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Ken Feldman

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3350 on: February 06, 2019, 11:46:15 PM »
Off-grid solar is growing in Africa:

https://www.ozy.com/fast-forward/africa-embraces-an-8-billion-solar-market-for-going-off-grid/92303

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Nairobi-based M-KOPA started the revolution. Launched commercially in 2012, M-KOPA allows low-income families access to solar energy for as little as $1 per month. This is cheaper and more environmental than the alternatives, kerosene or diesel fuel, and offers a metered payment system tracked through their phone SIM cards. The first firm in the world to develop that innovation, M-KOPA now has 600,000 customers across Kenya, Tanzania and Uganda, and is bringing solar power to 500 new homes every day. It has received $162 million in investments since 2014. But the firm is no longer alone.

Uganda-based Fenix, which launched in Africa soon after M-KOPA, has now reached more than 1 million homes. While Uganda remains its biggest market, it is now expanding to other nations. In 2018, Fenix — which has raised $16 million in investments — entered Zambia, and within nine months had converted 30,000 families to solar energy users. Tanzania-based ZOLA Energy — better known by its earlier name, Off Grid Electric — is now expanding into West Africa, starting with Ivory Coast. It has already reached 50,000 homes in Tanzania.

Ken Feldman

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3351 on: February 06, 2019, 11:56:31 PM »
The Florida Public Services Commission ruled that solar leases don't constitute the sale of electricity:

https://cleantechnica.com/2019/02/05/florida-public-service-commission-opens-the-floodgates-for-solar-leases/

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The approval gives Tesla and other solar providers in the state the green light to move forward with solar leasing in the state. Solar is the easiest to get onto rooftops when it does not come at an incremental cost to homeowners and instead, replaces the existing electricity bill with a solar leasing bill that is typically lower than what customers were paying for electricity.

The ruling clarified that the Florida Public Service Commission views Tesla’s solar leases as leasing of equipment and not the sale of electricity, which allows Tesla to continue leasing solar equipment in the state. Click Orlando quoted Florida PSC Chairman Art Graham as saying, “while today’s declaration is limited to the facts in Tesla’s petition, companies operating under the same facts can rely upon this declaration as well.”

Sigmetnow

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3352 on: February 07, 2019, 01:26:04 AM »
Off-grid solar is growing in Africa:

https://www.ozy.com/fast-forward/africa-embraces-an-8-billion-solar-market-for-going-off-grid/92303

Quote
Nairobi-based M-KOPA started the revolution. Launched commercially in 2012, M-KOPA allows low-income families access to solar energy for as little as $1 per month. This is cheaper and more environmental than the alternatives, kerosene or diesel fuel, and offers a metered payment system tracked through their phone SIM cards. The first firm in the world to develop that innovation, M-KOPA now has 600,000 customers across Kenya, Tanzania and Uganda, and is bringing solar power to 500 new homes every day. It has received $162 million in investments since 2014. But the firm is no longer alone.
...

I posted on this a couple years ago — I’m so glad it continues to prove successful.  Stunning how fast mobile phone banking took off in Africa.  And such an improvement over fires and kerosene lamps.
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Lurk

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3353 on: February 07, 2019, 02:08:02 AM »
We find that the principal barriers to 100RElec are neither technological nor economic,
but instead are primarily political, institutional and cultural.


See? Even they agree with me. Great to see you get on board the reality train. ;)

Now let's not lose sight of the fact that those principal barriers are in fact real barriers plus they are BARRIERS to SYSTEM CHANGES

 And despite the fact they claim "economics" is not a barrier in reality it is a huge barrier - so they got that wrong big time - because today's Economic System is integral to the whole system, politics and cultures in which we live and for it is that which is driving GHG emissions to keep increasing not the opposite.

So what does this then logically suggest is the solution given it is not technological nor economic?

The solutions require a RADICAL ACTIVISM directed at the political, institutional and cultural status quo. Or nothing will change to the degree needed and the speed required to make a significant POSITIVE difference in the future outcomes.

See how this kind of thinking and FRAMING the Conversation switches the arguments totally ... both regarding fellow travelers who all have "different ideas & biases" about what is and what isn't a solution as well as those who outright deny anything can be done or should be done about AGW/CC.

First step is people breaking out of their "conditioning" by the current system we have all been born into - to actually view it objectively as it exists and operates everywhere - that is what must change first - people's perspectives and beliefs and attitudes about this "system"

But this "system" will not change until enough people realize they have been "conditioned" in the first place and most still are!

Just saying "renewables is cheaper" will not get them built and will not get them to be 100% of energy supply either.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2019, 02:14:00 AM by Lurk »
Solving Climate Change means changing 'The System' because nothing changes when nothing changes.
Each one of us must consider our deepest values, proceed to act from this standpoint alone, ignoring other voices of illusion, false hope, and distraction that might threaten to throw us off course.

Lurk

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3354 on: February 07, 2019, 02:33:55 AM »
As we can see with the Gilets Jeaunes movement, pricing carbon out of the environment can have Massive political impacts, impacts way beyond the initial intent.  I have said, for more than a decade, that you cannot punish the people into using less carbon.  Especially when you do not provide an alternative route for them not to be punished, at an equivalent cost to the original FF route without the punitive taxes.

The GJ movement is exactly the result I expected from this attempt to "price carbon".

There's a thread for political discussions about the Yellow Vest protests https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,2510.0.html which do not belong here.

That being said the issue has nothing to do with a "price on carbon" and everything do do with the Macron Govt paying back his campaign supporters by cutting "wealth taxes" and then trying to pay for it by applying higher Petrol Excise on those least able to afford it - everyone else.

It's a Equity issue not a climate change action one. And it's got nothing to do with renewable energy either.
Solving Climate Change means changing 'The System' because nothing changes when nothing changes.
Each one of us must consider our deepest values, proceed to act from this standpoint alone, ignoring other voices of illusion, false hope, and distraction that might threaten to throw us off course.

Lurk

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3355 on: February 07, 2019, 02:37:42 AM »
Unnamed Climate scientists say that. The saddest part about that is you believe this kind of stuff Neil. Very sad.

Actually RealClimate reports the general opinion that things will finally start to crap out about the late 2070's to early 2090's but, hey, I'm just an idiot who can't read.

As for the belief?  I'm telling you what people think, why they won't act and what YOU have to do in order to help them understand that this is not a 5-10 year so what issue but the destruction of the habitat for their progeny.

