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gerontocrat

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #50 on: April 11, 2019, 09:55:44 AM »

The Age of Enlightenment rolls on like a glacier removing all before it. :)
The glaciers are melting.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
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b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #51 on: April 11, 2019, 10:03:00 AM »

The Age of Enlightenment rolls on like a glacier removing all before it. :)
The glaciers are melting.

Stop punching my belly Gerontocrat! ;)

Tom_Mazanec

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #52 on: April 11, 2019, 01:06:51 PM »
I'm not bothered by Tasmania's law you mention, Lurk.
I am bothered by America allowing killing about a million people a year just because they are less than nine months old and inconvenient.
SHARKS (CROSSED OUT) MONGEESE (SIC) WITH FRICKIN LASER BEAMS ATTACHED TO THEIR HEADS

Tor Bejnar

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #53 on: April 11, 2019, 04:39:58 PM »
Quote
The "Abolition of Abortion in Texas Act" would classify abortion as murder "regardless of any contrary federal law, executive order, or court decision,"
[emphasis added]
Pretty brazen, isn't it, for a law (an intended law at this point) to declare courts do not have the power to determine constitutionality?   At least this part of the Act would surely be determined unconstitutional.  Those three words makes me think the whole purpose of the drafted Act is to score political points and not get enacted.

Also, as many fertilized eggs die young naturally, would this be manslaughter? ("You know, Your Honor, she sneezed, and should be held responsible for her actions.")
Quote
… researchers have estimated that 40 to 65 percent of conceptions end in miscarriages. And more than half of those occur so early that pregnancy is not even suspected yet (miscarriages that happen in the first few weeks of pregnancy are called chemical pregnancies or blighted ovums — meaning that the fertilized egg failed to implant or develop for unknown reasons).
Arctic ice is healthy for children and other living things.

sidd

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #54 on: April 12, 2019, 02:23:18 AM »
America's Finest News Source:  Mike Pence, Pete Buttigieg Locked In Battle Of Prayers

"a lightning bolt blasted off the top of the Washington Monument"

"causing the sky to turn black, the water in the Reflecting Pool to part ... the temperature dropped and the earth burst open below them, witnesses confirmed that Buttigieg’s eyes turned red ..."

"Pence and Buttigieg reportedly fused into a single, blindingly white light as countless angels swirled around them"

https://politics.theonion.com/lightning-bolt-blasts-washington-monument-as-mike-pence-1833978821

sidd

sidd

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #55 on: April 12, 2019, 06:37:08 AM »
Right on cue: Ohio gov DeWine signs nations most restrictive abortion law

"ban abortions after a fetal heartbeat is detected and prosecute doctors who perform them anyway. A fetal heartbeat can be detected as early as six weeks into a woman's pregnancy, which can be before a woman finds out she's pregnant."

"an exception to save the life of the woman but no exception for rape or incest "

Even Kasich wouldn't: "Former Gov. John Kasich vetoed the abortion ban twice"

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2019/04/11/ohio-governor-expected-sign-heartbeat-abortion-bill/3437747002/

DeWine never met a woman's body he didn't wanna control. I been watching him forawhile, there were disturbing signs pretty early in his career.

This will go to the Supremes, lets see if Roe vs Wade stands. A lot of women whom I know seriously think it might be overturned. The younger ones are considering emigration, the older are advising their daughters to do so.

sidd

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #56 on: April 12, 2019, 09:12:19 AM »
A video every American should watch!

The Founding Fathers Were Progressive


Lurk

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #57 on: April 12, 2019, 10:15:32 AM »
So I can expect Rachel Maddow to presenting the same kind of historical information sometime soon, and cheering on AOC, Sanders and Gabbard. LOL

OK may I say this is all old news, and therein lays the problem doesn't it. For Adam Smith the libertarian neo-liberal hero was also a rabid Progressive most keen on appropriate Regulation in economic life, progressive taxation, social goods, and income / wealth equality sharing the fruits of the land of the nation as far is feasible by Principle.

His so-called clarion cry of "the invisible hand of the market" was used twice in all his writings, and that's it. The key being "AS IF" meaning there really is no invisible hand it all depends on how the SYSTEM is constructed, and then fair and equitable markets, accessible by all people and not only the few, could operate "as if" there was this invisible hand at work ... even though there isn't!!! Those "free markets" were in fact being designed on Principles with particular INTENT to achieve a Just Ends, and not the winner take all edict! 

