Baltic Images

[Pmt111500]

a couple of images of various stages of melt in the baltic.
1. rotten large floe (c.100m in diameter)
2. ship wave action on broken up rotten ice
3. about the smallest chunks still easily seen from above (c.1-3 m diam.)
4. the remnants of type 3's, almost wholly submerged 

[Pmt111500]

narrow channel clogged by mixture of variously sized floes. tried to take some photos in the sunset too, but the autofocus didn't manage the low light.

[Pmt111500]

I don't know how I forgot there's a Modis-RapidResponse service also for Baltic. Attached an image taken at the same time than the above images were taken. Most are from the best navigable channel leading to the mainland. The locations marked might not be exact, but somewhat close anyway.

[Pmt111500]

The shallower bays have started to freeze hereabouts (about 7 pixels off ;-)) after some 5 days of -10 degree weather. (funny, if there were no engines (electric or petrol), my whole life would fit in a 290*210px image on this scale. never made any longer biking tours.)

[Pmt111500]

The harbour at the river mouth almost clear of ice. 3 spring rains have passed here since the last image at Arctic café. I guess the next rains take out the rest of ice. Spring is definitely here.

[Neven]

Nice thread, Pmt111500, hadn't seen it yet. I'm moving it to Arctic Background.

[Pmt111500]

thanks, Neven. I had forgot this thread too so I posted one set of Baltic images to Arctic café : https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,179.msg105546.html#msg105546

Then there was the meltpooling image at https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,179.msg103093.html#msg103093 which is from the same spot (but southwards) than the last image on this thread.

The rest of the images at Arctic Café are of the river and of the lake so 'Baltic' doesn't apply for them.

[gerontocrat]

A few years ago, due to vagaries of wind and weather, a little inlet in the Baltic got clogged up with loads of ice. It refused to melt. This prompted one of our most dedicated deniers, Mr. Christopher Booker, to write in the Daily Telegraph how this one month delay proved beyond a doubt that Global Warming was utter and complete nonsense. That the sea ice in the rest of the Arctic was melting before our eyes was, of course, of no moment.

So do not be surprised if your image showing a bit of ice left in the harbour is used for a surprising purpose. But more images please - I did some contracts for Swedish Aid many years ago and remember...

[Pmt111500]

There isn't too much sea ice left here in easily accessed places so that couldve been the last image in this spring. Last summer I found a place where I could have taken an overview image of the opening message area, but that, in winter, would involve a 2-mile trek along icy rocks and cliffs so it's not likely I ever get there, in winter...

[Pmt111500]

This is just the note that the Winter has started here, J.Sainio took this aerial photo of my home city just yesterday and I just set on it some of the locations of my photos presented here on ASI Forum. Today more snow has fallen and the apple tree on the yard has abt. 2 inches (5 cm) of snow on all broader twigs. Maybe taking some images tomorrow, this evening is all about the snow job (really) on the driveway (removing the estimated 6-7 inches. 15 to 17,5cm that is).

(Modified 2018.02.24 : Added some of the newer ones)

[Pmt111500]

Visited sea/riverside today.
1. Many people outing (this is a location that has very little currents)
2. Albedo photo (the rotating ice sled is quite traditional)
3. Old quarry wall melts partially in the evening sun.
4. River has no reliable ice (the few plus-days have melted south slopes a bit increasing the volume of water, then ice breaks and moves every which way resulting in a mesh of possibly 3cm -- 50cm ice. Better watch your step or avoid alltogether)

[Pmt111500]

Phone camera cuts too much light off when there's lotsof ice/snow so here's a better version of the 'albedo photo' sea water-clear ice-snowy ice.

[harpy]

Which city is this?

[Pmt111500]

Southern coast of Finland.

Here's the historical maximum extent of ice on Baltic, now that I again found it. I post this here too as it'll get buried in the thread I first put it in. (forgot the link on 20180226 (possibly changes sometime like the links in republican controlled EPA)): https://www.eea.europa.eu/data-and-maps/indicators/arctic-sea-ice-2/assessment

[Pmt111500]

River ice photo. This bit had cracked from the pressure of water from beneath and let out water that melted the snow on river ice to skatable ice.

[crandles]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-europe-43437722/swiss-pianist-gives-concert-on-ice-in-northern-baltic-sea

<iframe width="400" height="500" frameborder="0" src="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/embed/p061dq66/43437722"></iframe>

[Pmt111500]

Friend's photo this morning from around 60°17'N 22°00'E

[Sleepy]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-europe-43437722/swiss-pianist-gives-concert-on-ice-in-northern-baltic-sea

<iframe width="400" height="500" frameborder="0" src="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/embed/p061dq66/43437722"></iframe>

I would probably not sit there calmly. 

[Sleepy]

Sundsvall has got a new alpine mountain, Nackstafjället.
https://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/a/WLeQ8G/martins-bild-pa-sundsvalls-nya-fjall-har-blivit-viral
The amount of emissions to transport all that snow, is another story. Sundsvalls budget was 40 million kronor which should cover 80 days of work and they have used 85 vehicles for snow clearing (according to earlier news in January) and they were able to move 30,000m³ in 2,5 days.

