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Neven

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #250 on: October 30, 2019, 07:50:05 AM »
That's the right spirit. I would have loved for her to reject the Nobel Peace Prize.
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #251 on: October 30, 2019, 06:22:45 PM »
Genius reply!  :D
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #252 on: November 01, 2019, 07:47:41 PM »
Since COP25 is moved from Chile to Madrid (Spain) Greta finds herself on the wrong side of the Atlantic and wants to sail back:

"As #COP25 has officially been moved from Santiago to Madrid I’ll need some help.
It turns out I’ve traveled half around the world, the wrong way:)
Now I need to find a way to cross the Atlantic in November... If anyone could help me find transport I would be so grateful.!

https://twitter.com/GretaThunberg/status/1190290034131267591

Life is strange sometimes. But what an interesting and educational life she has. Good luck and some fun, Greta.

Edit - I am so wrong as she explained later in that tweet: "I’m so sorry I’ll not be able to visit South and Central America this time, I was so looking forward to this. But this is of course not about me, my experiences or where I wish to travel. We’re in a climate and ecological emergency.
I send my support to the people in Chile."

Just hope the storm season will not harm her.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2019, 07:56:51 PM by SATire »

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #253 on: November 06, 2019, 02:32:29 AM »
I was working on a paper on climate change with the senior climate lawyer for a given country and they saw no issue with flying themselves and up to 20 others to climate meetings in places like Fiji etc. Stunning intentional ignorance. I bet they fly business class given the distance to be travelled.

Greta should just stay where she is and use Skype, during which she should lambast all the physical COP25 attendees as complete hypocrites (she could borrow a few points from Kevin Anderson). Of course she could have done that rather than take that billionaire's racing yacht across the Atlantic.

Or grab a ride on Air Force One if Trump is going to Europe and act pissed all the way across while sharing via twitter and instagram.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #254 on: November 06, 2019, 02:37:30 AM »
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHh :)
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #255 on: November 06, 2019, 07:50:47 AM »
Greta should this and Greta should that. And yet she has 100 times the impact of other climate activists, so perhaps she is doing something right??
Ah yes I forgot, she is co-opted.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #256 on: November 06, 2019, 09:10:53 AM »
Greta is having more impact than a few thousand political suits and overrated celebs going to yet another international wank feast where they talk for days and achieve nothing besides another thousand page toothless document of intent.

Greta has made us all take notice.

She has personally shifted the Overton window towards  doing something among hundreds of thousands of future voters . Many of the kids she has inspired will be voting towards action on AGW next election in your country as well as mine.

Greta takes AGW seriously and attempts to limit her carbon impact as much as humanly possible.
As such she has the right to fly, drive,sail  or whatever else she thinks she needs to do to achieve her goals .
Those that don't like it should get of their fat arses and achieve as much as she has .
Until they have they should shut the fuck up.

Excuse the swearing sometimes blunt truths need blunt language.

 

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #257 on: November 06, 2019, 09:27:34 PM »


Excuse the swearing sometimes blunt truths need blunt language.

Or blunt brainwashed and wishful thinkers ignorance.

Where I agree is that anything that is shaking people out of their comfort zone is good and NOT bad but as to the rest, it's a hypocrite hype and in about ten years she will be remembered as a person with good intentions and trying her best but abused by a hypocrite system and eventually muted or worse.

She is totally ok but the hype and abuse of that child and into what it will be resulting is NOT.

Unfortunately this kind of thing, if not understood by the average people, can only be confirmed in the aftermath when it's way too late.

I don't expect that you would remember my or rboyds words, hence will get back to you once things have happened (or not happened in this case) just that it will look like being righteous, but so what.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #258 on: November 08, 2019, 12:04:25 AM »
Since we're exactly three weeks away from that most savage spectacle of raw American consumption, how about some shopping commentary? Maybe some words about makeup, clothing and fashion?