Good luck educating the neo-liberal cultists resident here their whole Faith is founded upon lies and manipulations. Money alone can afford high levels of Propaganda to win the day. :)

AS an add-on people should be mindful of two things. Most of the founding fathers and early politicians, the best among them, were first and foremost Freemasons .. and not fundamentalist Christians. The Constitution etc was primarily based on sound centuries old universal Freemason Principles - it's as clear as day. They played the long game and were pragmatic folks. But do not tell the Baptists that!

Secondly, it;s strangely hypocritical of all Americans and their politicians who once illegally engaging in War Crimes, would then demand that before handing over Iraq to her people that they must first of all write a new Democratic Constitution following the principles of the Rule of Law and the Separation of Powers and then demand have it Voted upon by all the people of age in the country.

It's odd because at no time has their been held a national Vote by the People on the US Constitution. Not once, not ever.

Furthermore not once has there been a popular Vote by the People to Amend said Constitution. 

eg the American people did NOT vote to end slavery by validating the 16th Amendment. The Politicians did that, not the People en mass by a national Majority of people and a Majority of States. No one Voted to limit Presidential terms to two. An egregious imposition upon political freedom, an annulment of basic Human Rights, plus anti-democratic and prima facie Unconstitutional in and of itself.

Ah, but the poor people have been conned yet again and believe this is brilliant, so "rational and ethical and just" when it is the complete opposite of those things.

So given the American people have never not once ever been able to Vote for or against their Constitution and it's Amendments, then how on earth can they dare claim to be a Government of The People, for the People and by the People?

When almost every person in every other nation on this earth posses such rights and privileges?

The existing Constitution and it's system of Governance and Electoral matters enshrined in the Constitution are one of the key reasons why America is a shit show today.

It's not going to improve. Even if a Bernie sanders became President it will not and cannot improve nor change course. Despite a few exceptions the entire nation is both ignorant and asleep. For that is the only place where one can see the American Dream.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2019, 10:57:41 AM by Lurk »
“We have time now, ten years, perhaps twenty years, to do something about it. The longer we leave it the more difficult it is going to be and if we leave it too long… the natural system will collapse.”
Sir David Attenborough - April 2019

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #58 on: April 12, 2019, 10:23:30 AM »
Adam Smith the libertarian neo-liberal hero was also a rapid Progressive

Correct!

What tells us that? Neo-liberals don't read books (well at least not Wealth of Nations). If they would they'd know about this fact.

gerontocrat

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #59 on: April 12, 2019, 11:38:18 AM »
I was taught that the Founding Fathers when considering the Constitution considered the role of Monarchs and the role of religion in propping up Monarchies, especially the final years of the Monarchy and the influence of the Catholic hierarchy in France before the French Revolution.
(The argument with perfidious Albion and King George was very much more about how the colonists were denied the basic liberties enjoyed by the average Brit in the UK). So having booted out the Brits they were looking for safeguards to prevent the future rise of either a secular or religious dictatorship.

Unfortunately, Congress has given away vast powers to the Executive, and religion has crept** into the infrastructure, to the extent that the Texas legislature is now considering a bill to make abortion the crime of homicide. And, of course, "the invisible hand of the free market" largely determines who is elected, who is not, who is bought and who is sold. (This includes senior officials - even Eisenhower warned against the military-industrial complex.)

The UK will do its best to catch up - though it will be a really cheap and nasty version.

When I was a young man, the USA was the place I wanted to be, Vietnam, Civil Rights and all. Now ?  No, thankyou.
_________________________________________________________________
**"In God We Trust" first appeared on the two-cent piece in 1864 and has appeared on paper currency since 1957. A law passed in a Joint Resolution by the 84th Congress (P.L. 84-140) and approved by President Dwight Eisenhower on July 30, 1956, declared "In God We Trust" must appear on American currency.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2019, 11:45:05 AM by gerontocrat »
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
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Klondike Kat

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #60 on: April 12, 2019, 01:52:57 PM »




... the word God doesn't appear
anywhere in the US Constitution and
the only references to religion in the
Constitution are actually to limit
religions influence on the government.