I know that.  Apparently you don't or you would not keep on making this about here and now.

Neil please define "crap out"!

I am the one who used the phrase not you. Stop hijacking my terms and twisting them into something else entirely.

Meaning: Stop arguing about arguing. It's a pain in the butt!
Solving Climate Change means changing 'The System' because nothing changes when nothing changes.
Each one of us must consider our deepest values, proceed to act from this standpoint alone, ignoring other voices of illusion, false hope, and distraction that might threaten to throw us off course.

NeilT

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3356 on: February 07, 2019, 11:32:15 AM »
There's a thread for political discussions about the Yellow Vest protests https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,2510.0.html which do not belong here.

That being said the issue has nothing to do with a "price on carbon" and everything do do with the Macron Govt paying back his campaign supporters by cutting "wealth taxes" and then trying to pay for it by applying higher Petrol Excise on those least able to afford it - everyone else.

It's a Equity issue not a climate change action one. And it's got nothing to do with renewable energy either.

Please, I live in France, the GJ movement was triggered by the plan to radically rise the price of Diesel fuel, presented as a requirement to allow France to meet its commitments to the Paris accord. This was insult on top of injury from the mandating of a speed reduction from 90km/h to 80km/h on all roads lower than 3 vois, which had left the people simmering with rage when it was billed as another "paris accord" move to allow France to become compliant.

During the protests every speed camera within a 50km radius, of where I live, was destroyed by the GJ.  I live 500km from Paris too.

It's all very well saying that there is a "political" thread on the board.  But  constantly see, written here, that we must have a price on carbon before we can have truly pervasive renewables.

I have constantly maintained that a price on carbon is a political move, not a climate move and that it will never be supported by the voters.  So that we must find a better way of making renewables (and clean energy in general), more viable than carbon fuels.

When I point out that those political consequences have been seen, in full, in France, where support for renewables have just been slashed to the bone I'm told to go and discuss it in the politics forum.

For those who are not aware, France slashed the subsidies on Solar to 0%, making it impossible for anyone to recover the install cost of their roof top Solar. All models were based on the subsidies and because all installations were tied to EDF (the 85% government owned power utility), that meant there was no flexible market to pay more for the power.

This is not just happening in France.  The UK slashed rooftop solar subsidies.  Scotland, who are way over their Paris Accord commitments already, are slashing funding for renewable heating (they were heavily supporting renewable pellet burning CH), personal renewable energy and many other kinds of renewable energy.

All of these "incentives" are being transitioned to "taxes" on the consumer to force people off FF.

The outcome has been a disaster for the SNP, in Scotland and the Tories in the UK overall.  Not just Macron.

If you want to see renewable energy take its rightful place in the mix, then you are going to have to accept some direct realities of the political situation.
Being right too soon is socially unacceptable.

Robert A. Heinlein

Neven

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3357 on: February 07, 2019, 02:41:34 PM »
The reality, just like Lurk is saying, is that all these cuts are made to benefit concentrated wealth, under the guise of climate accords or whatever. A carbon tax would work perfectly well, if you would transparently distribute all of the tax revenues to the population on a per capita basis.

If you use that tax money to either benefit concentrated wealth or bureaucracy, yes, people will get mad. And rightly so. But the system demands it. If you don't (want to) change the system, don't expect AGW to be solved any time soon.
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NeilT

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3358 on: February 07, 2019, 06:21:41 PM »
Neven, I'd Love to change the system.  The problem is the 95% who don't.

I'd love to be renewable in electricity but it won't make a bit of difference, my power is already clean.  I'm already renewable in my heating.

I can't go renewable in my vehicles because I don't have that choice yet.

I need more choice in my ability to go FF free, but all I see are choices being taken away and a half hearted push to EV.

I need to get out more, thinking about it can be really depressing.
Being right too soon is socially unacceptable.

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b_lumenkraft

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3359 on: February 07, 2019, 06:36:25 PM »
This is an off topic link, but this headline i saw today makes a point for me. It shows how people tend to act when the problem shows up on their porch.

Vaccinations jump 500% in antivax hotspot amid measles outbreak
Link >> https://arstechnica.com/science/2019/02/vaccinations-jump-500-in-antivax-hotspot-amid-measles-outbreak/

I don't know if it's a positive message that people only act when they can't look away anymore, but when it comes to climate change, things are showing up in front of peoples faces now. It's getting harder to look away.

I really hope today people look this way >> https://www.npr.org/2019/02/07/691997301/rep-alexandria-ocasio-cortez-releases-green-new-deal-outline


zizek

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3360 on: February 07, 2019, 06:56:06 PM »
Neven, I'd Love to change the system.  The problem is the 95% who don't.

I'd love to be renewable in electricity but it won't make a bit of difference, my power is already clean.  I'm already renewable in my heating.

I can't go renewable in my vehicles because I don't have that choice yet.

I need more choice in my ability to go FF free, but all I see are choices being taken away and a half hearted push to EV.

I need to get out more, thinking about it can be really depressing.

What 95% are you talking about? more than half the world lives in poverty and have minuscule carbon footprints. Not only that, I don't think they have much say when it comes to the excessive lifestyle of wealthy people.

Don't you own multiple properties? And vehicles? But yeah, I'm sure your renewable heating goes so far.

You should be depressed Neil. Because you are the problem. You have every option to downsize your life and call for the sort of necessary action required to combat change, but instead... You come here posting about how any progress that doesn't foster your lifestyle isn't possible..... You are the status quo. You try to find half-measures of reducing your personal footprint to ease your conscious. But nothing you do has any stakes. It's pathetic. You call me an idealist because I call for radical action. Myself and others are busting our assess in our communities -- sacrificing our time, professional prospects, and comfort in the hope we can transform our society into something that has any chance of combating climate change. And you do nothing. You are worse than useless. You are the problem.

etienne

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3361 on: February 07, 2019, 10:42:56 PM »
I'm sorry to continue out of topic, but we have a civilisation problem, not a personnal problem. Please remember it. A renewable energy transition is a civilisation change, and like in every change, some anticipate more than others. In the peak oil debate, somebody wrote something like "don't wait for the peak oil colapse, downsize now". It's a hard way, and I agree that it is depressing somedays, but there are also great success to be proud of.