1. GQ dressed Greta up so nice for the October mag cover and interview (see pic below.)  I wonder how long it took her to rip off that petticoat afterwards?  How did she get punked like that?  The article ends with a big dose of hopium that we have "8 or 9 years left of BAU." 

https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/men-of-the-year/article/greta-thunberg-interview

2. Greta also made the cover of Glamour in October, but to their credit--you only saw Greta from the neck up--there wasn't a speck of makeup and you didn't see any of Greta's secondhand clothing.  Sadly and as expected, the accompanying lightweight article conveyed no sense of urgency.  Whose house is on fire?

https://www.glamour.com/story/women-of-the-year-2019-greta-thunberg

3. Upthread (#130, Sept 12th), Amy Goodman interviews Greta on Democracy Now.  At 17:02, Greta uses the term "stop-shop" twice and I don't think Goodman was prepared for that:  Greta does not buy new clothes.  So Goodman briefly paid lip service to the concept but quickly got the conversation steered back to Greta's veganism and how Greta travels around.

Let's go shopping!

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #259 on: November 10, 2019, 10:20:24 PM »
Weird youth these days. They find so many things embarrassing. I don't know what to think about it, but a high school teacher told us that the teens she teaches said that they found embarrassing that Greta almost cried when speaking at the UN, and how she said "how dare you". In another context, we had a meeting with a teacher and my son was always hitting my wife under the table because he found embarrassing what she was saying. A third context, my sons find both embarrassing when I speak a little bit louder in a shop to call them to come or because I want to show them something.  Looks like we have a new generation that is scared not to behave according to standard models.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #260 on: November 11, 2019, 12:45:39 AM »
Explain to them that you are just talking in upper caps at the shop.

The first one might also show that they are uncomfortable with emotions or talking about them in class. Last century that was also true but we never really spoke about those in class.


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etienne

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #261 on: November 11, 2019, 06:55:40 AM »
I believe that as a teenager, I would have found that she had a lot of courage. Just like I would be happy that my parents would say the truth to a teacher. If this is seen as embarrassing, it probably means that they don't get support of peers when they try to get things right. One of the teachers really doesn't behave in an acceptable way, for example when one asks a stupid question, he could wonder if the teen's parents took drugs during pregnancy.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #262 on: November 11, 2019, 08:11:44 AM »
Weird youth these days. They find so many things embarrassing. I don't know what to think about it, but a high school teacher told us that the teens she teaches said that they found embarrassing that Greta almost cried when speaking at the UN, and how she said "how dare you". In another context, we had a meeting with a teacher and my son was always hitting my wife under the table because he found embarrassing what she was saying. A third context, my sons find both embarrassing when I speak a little bit louder in a shop to call them to come or because I want to show them something.  Looks like we have a new generation that is scared not to behave according to standard models.

That's an interesting observation etienne :).

I think they are afraid of the outside, of the real world with real people because they have lived a far too abstract life through Internet & videogames & TV. Always inwards without real life contact. Almost no non-verbal communication skills.
I observe the same symptom when waiting at a busstop, I see teenagers trying not to look at each other and keep checking their smartphones. Uneasy, insecure and non-social. Addiction, dependence and fear. They only feel save and at ease when isolated from the outside world and inside their computer generated abstract worlds it seems to me.

Not all teenagers are like this (e.g. Greta Thunberg) but the majority is, I think. It would be good if they would join XR and make some real life meaningful contact outside of their groups/comfort-bubbles.

I looks to me that they also find it very difficult to look other people in the eye. Have you observed that in the young humans you parent?
"It is preoccupation with possessions, more than anything else, that prevents us from living freely and nobly" - Bertrand Russell
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etienne

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #263 on: November 11, 2019, 07:52:42 PM »
I looks to me that they also find it very difficult to look other people in the eye. Have you observed that in the young humans you parent?
I have never observed this, but we live in an area where most parents only provided a lumited screen time at least to kids under 10 years old, and this was a great help for our parental work.

What I have observed is that their friends come and leave without saying hello or goodbye to us parents, even if they stayed overnight, but I never thought it could be because they feel insecure.

blumenkraft

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #264 on: November 12, 2019, 05:09:56 PM »
We are living in a world of change. Adults can't guide the kids through this. We don't know the internet, it's too new and ever-changing. It's a whole new cultural technique we have to learn as humanity as a whole. And then climate change. We know nothing. We can only assume.

The kids feel that. No fucking wonder they are insecure.