The First Amendment as many of you know
guarantees that quote "Congress shall
make no law respecting an establishment
of religion or prohibiting the free exercise
thereof."


Not quite.  It was intended to prevent the government from imposing any particular religious belief on the people.  It would be virtually impossible to remove religious influences completely, because many of those in power have certain beliefs that influence their thinking.  The central idea was not to stem these ideas, but rather to prevent one person's beliefs from becoming the law of the land (i.e. many European nations).  The idea was to allow any individual to practice their own religion freely, within repercussion from the state.  The separation, which Thomas Jefferson stated, was intended to proceed in one direction (from the central government to the people).  The people would always be able to mold the government, as long as they refrained from imposing certain beliefs on others.  Consequently, any religious figure could seek public office.  There is no litmus test, except that imposed by the voters. 

Regarding the founding fathers, several were deists.  However, most were Christian.  Very few were Catholic or Baptist.  Indeed, it was the Baptists who prompted Jefferson to make his famous declaration about the separation, as they feared that their religion would be discriminated against in the nearly formed nation. 

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #61 on: April 12, 2019, 02:16:58 PM »

prevent the government from imposing any particular religious belief
vs.
are actually to limit religious influence on the government

I don't follow Kat. What's the difference? IMHO those both describe the word 'secularism'.

I mean, a religious politician can indeed propose a secular law. It might be influenced by religious beliefs, but if it's outcome is secular, i don't see how they contradict.

For example, outlawing thievery is stated in the Bible, but it 's also clearly a result of the categoric imperative.

Of course, once you have freedom of religion, you will also have religious people in the government.

Lurk

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #62 on: April 12, 2019, 03:27:30 PM »




... the word God doesn't appear
anywhere in the US Constitution and
the only references to religion in the
Constitution are actually to limit
religions influence on the government.


The First Amendment as many of you know
guarantees that quote "Congress shall
make no law respecting an establishment
of religion or prohibiting the free exercise
thereof."


Not quite.  It was intended to prevent the government from imposing any particular religious belief on the people.  [...]   The idea was to allow any individual to practice their own religion freely, within repercussion from the state.   

Yes that's true, it's the common interpretation given for the amendment. The idea of an "all powerful government" not being able to interfere in an individuals religious rights/freedom (to believe in anything they want iow).

Still there are limits on that too, such a multiple wives, the obvious ones where the right to "practice" is limited. 

However what I think (maybe others can express it better?) is there is a two-edged sword in that Law/amendment less highlighted.

It means in a situation where (under the separation of powers) the Executive govt (president etc) and the Congress (house of the people and house of the elites) and then the Judiciary - a majority of all of them aligned to a particular faith/religion could not and can not combine by collusion (including from pressure from outside religious bodies eg the Vatican)  to take over the reigns of Power which would place them in a position to "take total control of the Government" and the Lawmaking to their own ends and according to their belief system.

So should it happen they did have a majority across the board, they will still be powerless to have pass laws which would place them in a position of supreme power - they cannot preclude people of other religions from working in the Government /agencies, nor pass laws which prejudiced against others not of their own religion and so on.

From this perspective the amendment is a limitation of the power of Religions themselves to hijack the powers of Government to their own ends... or to create the kid of religious tyranny that was extant in Europe at those times, and ever since all over the world.

As much as it is one that precludes the Govt from defining what is or is not an "acceptable religion" or beliefs that can be practised in the first place.

There's two ends of the same stick, may be a fair analogy. Best I can put it, at least.
“We have time now, ten years, perhaps twenty years, to do something about it. The longer we leave it the more difficult it is going to be and if we leave it too long… the natural system will collapse.”
Sir David Attenborough - April 2019

Klondike Kat

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #63 on: April 12, 2019, 03:38:52 PM »

prevent the government from imposing any particular religious belief
vs.
are actually to limit religious influence on the government

I don't follow Kat. What's the difference? IMHO those both describe the word 'secularism'.

I mean, a religious politician can indeed propose a secular law. It might be influenced by religious beliefs, but if it's outcome is secular, i don't see how they contradict.

For example, outlawing thievery is stated in the Bible, but it 's also clearly a result of the categoric imperative.

Of course, once you have freedom of religion, you will also have religious people in the government.