NeilT

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3362 on: February 07, 2019, 11:39:54 PM »
Don't you own multiple properties? And vehicles? But yeah, I'm sure your renewable heating goes so far.

Yes, they are my pension. But, please, do tell me more about my incredibly wealthy and extravagant lifestyle that is blocking the move to renewables....

True, 4bn people live in poverty. But it is not the 4bn we need to motivate, it is the 3.5bn who are creating all the emissions.  Most of them don't want change, they just want someone else to step in and "fix it". After all that is what they pay them to do.

Anyway, sorry for driving this off topic.  I think that the political dimension is part and parcel of renewables but it does detract from the whole view of current technologies and their uptake.
Being right too soon is socially unacceptable.

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Lurk

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3363 on: February 08, 2019, 01:47:59 AM »
There's a thread for political discussions about the Yellow Vest protests https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,2510.0.html which do not belong here.

That being said the issue has nothing to do with a "price on carbon" and everything do do with the Macron Govt paying back his campaign supporters by cutting "wealth taxes" and then trying to pay for it by applying higher Petrol Excise on those least able to afford it - everyone else.

It's a Equity issue not a climate change action one. And it's got nothing to do with renewable energy either.

Please, I live in France, the GJ movement was triggered by the plan to radically rise the price of Diesel fuel, presented as a requirement to allow France to meet its commitments to the Paris accord. This was insult on top of injury from the mandating of a speed reduction from 90km/h to 80km/h on all roads lower than 3 vois, which had left the people simmering with rage when it was billed as another "paris accord" move to allow France to become compliant.

During the protests every speed camera within a 50km radius, of where I live, was destroyed by the GJ.  I live 500km from Paris too.

It's all very well saying that there is a "political" thread on the board.  But  constantly see, written here, that we must have a price on carbon before we can have truly pervasive renewables.

I have constantly maintained that a price on carbon is a political move, not a climate move and that it will never be supported by the voters.  So that we must find a better way of making renewables (and clean energy in general), more viable than carbon fuels.

When I point out that those political consequences have been seen, in full, in France, where support for renewables have just been slashed to the bone I'm told to go and discuss it in the politics forum.

For those who are not aware, France slashed the subsidies on Solar to 0%, making it impossible for anyone to recover the install cost of their roof top Solar. All models were based on the subsidies and because all installations were tied to EDF (the 85% government owned power utility), that meant there was no flexible market to pay more for the power.

This is not just happening in France.  The UK slashed rooftop solar subsidies.  Scotland, who are way over their Paris Accord commitments already, are slashing funding for renewable heating (they were heavily supporting renewable pellet burning CH), personal renewable energy and many other kinds of renewable energy.

All of these "incentives" are being transitioned to "taxes" on the consumer to force people off FF.

The outcome has been a disaster for the SNP, in Scotland and the Tories in the UK overall.  Not just Macron.

If you want to see renewable energy take its rightful place in the mix, then you are going to have to accept some direct realities of the political situation.

You're arguing about arguing. I don't care where you live you were and still are wrong. I don;t care what you think about carbon taxes being "political" and not climate related. I don't care about your expanding your off-topic rave into the UK and scotland either.

You are off-topic here gas-bagging about carbon taxes and yellow vests. Stop it. Read what Neven said and make that make a significant difference to your own understandings about the issues.
Solving Climate Change means changing 'The System' because nothing changes when nothing changes.
Each one of us must consider our deepest values, proceed to act from this standpoint alone, ignoring other voices of illusion, false hope, and distraction that might threaten to throw us off course.

Sebastian Jones

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3364 on: February 08, 2019, 05:00:27 AM »
The reality, just like Lurk is saying, is that all these cuts are made to benefit concentrated wealth, under the guise of climate accords or whatever. A carbon tax would work perfectly well, if you would transparently distribute all of the tax revenues to the population on a per capita basis.

If you use that tax money to either benefit concentrated wealth or bureaucracy, yes, people will get mad. And rightly so. But the system demands it. If you don't (want to) change the system, don't expect AGW to be solved any time soon.
Agreed Neven, and that is how the Canadian carbon tax has been designed. Where I live, the average person will receive a bigger quarterly rebate cheque than they pay in carbon tax. We are soaking  tourists and government operations do not receive a rebate. The general population seems fairly happy with the system. There are of course plenty of people that hate the current government and therefore oppose anything it implements. I am cautiously optimistic that a well designed and implemented carbon tax will be both socially acceptable and, as part of a suite of other actions, effective. Personally, I have criticized the tax for its overly generous exemptions of certain sectors such as aviation, fishing and mining (I am a fisherman).

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3365 on: February 08, 2019, 11:36:01 AM »
You're arguing about arguing. I don't care where you live you were and still are wrong. I don;t care what you think about carbon taxes being "political" and not climate related. I don't care about your expanding your off-topic rave into the UK and scotland either.

You clearly don't care about whether renewables will succeed or not.  You are not a realist.

I said something.  You said I was wrong.  I pointed out why you were wrong and you come back with this.

There is a place for blind, dogged, intransigent, determination.  The climate and renewable energy forum is not it.
Being right too soon is socially unacceptable.

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Ken Feldman

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3366 on: February 08, 2019, 09:02:22 PM »
Solar in Germany continues to increase despite losing subsidies:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-06/germany-s-biggest-solar-park-will-be-built-without-subsidies

Quote
Germany’s fourth-biggest utility will build the 175-megawatt Weesow-Willmersdorf plant over 164 hectares (405 acres) in Brandenburg outside of Berlin, EnBW said on Wednesday. Its power will feed wholesale markets with enough electricity for about 50,000 homes.

Quote
Solar power is staging a renaissance in growth in Germany after slumping earlier this decade when subsidies were cut. Plummeting solar equipment prices driven by China, along with lower battery storage costs, are fanning expansion of both utility-scale and retail installations.

etienne

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3367 on: February 08, 2019, 10:56:37 PM »
Well, there is a reason for more PV in Germany.

Here are comparative electricity costs in 2012. Germany is in blue.


It is a French advertisement, so there is no value provided for the countries that are cheaper than France.

NeilT

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3368 on: February 09, 2019, 09:37:45 AM »
Etienne,

Perhaps you didn't quite understand the advert.  What France is saying is that their electricity is the cheapest of the countries listed.  When you look at the installed PV figures and add the installed Wind figures, this tells a very different story.