[iamlsd]

I'd be a bit worried about where all the melt water will go 

[Sleepy]

Yeah, this is regarded as environmentally hazardous activity according to the environmental code. There's another one like Nackstafjället a few kilometres north of Sundsvall as well, in Birsta. They dig diverging dikes that collects meltwater into a sedimentation pool, the heavier particles will then sink to the bottom and the water will be directed to an oil separation filter before it eventually seeps into the soil layers, on its way into the Bothnian sea and the Baltic.

[iamlsd]

Thanks Sleepy - interesting to see what people do to keep their towns functioning in cold climates. My kids have never seen snow but have experience plenty of days over 40 C.

[Sleepy]

It sure is iamlsd, these seem to be popular on the other side of the Atlantic:
http://www.trecan.com
I remember making some calculations back in 2015 (Boston snowmageddon) and you could power a 15,000kWh/yr house, somewhere between 118-165 years on the same amount of energy one of those machines consumed in five days while melting snow.

[Niall Dollard]

In 2015 a large snow pile in Boston took until July to melt out.

https://edition.cnn.com/2015/07/15/us/boston-snow-pile-finally-melts/

Some years in Anchorage, Alaska the snow pile survived right through the summer.

A nice historical account of the problems of dealing with the snow here:

https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/the-strangeand-sometimes-secretways-cities-deal-with-massive-piles-of-snow

[Brigantine]

Some years in Anchorage, Alaska the snow pile survived right through the summer.

Do you have a source for that? All I could find was something about the snow pile being *expected* to last through summer, but not whether it actually did.

[Sebastian Jones]

Some years in Anchorage, Alaska the snow pile survived right through the summer.

Do you have a source for that? All I could find was something about the snow pile being *expected* to last through summer, but not whether it actually did.

In the north we give equal credence to traditional and local knowledge as we do to scientific knowledge, so where I live, if a local, especially an Elder, tells you something, you can pretty well take it to the bank. That does not mean it cannot be   wrong, just like science is sometimes wrong.
However Brig, I can assure you that it is quite easy to store snow over the summer in the north. Some of it is thousands of years old in the form of permafrost, but one can perform the experiment on one's back yard too- simply pile up some snow, tarp it and cover it with a few inches of sawdust and it will last all summer easily.  The ice in my creek often lasts until August, and it is terrain rather than the sun that kills it. Sometimes I consider putting a big tent up over part of it, just to see if it would last until the following winter.

[be cause]

funny .. I was wondering about these piles of snow .. in relation to the unlikelyhood of Quebec's snow lasting all summer .. the evidence here suggests the idea of the next ice-age starting because Canada has an extra foot of snow has melted ..
  b.c.

[Niall Dollard]

Some years in Anchorage, Alaska the snow pile survived right through the summer.

Do you have a source for that? All I could find was something about the snow pile being *expected* to last through summer, but not whether it actually did.

I first came across this in a snippet on an Alaskan Weather Calendar.

Also mentioned in this ski blog:  http://crust.outlookalaska.com/Blog/Blog_2012.htm

[Tor Bejnar]

It isn't "Baltic" but I did LOL upon finishing the article.

[Brigantine]

Also mentioned in this ski blog:  http://crust.outlookalaska.com/Blog/Blog_2012.htm

Thanks! That's very interesting.

It seems like the officials *could* have made sure it all melted, but chose otherwise. Still, it's news to me that gravel and bulldozers are needed just to make sure it melts in summer, and good to know.

Now I'm wondering what the plan is in Sundsvall - they should be safe enough just waiting for the sun to come out right?

[Bernard]

[Follow-up of OT conversation about storing ice year round.]

Storing ice is possible even in not-so-cold places. In France's sunny Provence, they used to have "glacières", or ice-houses, where ice produced locally in winter or harvested in the near Alps mountains was safely stored and used all summer. A nice article about it (in French, but you get images at the end).
http://www.merveilles-du-var.net/mazaugues-les-glacieres

[SteveMDFP]

[Follow-up of OT conversation about storing ice year round.]

Storing ice is possible even in not-so-cold places. In France's sunny Provence, they used to have "glacières", or ice-houses, where ice produced locally in winter or harvested in the near Alps mountains was safely stored and used all summer. A nice article about it (in French, but you get images at the end).
http://www.merveilles-du-var.net/mazaugues-les-glacieres

One doesn't even need nearby Alps.  This technique has been used in Virginia, too, I've seen it myself:

Monticello Ice House
https://www.monticello.org/site/house-and-gardens/ice-house

That Tom Jefferson was a clever dude.

[Aluminium]

60°02'N 29°42'E. An ice hut near Kotlin.