It is not a matter of contradiction.  Rather, the wall of separation is one way, and rather explicit.  Congress shall make no law ...  Throughout the years, many people have tried to expand this to all other areas of government.  Sometimes they have been successful, other times not.   It depends on how the courts feel at the time.


Lurk

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #64 on: April 14, 2019, 03:06:05 PM »
There's no room for racism or classism in these matters that can lead to a good outcome. Peace must be born of Justice. Justice can only come by true Fraternity, in a broad sense of Brotherhood. Where my country is the world; and my fellow citizens are all humankind.

Enlightened souls have long been calling to remove the causes of War; all selfish seeking; all aggression by any nation upon the rights of others must cease. Peace can only come from the growth of wisdom, by enlightenment in the foundation principles of justice, love and truth.
“We have time now, ten years, perhaps twenty years, to do something about it. The longer we leave it the more difficult it is going to be and if we leave it too long… the natural system will collapse.”
Sir David Attenborough - April 2019

Lurk

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #65 on: April 15, 2019, 08:41:26 AM »
I had a funny thought. Could what this story reports on be considered the British Labour Party as an external power trying to interfere in US Politics and the 2020 elections? :)

---

The Nation
Quote
two British economists—Mathew Lawrence and James Meadway—met with a gaggle of Democratic congressional aides to outline the elements of British Labour Party leader Jeremy Corbyn’s evolving economic policy.

The gathering, co-sponsored by the Congressional Progressive Caucus Center and the Democracy Collaborative, a Washington-based research institute, is one of many exchanges across the Atlantic between progressive thinkers, legislators, and activists who are sharing ideas and strategies about forging a new era of reform.

In Britain, Jeremy Corbyn—a British version of Bernie Sanders, in that he was dismissed for years as a cranky radical while acting as a consistent critic of New Labour’s move to the right—could well lead the party to victory in the next election. The ruling Tory Party is disintegrating in the face of Brexit.

In the United States, Bernie Sanders’s stunning primary run in 2016 and his current momentum, along with Senator Elizabeth Warren’s imprint on the early Democratic “ideas primary,” have driven the Democratic debate to the left. The coming British and US elections could mark not simply a change of the party in power, but the end of the 40-year conservative era and the launch of a new reform era.

The historic potential of this transformation can be seen by looking at history. In 1979–80, Margaret Thatcher and Ronald Reagan—two movement conservatives deemed far too extreme by the established consensus—were elected within a year of each another. Both consciously set out to end the postwar liberal era and launched their countries into four decades of conservative dominance.

In the 1990s, Bill Clinton and Tony Blair came into power within a few years of one another. Clinton’s New Democrats and Blair’s New Labour both pushed their parties to tack to prevailing conservative winds. Both proclaimed a new “Third Way” (ignoring the reality that social democracy was the original third way between communism and capitalism). Both helped consolidate a global economic order designed by, for, and of the multinationals.

Now, a fundamental reordering could again be the result of parallel elections on either side of the Atlantic Ocean. Britain and the United States suffer many of the same maladies: savage inequality, a political economy that does not work for most people, devastation of manufacturing sectors, and a stark contrast between the financial center and the provinces.

There is also a corporate culture in both countries dominated by finance, shareholder interests, and characterized by short-term, predatory plunder

https://www.thenation.com/article/bernie-sanders-and-jeremy-corbyn-might-create-a-revolution/
“We have time now, ten years, perhaps twenty years, to do something about it. The longer we leave it the more difficult it is going to be and if we leave it too long… the natural system will collapse.”
Sir David Attenborough - April 2019

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #66 on: April 15, 2019, 10:58:21 AM »
I had a funny thought.

Not so funny at all. Americans are made believe the Russian interference in the 2016 US elections was something extraordinary. In fact, it's the most normal thing in the world. It has happened all the time throughout history.

Let's look into the history books and see what Trump did to support Netanyahu for example. Oh wait, this is not yet printed. But the internet has it.

sidd

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #67 on: April 15, 2019, 11:50:40 PM »
Trump outraises everybody:

"raised more than $30 million in the first quarter of 2019, edging out his top two Democratic rivals combined"

" nearly 99% of its donations were of $200 or less, with an average donation of $34.26."