It's time to listen to the kids for once. Let's be insecure together.
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #265 on: November 12, 2019, 06:33:49 PM »
Thanks :).
(I mean insecure in the context of being deep inside an abstract world (social media, TV, games), alone, for a large amount of time at a (very) young age, and therefore a bit alien (insecure) to the general outside; to humans outside of  known groups. Very low non-verbal communication skills can make you insecure. By not being able to 'read' others.)
« Last Edit: November 12, 2019, 06:40:28 PM by nanning »
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #266 on: November 12, 2019, 06:39:38 PM »
I mean insecure in the context of being deep inside an abstract world (social media, TV, games)

Yes, me too. :)
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etienne

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #267 on: November 12, 2019, 10:37:10 PM »
Sometimes we also feel alone as adults. Feels like the game is over (climate change, limits of growth...) and the others keep playing, like my son who didn't understand that you can't continue a chess game when the king is lost. He clearly prefered the queen.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #268 on: November 13, 2019, 01:13:12 AM »
Quote
Greta Thunberg (@GretaThunberg) 11/12/19, 6:02 PM
So happy to say I'll hopefully make it to COP25 in Madrid.
I’ve been offered a ride from Virginia on the 48ft catamaran La Vagabonde. Australians @Sailing_LaVaga ,Elayna Carausu & @_NikkiHenderson from England will take me across the Atlantic.
We sail for Europe tomorrow morning!
https://twitter.com/gretathunberg/status/1194389911639642115
Photo at the link.
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

rboyd

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #269 on: November 15, 2019, 11:24:20 PM »
So, how did Riley Whitelum get the money to buy that catamaran that Greta is crossing the Atlantic on?

Quote
For 8 years, he worked on an offshore drill rig and on a barge offshore.

Quote
Spending a large section of my adult life working offshore on oil rigs and pipe-lay vessels taught me so many things that I don’t often think about.

So nice that he could fund his youtube yachting escapades through such hard work in the oil industry (and now advertising on his youtube channel which I am sure will now experience a massive increase in viewership). I am sure that there will be lots of time for him to share fun stories about his time in the oil industry with Greta.

https://www.famousbirthdays.com/people/riley-whitelum.html

https://twitter.com/Sailing_LaVaga/status/937866905582555137

Juan C. García

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #270 on: November 16, 2019, 01:20:46 AM »
So nice that he could fund his youtube yachting escapades through such hard work in the oil industry
I also worked in the petroleum industry. And the truth is that I miss the pay!  :'(
I don't know about him, but in some cases, you need guts to leave that job.
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50% [NSIDC Extent] or
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Volume is harder to measure than extent, but 3-dimensional space is real, 2D's hide ~50% thickness gone.
-> IPCC/NSIDC trends [based on extent] underestimate the real speed of ASI lost.

Hefaistos

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #271 on: November 16, 2019, 12:53:00 PM »
We are living in a world of change. Adults can't guide the kids through this. We don't know the internet, it's too new and ever-changing. It's a whole new cultural technique we have to learn as humanity as a whole. And then climate change. We know nothing. We can only assume.

The kids feel that. No fucking wonder they are insecure.

It's time to listen to the kids for once. Let's be insecure together.

No. It's time for parents to wake up and take the smartphones away from their kids.
Kids don't need smartphones.

They need a dumb phone so they can communicate with parents as needed. Yes, they may send sms's also.

Plus a strict limit on screentime. 40 minutes per day. After schoolwork is done.

That will give your kids back to you, among other positive effects.

Kids will scream at first and protest at your new regime, but they will accept it. And eventually they will enjoy being different.

blumenkraft

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #272 on: November 16, 2019, 01:18:47 PM »
No. It's time for parents to wake up and take the smartphones away from their kids.
Kids don't need smartphones.

Sure, if you think the internet is going away any time soon or that your kid doesn't need to learn basic cultural techniques needed to function in society, this is indeed the way to go.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #273 on: November 16, 2019, 02:55:16 PM »
We are living in a world of change. Adults can't guide the kids through this. We don't know the internet, it's too new and ever-changing. It's a whole new cultural technique we have to learn as humanity as a whole. And then climate change. We know nothing. We can only assume.

The kids feel that. No fucking wonder they are insecure.

It's time to listen to the kids for once. Let's be insecure together.