There has been Huge criticism in Germany that Solar and Wind projects are being funded by the rest of the electricity consumers.  This chart is a very clear view that this is correct.  Also look at  Denmark.  Massively invested in Wind yet the cost of electricity is more than twice that in France.  In fact the highest in the list.  Tending to show that, for the return, offshore wind is the most expensive power you can generate.

The poster child of "renewable" energy is that it is cheap, in fact so cheap that our costs will plummet.

It is a skewing of the facts, to be true, because what we are seeing, today, is the start up and installation costs being borne by the consumers.  However there are very few people who will be super happy that their electricity costs will fall in 25-50 years so long as they pay double for the next 25 to 50 years.

The other point, not being made by this advert, but I'm pretty sure is being pushed, is that France is already 75% CO2 neutral at the point of production of their electricity.

If there were a bigger advert for a large push to Nuclear I don't know what it is.
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b_lumenkraft

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3369 on: February 09, 2019, 09:50:28 AM »
France has cheap energy because there is a lot of nuclear power in the grid. From power plants long paid for (also through governmental subsidies). What this chart ignores are the externalities. The French people will pay for all that nuclear waste to handle. Not via the electric bill but via taxes.

When German customer pays more via electric bill then say French, this is because it includes subsidies for renewable energy. See what politics did here? The subsidies we pay to the fossil fuel industry (yes, we still do that!!) is hidden in taxes.

oren

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3370 on: February 09, 2019, 10:55:06 AM »
For a country now starting on the renewable energy path, the situation would be quite different. PV and wind today cost far less than they did when Germany rolled out its renewable program.
In addition I suspect the German cost is born mainly by residential customers, skewing the data.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2019, 11:04:43 AM by oren »

Neven

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3371 on: February 09, 2019, 10:58:40 AM »
I believe some of the cost in Germany is also caused by utilities keeping the subsidies for themselves instead of giving back to the consumers. But it's a while since I watched a good documentary on the Energiewende.

As for what Blumenkraft said: +1. France's nuclear disposal and decommissioning is going to cost huge amounts of taxpayer money.
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gerontocrat

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3372 on: February 09, 2019, 11:15:54 AM »
Found a graph on composition of household electricity bill in Germany -  what a lot of taxes and surcharges. Germany is sensible - using current charges to consumers to help finance renewable energy investment. Most other countries seem to just borrow, borrow, and borrow, and when it comes to nuclear, just ignore the future decommissioning costs. Debt rules OK.

Germany's economy relies on engineering industries - energy intensive. They subsidise industry through electricity prices.

So comparing success or otherwise of energy policy in France and Germany simply through prices prices charged to consumers is of limited value, and may be downright misleading.
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b_lumenkraft

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3373 on: February 09, 2019, 11:23:22 AM »
Hey Neven,

i never heard of utilities keeping the subsidies for themselves. I will check this out though. I'll get back to you on that one.

For what i understand the Energiewende is working but not as fast as promised. Germany is ought to fail the 2020 emission goals. The electric power sector is on track with ~43% renewable in the grid, so the subsidies worked here at least. The problem is at the carbon tax side. Corporations get CO2 certificates for basically no money at the moment, but they are getting more scarce now. A market that would drive CO2 taxes up seems to develop. (*fingers crossed*)

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3374 on: February 09, 2019, 11:31:56 AM »
Hey Gerontocrat,

i completely agree.

I also want to add, after ~10 years all these solar panels and windmills are paid for. From then on, there will be cheap energy for the customers and a great margin for the producer. Win-win in my eyes.

Neven

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3375 on: February 09, 2019, 12:02:44 PM »
Hey Neven,

i never heard of utilities keeping the subsidies for themselves. I will check this out though. I'll get back to you on that one.

It was more something along the lines of 'renewables make things cheaper at certain times, but the utilities (RWE, etc) keep those profits for themselves, instead of distributing back to the German people who made those renewables possible in the first place'.
Il faut comparer, comparer, comparer, et cultiver notre jardin

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3376 on: February 09, 2019, 12:57:17 PM »
Ah, i think you are referring to the negative prices at the Strombörse (power market) Neven.

Sometimes, say, a windy and sunny day in spring when the grid is 100% full with renewables, RWE cannot just turn off coal and nuclear plants because they are needed soon after anyway.

Prices for power will now turn negative at the Strombörse and customer (like say France or Poland) will get money if they buy power.

This is insanely absurd if you think of it, but it's a market after all with all its negative implications. And overall it's a minor effect since this is happening only a few days per year.

I would prefer a (totally socialistic) European power agency owning the grid and managing all this but this is not the political will at the moment.

oren

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3377 on: February 09, 2019, 02:05:41 PM »
I think putting a lot of the cost of renewable deployment on the shoulders of residential customers who are also voters runs the risk of their voting against renewable policies. Voters are often focused on short term issues.

b_lumenkraft

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3378 on: February 09, 2019, 02:18:23 PM »
Correct! There was a lot of hate in Germany over this law (Erneuerbare Energien Gesetz) fired by corporate shills releasing fake studies and all sorts of fearmongering. They painted a picture that a normal family would pay a 1k euro premium due to this. Gladly the situation has calmed down now.

Sigmetnow

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3379 on: February 09, 2019, 05:50:17 PM »
Australia is on track to meet its Paris climate commitments five years earlier than expected — in 2025 — according to new research from the Australian National University.
Quote
Per capita, the country is installing renewable energy faster than China, Japan, the United States, and the European Union.

"The electricity sector is on track to deliver Australia's entire Paris emissions reduction targets five years early, in 2025, without the need for any creative accounting," lead researcher Professor Andrew Blakers said.

"We have excellent wind, excellent sun, a very vigorous rooftop solar industry and very experienced ground-mounted solar farm and wind farm industry."

Co-researcher Matthew Stocks said cheaper renewable energy was replacing expensive coal-fired power, meaning the cost of achieving the 2030 carbon emission targets in the Paris Agreement would be zero.

"Nearly all of the new power stations are either PV [photovoltaic solar] or wind. We anticipate that this will continue into the future," Dr Stocks said. ...
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-02-08/australia-ahead-of-paris-agreement-target-by-five-years/10789810
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Shared Humanity

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3380 on: February 09, 2019, 07:06:07 PM »
Haven't been visiting the Policy and Solutions threads much in the last several months. Thought I'd stop by to get a dose of "Happy Talk". Glad to see everyone is hard at work!  :)

Lurk

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3381 on: February 10, 2019, 06:30:42 AM »
Maybe a good time to buy Exxon shares?