"Together, the Trump entities have raised a combined $165.5 million "

"more than 1 million new online donors since Trump's inauguration"

https://news.yahoo.com/apnewsbreak-trump-campaign-report-raising-30-million-230159575--election.html

sidd

Neven

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #68 on: April 16, 2019, 12:04:35 AM »
My goodness, is this real or fake news?
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bbr2314

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #69 on: April 16, 2019, 12:45:22 AM »
My goodness, is this real or fake news?
Unless the stock market crashes he is going to win easily in 2020 (IMO). The perceived state of the economy is literally all that matters.

If it crashes, Buttigieg could win, and handily.

Klondike Kat

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #70 on: April 16, 2019, 12:55:11 AM »
My goodness, is this real or fake news?
Unless the stock market crashes he is going to win easily in 2020 (IMO). The perceived state of the economy is literally all that matters.

If it crashes, Buttigieg could win, and handily.

I fear you are correct.  Biden probably has the best chance to dethrone him, but many in the party are hell bent on stopping him.

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #71 on: April 16, 2019, 08:20:16 AM »
This Emerson poll paints a different picture.

Bernie Sanders Pulling Ahead 2020 Democratic Primary Poll Nationally - Pete Buttigieg Surging


b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #72 on: April 16, 2019, 08:48:58 AM »
Bret Baier just polled the Bernie Town Hall audience who would be willing to switch to #MedicareForAll. It backfired spectacularly.

Link >> https://twitter.com/JordanUhl/status/1117924843746361345

sidd

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #73 on: April 16, 2019, 10:10:05 AM »
Well, hello there: repub primary challenge for trump

"Former Massachusetts Governor Bill Weld has become the first Republican to challenge Mr Trump in 2020."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-47943555

I don't think the guy has a chance, Kasich had a better one but he already disclaimed.

sidd

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #74 on: April 16, 2019, 12:40:50 PM »
 :)

Klondike Kat

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #75 on: April 16, 2019, 02:21:08 PM »
This Emerson poll paints a different picture.


The Emerson poll is the one outlier; it consistently has Sanders outperforming Biden.  The Morning consult pols over the past month have Biden leading by 8-10 pts.  CNN and Fox News both had Biden ahead by 8.  Quinnipiac showed a 10 pt Biden advantage.  The recent Hill/Harris poll came with the biggest lead for Biden at 17!  All in all, Biden is still the front runner.

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #76 on: April 16, 2019, 02:29:13 PM »
Kat, do you happen to know the FoxNews numbers on Biden/Trump?

(if they exist that is, couldn't find this poll)

sidd

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #77 on: April 16, 2019, 11:13:22 PM »
Sanders town hall on Fox: audience cheers for sanders health plan

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/bernie-sanders-takes-stage-at-fox-news-town-hall-after-emerging-as-apparent-dem-frontrunner

youtube:





Well, well, well. Into the lions den, but the lions were pussycats. The democrats attack him worse than fox does.

sidd
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 11:29:05 PM by sidd »

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« Last Edit: April 17, 2019, 01:40:18 PM by Tom_Mazanec »
SHARKS (CROSSED OUT) MONGEESE (SIC) WITH FRICKIN LASER BEAMS ATTACHED TO THEIR HEADS

Klondike Kat

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #79 on: April 17, 2019, 02:26:05 PM »
Kat, do you happen to know the FoxNews numbers on Biden/Trump?

(if they exist that is, couldn't find this poll)

Yes.  Follow this link:

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fox-news-poll-biden-sanders-top-democratic-preference

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #80 on: April 17, 2019, 02:59:00 PM »
...this link:

Thank you Kat.

Quote
Sanders has a 3-point edge over the president (44-41 percent), but Biden performs best, topping Trump by 7 points (47-40 percent).

If only Biden was running.

Why isn't he (so far) though? Any theories?

Klondike Kat

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #81 on: April 17, 2019, 03:56:50 PM »
...this link:

Thank you Kat.

Quote
Sanders has a 3-point edge over the president (44-41 percent), but Biden performs best, topping Trump by 7 points (47-40 percent).

If only Biden was running.

Why isn't he (so far) though? Any theories?

My guess is, that after all the other candidates (except for Sanders) crash and burn, the party will come running to Biden.  He will ride in on his white horse, in an attempt to save the election.