No. It's time for parents to wake up and take the smartphones away from their kids.
Kids don't need smartphones.

They need a dumb phone so they can communicate with parents as needed. Yes, they may send sms's also.

Plus a strict limit on screentime. 40 minutes per day. After schoolwork is done.

That will give your kids back to you, among other positive effects.

Kids will scream at first and protest at your new regime, but they will accept it. And eventually they will enjoy being different.
OK, Boomer.
😁

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #274 on: November 16, 2019, 03:05:08 PM »
 ;D :D
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #275 on: November 16, 2019, 03:12:06 PM »
 Those cultural techniques need to go I'm afraid. It is driven by immoral commerce in stead of rational high morality thinking. Do we want to steer our path into the future or not?  ???

I feel so much for our new humans  :'(, I recognize the deep lifelong damage our current culture does to them. Not just the cultural techniques. Parents in thrall of these techniques and addicted to technofixes will give their toddler a screen, which is a low morality action in my view.
Like other animals young humans need a form of 'natural unbringing' in order for their brainstructure, social systems, non verbal communication skills, emotional action/reaction/understanding, discipline, morality, physical skills, touch/smell capacity etc. to develop to a complete brain and human and without faults (I don't mean natural variation).
And all of this development has to take place in the real world. A world increasingly at a distance for our young ones because the grown-ups pull them in all kinds of abstract versions.

I observe that there is not much critical thinking going on. While there are many good articles on this (as seen in The Guardian).
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #276 on: November 16, 2019, 03:33:35 PM »
Those cultural techniques need to go I'm afraid.

Not going to happen.

Quote
It is driven by immoral commerce in stead of rational high morality thinking. Do we want to steer our path into the future or not?  ???

Well, it's driven by protocols on the technical level. The protocols are inherently neutral. It's about how we use them.

Since we are still in the early stages, there is no answer to how we elevate the positives and negate the negatives in effective ways but we will get there.

We have to figure out how to democratize and decentralize things for example. Technically not a problem, socially a discussion we have to have. Sticking your head into the sand never is a smart move.

Quote
I feel so much for our new humans  :'(, I recognize the deep lifelong damage our current culture does to them.

Yep, people talked about Rock'n Roll exactly like that. And everything new following that had similar arguments against it. And some say it was like that even before.

Quote
Not just the cultural techniques. Parents in thrall of these techniques and addicted to technofixes will give their toddler a screen, which is a low morality action in my view.

Teaching your kid how to read and write also? How about money? Would you prohibit kids from learning about those things? Where is the line?

Quote
And all of this development has to take place in the real world.

Computers are located in the real world. People you communicate with via computers are located in the real world. Also the content creators you see on YouTube, for example, are real humans.

So what do you mean 'has to be in the real world'?
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #277 on: November 16, 2019, 09:23:19 PM »
^^
Could you accept that with AI, it's often assumed that people you communicate with via computers MAY be in the real world?
Terry

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #278 on: November 16, 2019, 09:49:46 PM »
So nice that he could fund his youtube yachting escapades through such hard work in the oil industry
I also worked in the petroleum industry. And the truth is that I miss the pay!  :'(
I don't know about him, but in some cases, you need guts to leave that job.

I have no issue with Riley, power to him doing what many would dream of. Its the bullshit optics of the Greta phenomena I have a problem with. A billionaires yacht, happy pictures with DiCaprio and his town sized carbon footprint, and now an ex oil worker who took the good money to achieve a dream. We have to cut consumption in the rich countries by quite a lot (with much bigger cuts for the DiCaprios of this world) to have any chance of staying under 2 degrees.

Going across the Atlantic during the winter storm season in a relatively small boat is also not that clever a thing to do.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #279 on: November 16, 2019, 10:15:45 PM »
No. It's time for parents to wake up and take the smartphones away from their kids.
Kids don't need smartphones. They need a dumb phone so they can communicate with parents as needed. Yes, they may send sms's also. Plus a strict limit on screentime. 40 minutes per day. After schoolwork is done. That will give your kids back to you, among other positive effects. Kids will scream at first and protest at your new regime, but they will accept it. And eventually they will enjoy being different.
OK, Boomer.
😁

There is a ton of psychological research showing that, especially for girls, getting a smart phone and social media as a young child has a significant negative impact upon their mental health. Better that they get them later in their teens, so that they can have a sense of perspective. Also, a much longer attention span which is highly prized in higher academia and business.

All the tech executives tend to be raising their kids tech free.

Silicon Valley parents are raising their kids tech-free — and it should be a red flag

Quote
The Koduris' life is that of the quintessential Silicon Valley family, except for one thing. The technology developed by Koduri and Shahi's employers is all but banned at the family's home.

There are no video game systems inside the Koduri household, and neither child has their own cell phone yet. Saurav and Roshni can play games on their parents' phones, but only for 10 minutes per week. (There are no limits to using the family's vast library of board games.) Awhile back the family bought an iPad 2, but for the last five years it's lived on the highest shelf in a linen closet.

https://www.businessinsider.com/silicon-valley-parents-raising-their-kids-tech-free-red-flag-2018-2

A Dark Consensus About Screens and Kids Begins to Emerge in Silicon Valley

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/26/style/phones-children-silicon-valley.html

How Do Smartphones Affect Childhood Psychology?

https://psychcentral.com/lib/how-do-smartphones-affect-childhood-psychology/

Social Media Hurts Girls More Than Boys

https://time.com/5650266/social-media-girls-mental-health/



So, maybe you should listen to that boomer instead of being a smartass.


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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #280 on: November 16, 2019, 11:18:41 PM »
No. It's time for parents to wake up and take the smartphones away from their kids.
Kids don't need smartphones.

Sure, if you think the internet is going away any time soon or that your kid doesn't need to learn basic cultural techniques needed to function in society, this is indeed the way to go.

I want my kids to be with real people, not virtual representations of people.
When we are together, I want my kids to relate to me, and the rest of my family, and no-one or nothing else. I don't invite virtual representations of others into our family.
So, no smartphones until the teens.

Interestingly, schools in Sweden now have various degrees of bans on smartphones. Our eldest daughter is in a Waldorf school, where the ban is total. Smartphones are collected at the school gate in the morning and handed out after school.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #281 on: November 16, 2019, 11:24:49 PM »
Those cultural techniques need to go I'm afraid. It is driven by immoral commerce in stead of rational high morality thinking. Do we want to steer our path into the future or not?  ???

I feel so much for our new humans  :'(, I recognize the deep lifelong damage our current culture does to them. Not just the cultural techniques. Parents in thrall of these techniques and addicted to technofixes will give their toddler a screen, which is a low morality action in my view.
Like other animals young humans need a form of 'natural unbringing' in order for their brainstructure, social systems, non verbal communication skills, emotional action/reaction/understanding, discipline, morality, physical skills, touch/smell capacity etc. to develop to a complete brain and human and without faults (I don't mean natural variation).
And all of this development has to take place in the real world. A world increasingly at a distance for our young ones because the grown-ups pull them in all kinds of abstract versions.

I observe that there is not much critical thinking going on. While there are many good articles on this (as seen in The Guardian).

Thanks, nanning.
I detest consumerism, and I try to fight the attitudes of a consumerist culture that seep into our kids' minds through all those screens.
"Do we want to steer our path into the future or not?"
Indeed.

TerryM

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #282 on: Today at 12:49:22 AM »
I've no children, but it seems as though many could benefit from an environment where another kid might pop them whenever they got a little too adamant about demanding that they get their own way.


Bloody noses certainly taught me much about restraint and playing well with others.
Terry

blumenkraft

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #283 on: Today at 06:26:26 AM »
Our eldest daughter is in a Waldorf school

Say no more...  ::)

(This is not a virtual representation of me talking, this is actually me! I'm saying that because you might confuse a person with bits.)

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nanning

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« Reply #284 on: Today at 07:59:51 AM »
Greta Thunberg sparks surge in sailboat hitchhiking
Since climate campaigner’s transatlantic adventures, more people are looking to travel by sail

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/nov/15/greta-thunberg-sparks-surge-in-sailboat-hitchhiking
"It is preoccupation with possessions, more than anything else, that prevents us from living freely and nobly" - Bertrand Russell
   Simple: minimize your possessions and be free and kind    It's just a mindset.       Refugees welcome