[TerryM]

A local ice house burned down in the mid '50s. Somewhere I have some old photos of men sawing the ice for use in home iceboxes. The icehouse was a nice cool place to play during hot summer nights.
Terry

[Sleepy]

Also mentioned in this ski blog:  http://crust.outlookalaska.com/Blog/Blog_2012.htm

Thanks! That's very interesting.

It seems like the officials *could* have made sure it all melted, but chose otherwise. Still, it's news to me that gravel and bulldozers are needed just to make sure it melts in summer, and good to know.

Now I'm wondering what the plan is in Sundsvall - they should be safe enough just waiting for the sun to come out right?

It will need som help, stirring up the top layer and such to help melting. Nackstafjället was closed a week ago. The snow mound in Sundsvall has taken 32,000 truckloads of snow this winter - or 700,000 m³ of snow. The municipality has exceeded its snow budget by 35 million kronor.
A small tour on Nackstafjället, in Swedish but you don't need to understand them.



The hospital in Sundsvall uses their own constructed mound a lot smarter, for cooling.
https://www.rvn.se/sv/v1/In-english1/In-english/Environment-and-energy/Energy-Factor-2/Snow-cooling-in-Sundsvall/
https://www.rvn.se/contentassets/f979402825a344ec8aa934a346c65e45/snokyla_eng.pdf


A couple of older links (in English) to that project.
https://www.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:1011643/FULLTEXT01.pdf
https://www.naturvardsverket.se/Documents/publikationer6400/978-91-620-8558-2.pdf?pid=4240

[Niall Dollard]

An update on the current state of the Baltic Sea surface temperatures.

SSTs are running over 2 C warmer than the mean still in the middle of the Bay of Bothnia and also in the Gulf of Finland off Helsinki. A legacy no doubt from the very warm summer. I am surprised they have even cooled this much. Perhaps the low salinity of the Baltic helps.

There is even a tiny, tiny amount of new ice showing near Pitea and Tornio. If you look closely 

[sidd]

In Philly in the nineties sometime they tried dumping snow into the rivers. But they got close to damming the rivers, so they hadda quit. There were some huge snopiles for months in the old navy base and other spots.

I remember that winter there was snow up to the eaves of houses and cars and trucks were snowed in. Snowed in as invisible. The surface of the snow didnt even have bumps showing there were cars underneath.


sidd

[Pmt111500]

A friends photo of a southern Finnish lake. The lake has steep banks. This is the southern shore which is more shaded so the first ice forms more easily here.

[Pmt111500]

We're having a snowy winter here for a change. Would include a photo but can't decrease the size just now. Admittedly 50 cm isn't much unless you have to manually clear it for 4 parking spots and a driveway. And the clothes' drying rack can still be used, but only for clothes shorter than 70 cm.

[Shared Humanity]

We're having a snowy winter here for a change. Would include a photo but can't decrease the size just now. Admittedly 50 cm isn't much unless you have to manually clear it for 4 parking spots and a driveway. And the clothes' drying rack can still be used, but only for clothes shorter than 70 cm.

A picture is worth a thousand words...

[Pmt111500]

Like I said, nothing too excessive, but getting there. Most since 2010-11, or pretty close to that.. 3K words worth of images. The cheap garden table has been cleared of snow for about 4 times, but not moved since the first snows. Garden is of course on flat ground, which might not be apparent from the image. Not killing the maple with snow-ice is a goal. The car-owner might want to have a sharp-pointed spade if he's going to still drive this winter. That's been standing there for a couple of weeks.

[Pmt111500]

Spanish water dog watching the last of ice on the nearby lake. The ice won't carry even a dog anymore. Friend's foto

[Pmt111500]

Second snows for this winter here are probably also going to melt in few days. Some people are complaining about lack of snow and ice. The ground has frozen once or twice, but is again expected to melt with the snow. Tracks on yard. Sorry for not posting wintery images but mostly it's been like a cool days in Midlands or lower Scotland so at least Englanders already know what it looks like.

[gerontocrat]

Once upon a time the Baltic Sea was an icy sea in winter.

15th January. Southerly winds and circa 5 celsius air temperatures. SST anomalies high.

[bluice]

I can’t post pics via phone but link shows ice situation at the moment compared to average (or ”normal”) winter https://en.ilmatieteenlaitos.fi/ice-conditions

And the detailed up to date Baltic ice chart https://cdn.fmi.fi/marine-observations/products/ice-charts/latest-full-color-ice-chart.pdf

Not much ice to be charted though

[Tor Bejnar]

jäätä means "ice" (Finnish).  Lovely looking word!

[nanning]

Apparently Indonesia has finally executed their plan to move Jakarta 

[gerontocrat]

Apparently Indonesia has finally executed their plan to move Jakarta 

To the Baltic?

[be cause]

Jakarta to Jaata .. by kart ? b.c.

[Tammukka]

Icemap=Jääkartta,
Btw Finland have 9 Icebreakers in active use. But not so active this winter. As there is nothing to brake IHere is most newest one (2016) Polaris.