Neven

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #82 on: April 17, 2019, 07:57:02 PM »
If only Biden was running.

Why isn't he (so far) though? Any theories?

I agree with Kat that Biden wants it to be given to him, because he's so special.

But as Kyle Kulinski says: Just as with Clinton, as soon as he starts talking at rallies, etc., his numbers will go down inevitably. That's because he's a neoliberal, a Republican in Democrat's clothing, and people see through it.
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b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #83 on: April 17, 2019, 08:13:41 PM »
and people see through it

I sure hope so.

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #84 on: April 17, 2019, 10:32:21 PM »
Biden is a solid choice if you want to ensure we don't progress beyond where we were under Obama and are only concerned with potentially beating Trump. Frankly, I'm not content with that and don't think Trump will lose based on the current pool of candidates, as much as I'd like to be wrong on that. It's really hard to get moderates out to vote for somebody when that somebody isn't inspiring or working for them.

Sanders might manage it if enough people are truly concerned about healthcare costs and higher education access, but a lot of them will have to look through the media "socialism" haze to get there.

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #85 on: April 17, 2019, 10:38:53 PM »
Sanders might manage it if enough people are truly concerned about healthcare costs and higher education access, but a lot of them will have to look through the media "socialism" haze to get there.

Fox let Sanders explain what socialism is. I'm not sure if this is what Fox envisaged:



At the same time, I'm sure that the people at Fox knew what to expect. So, I have no idea why they did this.
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ritter

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #86 on: April 17, 2019, 11:48:47 PM »
At the same time, I'm sure that the people at Fox knew what to expect. So, I have no idea why they did this.

Maybe they grow tired of cheer leading for Trump? One can dream...

gerontocrat

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #87 on: Today at 03:27:15 AM »
At the same time, I'm sure that the people at Fox knew what to expect. So, I have no idea why they did this.

Maybe they grow tired of cheer leading for Trump? One can dream...
Fox reminding Trump on who is the real boss?
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GoSouthYoungins

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #88 on: Today at 03:38:27 AM »
Socialism is great, but scale matters and homogeneity matter A LOT. A small nation of people who look and think alike can make socialism work very very well. There are no counter-examples.
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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #89 on: Today at 04:09:35 AM »
At the same time, I'm sure that the people at Fox knew what to expect. So, I have no idea why they did this.

Maybe they grow tired of cheer leading for Trump? One can dream...
Fox reminding Trump on who is the real boss?
I think it's more like it doesn't matter what Bernie says because their entire viewing audience will vote Trump regardless.

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #90 on: Today at 06:30:22 AM »
I think it's more like it doesn't matter what Bernie says because their entire viewing audience will vote Trump regardless.

Any poll showing this? Or is this one of your 'political analysis' '.

Because last FoxNews poll i saw they had Trump losing against Bernie.

colchonero

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #91 on: Today at 08:58:43 AM »
I think it's more like it doesn't matter what Bernie says because their entire viewing audience will vote Trump regardless.

Any poll showing this? Or is this one of your 'political analysis' '.

Because last FoxNews poll i saw they had Trump losing against Bernie.

It is a poll done by Fox News,like CNN or ABC or whatever. That does not mean they poll their audience only. And bbr was talking about Fox News audience, not whole America.

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #92 on: Today at 09:18:00 AM »
It is a poll done by Fox News,like CNN or ABC or whatever. That does not mean they poll their audience only.

Honestly, do you think any poll, regardless of who is polling, is neutral?

And do you also think the "entire viewing audience" votes for Trump? As in 100%?

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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #93 on: Today at 09:45:16 AM »
I think it's more like it doesn't matter what Bernie says because their entire viewing audience will vote Trump regardless.

It all depends on whether people associate Trump with the swamp, or whether they believe the lie that he is some outsider upsetting the establishment. That's what makes Russiagate so monumentally stupid, but it was probably planned that way. The goal is to keep real progressives out.

I think that if Sanders can't be intimidated or co-opted to play along, they will cheat him again.
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Re: Elections 2020 USA
« Reply #94 on: Today at 10:10:39 AM »
“We have time now, ten years, perhaps twenty years, to do something about it. The longer we leave it the more difficult it is going to be and if we leave it too long… the natural system will collapse.”
Sir David Attenborough - April 2019