“Demand for oil is rising and the energy industry, in America and globally, is planning multi-trillion-dollar investments to satisfy it. No firm embodies this strategy better than ExxonMobil, the giant that rivals admire and green activists love to hate. As our briefing explains, it plans to pump 25% more oil and gas in 2025 than in 2017."


https://www.economist.com/leaders/2019/02/09/the-truth-about-big-oil-and-climate-change?utm_source=Fareed%27s+Global+Briefing&utm_campaign=2448ea7081-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2019_02_08_09_43&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_6f2e93382a-2448ea7081-100221337
Solving Climate Change means changing 'The System' because nothing changes when nothing changes.
Each one of us must consider our deepest values, proceed to act from this standpoint alone, ignoring other voices of illusion, false hope, and distraction that might threaten to throw us off course.

Zythryn

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3382 on: February 10, 2019, 05:42:14 PM »
...


It is a skewing of the facts, to be true, because what we are seeing, today, is the start up and installation costs being borne by the consumers.  However there are very few people who will be super happy that their electricity costs will fall in 25-50 years so long as they pay double for the next 25 to 50 years.

...

Just to note, this pricing pattern isn't universal.
Three neighboring states in the USA, Wisconsin, Minnesota and Iowa have varying levels of renewables.
Wisconsin's retail electric prices are the highest, Minnesota's in the middle, and Iowa's the cheapest.
Iowa has the largest percentage of renewables, Minnesota is in the middle, and Wisconsin has the smallest level of renewables.

Electricity costs rely on many factors and I don't believe you can draw conclusions by just looking at the retail costs.

Ken Feldman

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3383 on: February 11, 2019, 09:01:43 PM »
Renewables are now 21% of USA's capacity, up from 16% five years ago:

https://solarindustrymag.com/ferc-data-renewables-now-21-of-u-s-energy-capacity/

Quote
FERC’s numbers also reveal that renewable sources now account for 21.0% of total available installed U.S. generating capacity. Five years ago, renewables were 16.0%. Their total installed generating capacity has increased by 35.6% over the past half-decade (from 185.16 GW to 250.99 GW). Utility-scale solar has now reached 3.0% of the nation’s generating capacity while hydropower and wind account for 8.4% and 7.9%, respectively.

Moreover, the same report indicates that proposed generation and retirements over the next three years include net capacity additions by renewable sources of 183,816 MW. That is 4.2 times greater than the net new additions listed for coal, oil and natural gas combined (43,312 MW).

Net proposed generation additions from wind alone total 97,455 MW, while those from solar are 70,902 MW – each greater than that listed for natural gas (59,900 MW). Within just the past month (since the release of FERC’s November 2018 “Energy Infrastructure Update” report), the amount of net new solar and wind proposed to be added by January 2022 has increased by 9.1%, from 154,344 MW to 168,357 MW.

Meanwhile, FERC lists only a single new 17 MW coal unit for the upcoming three-year period but 15,244 MW in retirements. Oil will also decline by 1,361 MW.

rboyd

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3384 on: February 11, 2019, 09:40:01 PM »
Renewables are now 21% of USA's capacity, up from 16% five years ago:

https://solarindustrymag.com/ferc-data-renewables-now-21-of-u-s-energy-capacity/

Capacity is not output, and wind and solar have significantly lower capacity utilization rates (15-30%) than natural gas (40%+) coal (70%), nuclear (90%) and even hydro-electric (40%). So counting installed capacity overstates the actual share in generation. This is a mistake that I have seen across many "green" sites.

Renewables currently account for about 18% of US electricity generation, with wind (6.4%) and solar (2.4%) being about 8.8%. Most of the rest of renewables is hydro, for which there is very limited possibilities for growth in the US.

US wind capacity has been increasing at about 8%-10% over the past four years (doubling rate of 8 years), well below the peak growth rate set in 2012. The peak growth for US solar was 2016, with a fall in 2017 and possible stabilization in 2018/2019 (affected by the tariff on imported panels). So we could possibly be at 30% renewable generation within about 10 years - assuming the current trend of no growth in overall US electricity generation.

https://cleantechnica.com/2018/11/30/renewables-account-for-18-of-us-electricity-generation/

https://www.awea.org/resources/publications-and-reports/market-reports/2018-u-s-wind-industry-market-reports

https://www.seia.org/research-resources/solar-market-insight-report-2018-q4

TerryM

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3385 on: February 11, 2019, 11:34:56 PM »
rboyd


The measured growth of renewables that you've noted will have a hard time keeping up with the additional load that EV's are expected to require. Rather than closing down a coal plant to replace it with solar and wind, all three will be needed just to service the additional demand.


I fear that even as we increase the percentage of renewable energy, we'll also increase our use of ff generated electricity.


Terry

James Lovejoy

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3386 on: February 12, 2019, 12:20:46 AM »
If you look at Ken Feldman's post, your fears are unlikely.

He quotes a report of proposed net renewable installation of 183,800 million watts in 3 years.  Round to approx 60,000 million watts per year or 60 gigawatts per year.

If you assume each eV travels 12,000 miles a year at 0.36 kWh per year that would be 4080 kWh per car per year.

If you also assume a 25% capacity factor for renewables, that would be 2190 kWh/year for each kW installed.

That would mean that each eV need 2 kW installed.  By those calculations, the 60,000 million watt addition of renewables would support 30 million additional new eVs each year.

At that rate of renewable installation, even when we get to the point where every gas vehicle junked is replaced by a new eV, we still have additional capacity to replace ff electicity generation.

Ken Feldman

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3387 on: February 12, 2019, 12:48:26 AM »
A huge number of utility scale solar projects are being planned in the US:

https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2019/01/01/solar-tsunami/

Quote
there is an unprecedented, massive volume of solar projects that is underway in the United States. Research conducted by pv magazine USA has uncovered more than 139 GWac of solar projects which have applied for interconnection with six grid operators (CAISO, NYISO, ISO-NE, MISO, PJM, ERCOT) by the end of December 2018, spanning the Northeast, Midwest, California and Texas.

And since that story was published, more projects have been planned:

https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2019/02/11/texas-solar-market-is-about-to-catch-fire/

Quote
At the beginning of this year, pv magazine USA reported on the flood of projects in the interconnection queues of regional grid operators, finding 139 GWac of projects in five grids. Since that time, we found another 26 GWac of projects in the Southwest Power Pool queue, bringing that total to 165 GWac.

