Support the Arctic Sea Ice Forum and Blog

Author Topic: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History  (Read 3576 times)

Sterks

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 265
  • Member # 1000
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 11
  • Likes Given: 17
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #200 on: March 08, 2019, 08:39:28 PM »
As I've understood it, US mainstream media is selling the narrative that people in socialist Venezuela are starving because there's no food and therefore Trump/Bolton/Abrams/Pompeo are sending humanitarian aid, whereas they are meddling and pushing for regime change to force Venezuela to join the neoliberal economics party, so they and their oligarch buddies can enrich themselves with Venezuelan oil.

If you are implying that it's all because Maduro can't handle the hyperinflation, and so now some Harvard agent can rightfully proclaim himself king, with the entire world simply ignoring international law and accepting him as such, then you are wrong.
Didn’t want to come back to this thread but curiosity killed the cat... and Wow I must say I am surprised you believe these distorted facts just like that. I thought I had seen everything from the MAGA tribe, but apparently the far left cant escape from their own stultifying set of myths...
Anyway this is an interesting video of a venezuelan living in America and trying to explain reality from confusion in the least possible ideological position.
And I lie you not, I have heard narrative along same lines told to me by Venezuelan refugees in Madrid, people that left their country with not much apart from willing to have a life with dignity. This Already started going south from the times of the other mofo, the insufferable Chaves, now happily sleeping the eternal dream after screwing all he could.
Confy in your cab in Northrn Europe? Enjoy! We are really lucky people.



Neven

  • Administrator
  • ASIF Royalty
  • *****
  • Posts: 6325
    • View Profile
    • Arctic Sea Ice Blog
  • Liked: 280
  • Likes Given: 195
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #201 on: March 08, 2019, 09:28:13 PM »
Again, it's beside the point. There are dozens of countries similar to Venezuela and worse, but there's an excessive focus on Venezuela for the reasons I have mentioned several times now (oil, halting the spread of socialism both in the US and abroad). Why do we have to partake in this excessive focus which is arbitrary and serves to push narratives that benefit neoconservatism and neoliberalism (in other words, the things that are causing AGW and all kinds of other global misery, just so concentrated wealth can grow even bigger and more concentrated)?

Just by engaging in these discussions about the 'facts', you are helping Trump and the GOP. Just like climate risk deniers, they control the conversation by forcing their talking points on you.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2019, 09:39:19 PM by Neven »
Il faut comparer, comparer, comparer, et cultiver notre jardin

Neven

  • Administrator
  • ASIF Royalty
  • *****
  • Posts: 6325
    • View Profile
    • Arctic Sea Ice Blog
  • