some point we may need to encrypt our own DNA as a hash key.
Science is a thought process, technology will change reality.

TerryM

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #489 on: September 12, 2018, 09:05:48 PM »
Goofacetwit, it has such a nice feel as it rolls off the tongue. :P


I'm afraid that since the Citizens United ruling we'll find little appetite in Washington to tear up the huge donors job providers. Goofacetwit can't just provide the cash to get a properly submissive politician elected, goofacetwit can provide the media, the messaging, even do the research to assure that the correct messaging is sent out.


With goofacetwit polishing our message, even as it censors our opponents, we may in a very few years find that elections are expensive, unnecessary, terribly old fashioned (some still require slips of paper), and down right un-American!
The Perfidious Brits had elections, and we fought to get out from under the British System of Government.


Taxation and Representation have been working together for too long.
Down with Taxation!
Down with Representation!


sarc/
Terry ;D

jacksmith4tx

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #490 on: September 12, 2018, 10:27:21 PM »
Terry,
You remind me of someone...
In another time and another place you could have been this guy:

"I am an individualist because I am an anarchist. I am an anarchist because I am a nihilist.
I call myself a nihilist because I know that nihilism means negation.
Negation of every society, of every cult, of every rule and of every religion.
I do not renounce life, I exalt and sing it." - Renzo Novatore (b1890-d1922)

Science is a thought process, technology will change reality.

sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #491 on: September 12, 2018, 11:33:46 PM »
"Syrian news services in the US have been censored, but you can still get streaming jihadist propaganda from al Qaeda-controlled Idlib Province"

https://blackagendareport.com/first-they-came-alex-jones-then-rt-and-syrian-tv

sidd

TerryM

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #492 on: September 13, 2018, 01:58:57 AM »
Jack
I could never be a nihilist.
Everyone needs to believe in something
I believe I'll have another Creme Brulee


With apologizes to "America's Greatest Philosopher". according to Stalin
Terry

jacksmith4tx

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #493 on: September 13, 2018, 05:38:04 AM »
One of my old favorite sites that track the US war machine:
https://airwars.org/

Through July 2018:

29,948 Coalition strikes
14,316 Strikes in Iraq
15,632 Strikes in Syria
1,494 Days of campaign
6,575 Minimum civilians estimated killed by Coalition
108,462 Airdropped bombs and missiles
Science is a thought process, technology will change reality.

SteveMDFP

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #494 on: September 13, 2018, 07:13:01 PM »
Some on this forum have taken a stance that censorship by GooFaceTwit is reprehensible, no matter how well-intentioned, even that prohibiting hate speech is counter-productive to progressive aims.

Five years ago, I'd have agreed with this Jeffersonian ideal.  But my sense is that the democratization of publishing has had a very real, shocking effect of amplifying hate, prejudice, bigotry, and even violence.  Social media has become a recruiting tool for humanity's worst instincts.  I no longer believe that social media platforms, on the whole, are a positive development for humanity.

I do share skepticism of the idea that social media should be policed by their corporate owners.  Some independent mechanisms may be preferable, but none are in place.

I base much of the above on a disturbing report from the BBC.  In Myanmar/Burma, long-simmering ethnic tensions have recently exploded into outright genocide against the Rohingya.  The trigger for ethnic cleansing and mass killing?  Facebook.  Just Facebook, alone:

Did Facebook Fuel Hate in Myanmar?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/play/w3csws73


Neven

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #495 on: September 15, 2018, 06:33:52 PM »
Bad lie-by-omission journalism:

Il faut comparer, comparer, comparer, et cultiver notre jardin

Rob Dekker

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #496 on: September 16, 2018, 08:52:23 AM »
Bad lie-by-omission journalism:

True. The influence of climate change on hurricanes is not reported about enough.
But the overview (at 2:11) shows that 4 networks did reasonably well :
- CNN
- the Washington Post
- the Houston Chronicle and
- the New York Times
This is our planet. This is our time.
Let's not waste either.

jacksmith4tx

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #497 on: September 19, 2018, 06:12:00 PM »
Maybe there is another way to get good journalism?
https://civil.co/
Civil is building the new economy for journalism.
"We're a fast-growing community of top journalists and technologists, working together to build a home for trustworthy, sustainable journalism.

We built our careers at places like The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, BBC, The Guardian, El Pais, Politico, NPR, The Atlantic, The New Republic, New York Magazine, New York Daily News, and DNAinfo."


Investigative Journalism runs on Civil
Science is a thought process, technology will change reality.

sidd

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #498 on: September 19, 2018, 10:25:28 PM »
Thoughtful attempt at better newsmedia:

"The news is: what’s not happening

When you put all this together, it means the news actually fails to deliver on its single biggest promise: to tell us what’s happening in the world. People who follow the news mostly know what doesn’t happen. It portrays the world to us as a never ending string of sensational, unusual, terrible, rapidly forgotten events. In contrast to fake news, which is misleading because it’s simply untrue, real news misleads us in a more subtle and fundamental way. It gives us a deeply skewed view of probability, history, progress, development, and relevance."

"At De Correspondent in the Netherlands, we try to tell precisely those stories that aren’t news, but news-worthy nevertheless. Or, as we often say, that reveal not the weather but the climate ..."

" ... asking ourselves “What are we going to do with this news?” but by asking “What do we have to add to this news that isn’t available anywhere else?” If the answer is “nothing,” then we won’t report on even the most major of news events"

Nice article.

https://medium.com/de-correspondent/the-problem-with-real-news-and-what-we-can-do-about-it-f29aca95c2ea

sidd

TerryM

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Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« Reply #499 on: September 20, 2018, 12:41:17 AM »
There was a study a few decades ago that found that the more time people spent watching Fox News, the less well informed they were.
I wonder how all of the MSM news viewers would fare if the test was redone today. 8)
Terry