But that was a snapshot, and since that time project development has proceeded – particularly in one of the most active regions, the Electric Reliability Council of Texas (ERCOT), which covers the large majority of Texas’ area and population.

In December, the volume of solar applications in ERCOT’s interconnection queue exceeded those of wind for the first time, at over 40 GWac. But it didn’t stop there, and the January report from ERCOT published earlier this month finds a stunning 43.5 GWac of solar projects, most of which are in West Texas with some in the Panhandle and South Texas, and even a few on the Gulf Coast.

Ken Feldman

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3388 on: February 12, 2019, 12:58:35 AM »
Florida utility companies are finally embracing solar:

https://www.csmonitor.com/Environment/2019/0211/Putting-the-sun-in-Sunshine-State-Florida-s-about-face-on-solar-power

Quote
“The utilities are putting out solar like you wouldn’t believe,” says James Fenton, director of the University of Central Florida’s Florida Solar Energy Center.

Florida power companies haven't always been so solar-friendly. In 2016 the industry spent $20 million on a ballot initiative that could have undercut the expansion of residential solar power. But as solar has become more economically viable, the state’s utility companies now see opportunity more than competition in the technology.

Florida utilities’ newfound embrace for solar power echoes trends seen across the country, as the renewable energy source has shifted from a fringe indulgence for wealthy environmentalists to becoming a conventional part of power production.

“Five years ago it was more of an emerging technology,” says Maggie Clark, senior manager of state affairs for the Southeast region at the Solar Energy Industries Association (SEIA). “As it’s become a mainstream energy resource,” she says, “there’s an element of comfort with it [for utilities,] as just any other generating asset.”

Quote
On Jan. 31 the state’s largest power company, Florida Power & Light, fired up more than a million solar panels totaling nearly 300 megawatts of capacity across four new solar fields, including the Miami-Dade County project. FPL brought eight such power plants online in 2018, bringing the company’s total solar power capacity to more than 1,200 megawatts. And in January, FPL pledged to install an additional 30 million panels by 2030, which could multiply the utility’s solar-generated electricity by almost 10-fold. The state’s next largest power provider, Duke Energy Florida, also has plans to have more than 700 megawatts worth of solar power by 2023.

Ken Feldman

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3389 on: February 12, 2019, 01:10:03 AM »
Here's another look at Australia's renewable energy production:

https://cleantechnica.com/2019/02/08/grid-scale-solar-power-tripled-in-australia-in-2018-as-renewables-met-20-of-energy-output/

Quote
Tristan Edis, GEM’s director of analysis and advisory, says, “For wind, the 26% jump in generation this year came after almost no growth in 2017. Rooftop solar has had more steady additions of generation but 2018 was exceptional, with the incremental new generation 86% greater than the average annual additions of 2015-2017. Yet it was large scale solar farms that really jumped out of the blocks in 2018, with generation leaping up by almost 300% on the prior year.”

Quote
PV Magazine Australia adds the GEM December report also says more than 3.2 GW of large scale solar projects were under construction at the end of December, bringing the total of close to 7.15 GW when wind is included. The solar boom is bringing good news for the employment sector as well. Nearly 7,700 people are involved in utility scale solar project construction at the present time in Australia.

Turning to rooftops, GEM found 22,010 PV systems were installed in December. New South Wales, and the Australian Capital Territory led all other regions with 5,700 systems combined followed by Victoria with 5,400; Queensland with 5,300, Western Australia 3,150, South Australia 1,900, the Northern Territory 269; and Tasmania (262).

Despite the intransigence of its national leaders, Australia is embracing renewables faster than most other countries and may be the first to get to 100% renewable energy. As prices for wind, solar, and storage continue to fall, the current shift to wind and solar power will continue to accelerate.

Lurk

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3390 on: February 12, 2019, 02:53:23 AM »
A huge number of utility scale solar projects are being planned in the US:

https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2019/01/01/solar-tsunami/

Quote
there is an unprecedented, massive volume of solar projects that is underway in the United States. Research conducted by pv magazine USA has uncovered more than 139 GWac of solar projects which have applied for interconnection with six grid operators (CAISO, NYISO, ISO-NE, MISO, PJM, ERCOT) by the end of December 2018, spanning the Northeast, Midwest, California and Texas.

And since that story was published, more projects have been planned:

https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2019/02/11/texas-solar-market-is-about-to-catch-fire/

Quote
At the beginning of this year, pv magazine USA reported on the flood of projects in the interconnection queues of regional grid operators, finding 139 GWac of projects in five grids. Since that time, we found another 26 GWac of projects in the Southwest Power Pool queue, bringing that total to 165 GWac.

But that was a snapshot, and since that time project development has proceeded – particularly in one of the most active regions, the Electric Reliability Council of Texas (ERCOT), which covers the large majority of Texas’ area and population.

In December, the volume of solar applications in ERCOT’s interconnection queue exceeded those of wind for the first time, at over 40 GWac. But it didn’t stop there, and the January report from ERCOT published earlier this month finds a stunning 43.5 GWac of solar projects, most of which are in West Texas with some in the Panhandle and South Texas, and even a few on the Gulf Coast.

Another quote:
Quote
But as any developer will tell you, not all of that is going to get built. In fact, most of it won’t. Which leaves a question that is hard to answer: How much will?
https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2019/02/11/texas-solar-market-is-about-to-catch-fire/

The article failed to report that Jan 2019 was a record month for Project Cancellations in Project #s ie 20 and in MW ie 4GW canned. ie 4% of the total "potential developments" in the study program were cancelled in one month.

You can read the GIS report in detail here:
http://mis.ercot.com/misapp/GetReports.do?reportTypeId=15933&reportTitle=GIS%20Report&showHTMLView=&mimicKey

There is no data on which projects have actually begun construction yet. While only 12.45% or 61 Projects out of the 489 in total have had their "SS Completed, FIS Completed, IA" approved to date - that meaning they are more likely to proceed.

10.4GW of new Gas supply is also in the pipeline for Approvals btw. While activity is higher now than previously in the "renewable investment/ project planning" which is a positive sign for Texas the Headline Hype (based solely on the GIS report ) by PV mag is somewhat overstated to say / claim (falsely) .... Texas’ solar market is about to catch fire ...  Texas is getting ready for a major boom in its utility-scale solar market.

Relative to new Coal power it may look like "a boom" to some.

For context:

In 2016, Texas was the leading oil-producing state, producing more than one-third of the nation's crude oil.
As of January 2017, the 29 petroleum refineries in Texas were able to process more than 5.6 million barrels of crude oil per day and accounted for 30% of total U.S. refining capacity.
Texas accounted for more than 25% of U.S. marketed natural gas production in 2016, making it the leading natural gas producer among the states.
Texas leads the nation in wind-powered generation capacity with more than 21,450 megawatts; since 2014, Texas wind turbines have produced more electricity than both of the state's two nuclear power plants.
Texas is the nation's largest producer of lignite coal. About 40% of the coal-fired power plants in Texas burn lignite for electricity generation
[ the dirtiest most polluting High GHG emitting coal ]

Electricity Generation ( Not capacity )
Nuclear 2.9 GW
Non-Hyro renewable 5.9 GW = 16.5% of Total  - Or only 27.7% of Installed Wind Capacity
Coal 9.5 GW
Gas 18.7 GW = 50.5% of Total
Total 37.0 GW

https://www.eia.gov/state/?sid=TX

Therefore when the article says that "If even the 1,232 MWac of projects which have financing and notice to proceed come online, this will be the first year that Texas installs more than 1 GW of solar. "

Meaning the actual Electricity Generation might increase by some ~344 MW of electricity over a full year.

If this is the case then Lignite/Coal "could" go from generating 9.5 GW down to 9.15 GW each year. Certainly the right direction sought. But a "boom" for renewable energy it is not, imo.

Doesn't this place the data presented (misrepresented?) by PV Mag into a better more accurate Context and a more  compelling Perspective? I think it does. Not only is it more accurate but it's much more Honest and Truthful don't you think?
Solving Climate Change means changing 'The System' because nothing changes when nothing changes.
Each one of us must consider our deepest values, proceed to act from this standpoint alone, ignoring other voices of illusion, false hope, and distraction that might threaten to throw us off course.

Sigmetnow

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3391 on: February 12, 2019, 09:44:43 PM »
Los Angeles, California

LA scraps plan to rebuild 3 gas plants, moves towards 100% renewable energy
Quote
Los Angeles Mayor Eric Garcetti on Monday said the city would abandon plans to rebuild three coastal gas-fired power plants, and instead will focus on energy storage and other clean energy technology as it pursues a 100% renewables goal.

• Garcetti said his office concluded the city's Department of Water and Power (LADWP) could maintain reliability if the 326 MW Scattergood gas plant is retired by 2024 and two other plants totaling 799 MW of capacity are mothballed five years later, according to The Los Angeles Times.

• The decision marks the end of a multi-year debate over the city's plan to invest $2.2 billion in gas-fired power plants, and follows a decision by state lawmakers last year to pursue a 100% clean energy target by 2045.

California has looked to energy storage and renewables as a replacement for some gas-fired power plants, and Garcetti's decision builds on that trend. ...
https://www.utilitydive.com/news/la-scraps-plan-to-rebuild-3-gas-plants-moves-towards-100-renewable-energy/548218/
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Sigmetnow

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3392 on: February 13, 2019, 08:09:58 PM »
U.S. Northwest:

Oregon to get groundbreaking large-scale wind/solar/storage facility
Quote
A new energy facility in eastern Oregon will be the first of its kind in the U.S., combining wind power, solar power, and battery storage on a large-scale.

Portland General Electric and NextEra Energy Resources announced plans for the Wheatridge Renewable Energy Facility today. The new facility will combine 300 megawatts of wind generation, 50 MW of solar generation, and 30 MW of battery storage.

NextEra plans to break ground this year. The wind component of the facility, powered by 120 turbines, is expected to be fully completed by December 2020. Construction of the solar and battery components is set for 2021.

The Morrow County-based facility will be capable of powering 100,000 homes, and will allow Portland General Electric to reach roughly 50 percent of all its customers’ power needs with emissions-free generation. ...
https://electrek.co/2019/02/13/oregon-to-get-groundbreaking-large-scale-wind-solar-storage-facility/
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Ken Feldman

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3393 on: February 13, 2019, 08:52:24 PM »
Africa and the Middle East are expected to more than double their wind energy by 2023:

https://cleantechnica.com/2019/02/12/africa-middle-east-installed-close-to-1-gigawatt-of-new-wind-in-2018/

Quote
While the Africa and Middle East region is a comparatively small market for wind energy when taken against the Americas, Asia, or Europe, it is nevertheless the focus of considerable attention of late, as highlighted by the latest figures published by the Global Wind Energy Council (GWEC) this week in advance of its anticipated Global Wind Report, the Council’s flagship publication which is due out in April. Specifically, a total of 962 MW was installed in 2018, up 55% on 2017 levels, and GWEC is expecting a further 6.5 GW of new capacity will be added by 2023 — more than double the current regional installed capacity of 5.7 GW.

Further good news for the region is the distribution of new capacity expanded in 2018. In 2017, only 621 MW of new capacity was brought online, and this only in South Africa, despite increased activity in Kenya and Morocco. The Global Wind Energy Council’s predictions that these projects were awaiting grid connection in 2018 came to fruition, as new capacity figures for the region show. Egypt brought online a total of 380 MW, followed by Kenya with 310 MW, and Morocco with 120 MW.

More specifically, Kenya’s 310 MW of new wind capacity was brought online in one hit with the completion in December of the Lake Turkana Wind Power project, while Morocco’s new capacity was similarly brought online at once in July with the completion of the 120 MW Khalladi wind farm in Tangiers, in the country’s northwest. Meanwhile, Egypt’s 380 MW was brought online across several projects under the Gabal Al-Zayt project banner.

Ken Feldman

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3394 on: February 13, 2019, 09:33:38 PM »
I posted this in the coal section and am reposting here with a key section bolded:

https://energy.economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/power/govt-may-cancel-50-gw-coal-based-power-projects-additional-46-gw-facing-risk-sp-global/67960857

Quote
New Delhi: The Indian government might cancel about 50 gigawatt (GW) of coal-based power projects in the near future, according to S&P Global Platts. An additional 46 GW coal-based capacity, currently under construction, is also at risk.

"Over the past couple of years, coal projects of over 37 GW have been deferred with another 13 GW delayed in India and most likely will be cancelled. About 46 GW of coal projects are currently under construction but their future is uncertain," said Bruno Brunetti, power analyst, S&P Global Platts, that provides energy price benchmark assesments.

He also said solar power in auctions conducted in 2018 were as low as Rs 2.4 per kilowatt hour (kWh), equivalent to around $33.6 per megawatt hour (MWh). "This has placed coal newbuilds in a considerably more difficult position, especially given that the bottlenecks in the rail and infrastructure have led to fuel availability issues," Brunetti said in an interview with ETEnergyworld.

As I've stated before, the fact that new solar and wind installations are less expensive than existing coal plants is a game-changer.  We're now seeing coal plants under construction being cancelled before they even begin operating.

Ken Feldman

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3395 on: February 13, 2019, 11:06:29 PM »
Capacity is not output, and wind and solar have significantly lower capacity utilization rates (15-30%) than natural gas (40%+) coal (70%), nuclear (90%) and even hydro-electric (40%). So counting installed capacity overstates the actual share in generation. This is a mistake that I have seen across many "green" sites.
Electricity Generation ( Not capacity )
Nuclear 2.9 GW
Non-Hyro renewable 5.9 GW = 16.5% of Total  - Or only 27.7% of Installed Wind Capacity
Coal 9.5 GW
Gas 18.7 GW = 50.5% of Total
Total 37.0 GW
https://www.eia.gov/state/?sid=TX
Therefore when the article says that "If even the 1,232 MWac of projects which have financing and notice to proceed come online, this will be the first year that Texas installs more than 1 GW of solar. "
Meaning the actual Electricity Generation might increase by some ~344 MW of electricity over a full year.
If this is the case then Lignite/Coal "could" go from generating 9.5 GW down to 9.15 GW each year. Certainly the right direction sought. But a "boom" for renewable energy it is not, imo.

When dissing renewables, opponents often raise the "capacity factor argument".  This article from 2015 explains why it's not as big a problem as the fossil fuel or nuclear advocates would have you believe:

https://www.treehugger.com/renewable-energy/death-capacity-factor-how-wind-solar-ultimately-win-game.html

Quote
Then we come to the real Achilles' heel of renewable energy: their relatively low capacity factor. What this means in practice is that if you build a solar system with a capacity of 100 megawatts, in practice it won't produce energy at that level all the time. So you might get 100 MW out of it when the sun is out, but at night or on cloudy days, you don't. If you average it all, you might only get a 20% capacity factor. But don't worry, when we look at the cost of 1kWh of wind or solar, we're talking about actually produced energy, so the capacity factor is embedded in that price.

The reason why this matters so much has to do with one of the big strengths of wind and solar: Once the wind turbines or the solar panels are installed and paid for, the power produced has basically a marginal cost very close to zero.

It's very hard for a grid operator or power company to say no to free power once it has access to it, so that clean energy takes precedence on more expensive power from coal and natural gas plants.

As Bloomberg explains: "It’s a self-reinforcing cycle. As more renewables are installed, coal and natural gas plants are used less. As coal and gas are used less, the cost of using them to generate electricity goes up. As the cost of coal and gas power rises, more renewables will be installed."

The table above shows how the capacity factors of coal and natural gas are starting to be affected, while wind and solar are starting to do better because bigger and taller wind turbines catch more wind and more solar is being installed in the U.S. Southwest where sunny days are more frequent.

It's kind of like a flywheel, and the more solar panels we install, the more wind turbines are built, the faster it spins. At some point, doesn't make any sense to run fossil fuels on sunny or windy days, and overall capacity factors go down enough that prices are simply not competitive with storage, and rather than build new natural gas plants, utilities will simply buy more renewables combined with storage.

And here are the actual capacity factors for non-fossil fuel electricity in the US compiled by the EIA:

https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php?action=post;topic=256.3350;last_msg=188910

The averages for 2018 are still preliminary, but the data from 2013 through 2017 show that wind capacity factors have been increasing from 32% up to 34.6%.  Newer wind farms can achieve greater than 40% capacity due to improvements in turbine construction and siting considerations.

Lurk

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3396 on: February 14, 2019, 12:02:03 AM »
Quote
explains why it's not as big a problem as the fossil fuel or nuclear advocates would have you believe:

fwiw to clear up any false assumptions or misunderstandings:

1) I am not a fossil fuel advocate
2) I am not interested in making people "believe" anything.
3) I am NOT repeat NOT dissing Renewable energy.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 09:51:33 AM by Lurk »
Solving Climate Change means changing 'The System' because nothing changes when nothing changes.
Each one of us must consider our deepest values, proceed to act from this standpoint alone, ignoring other voices of illusion, false hope, and distraction that might threaten to throw us off course.

sidd

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3397 on: February 14, 2019, 06:52:15 AM »
The merit order effect and falling battery prices will kill off the gas peakers shortly after coal.

Nukes got a lil while to die, too much sunk cost.

sidd

Lurk

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3398 on: February 14, 2019, 09:53:49 AM »
The merit order effect and falling battery prices will kill off the gas peakers shortly after coal.

Nukes got a lil while to die, too much sunk cost.

sidd

Every technology ever invented and pushed into the mainstream has it's unexpected long term negatives and social downside. Let's call it Lurk's Law? ;)
Solving Climate Change means changing 'The System' because nothing changes when nothing changes.
Each one of us must consider our deepest values, proceed to act from this standpoint alone, ignoring other voices of illusion, false hope, and distraction that might threaten to throw us off course.

etienne

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Re: Renewable Energy
« Reply #3399 on: February 14, 2019, 03:16:56 PM »
The merit order effect and falling battery prices will kill off the gas peakers shortly after coal.

Nukes got a lil while to die, too much sunk cost.

sidd
Renewable production is predictable and can't have a major problem because it is mainly distributed on large areas. Batteries are very good to balance it, but the issue will be base load. What to do if total renewable production doesn't match total consumption. This will make base load valuable. The issue will not be the GW that are required during a short time, but the MWh (or GWh, I don't know) that are missing from the renewable production. During the winter, CHP can be used (it also works with gasified wood), but what about the fall (summer will probably have enough sun to cover the need).

Since this would not be an "all year long" need, nuclear would not be a good solution, too expensive (and, personal point of view, too dangerous anyway). Maybe gas peakers will become gas base loaders.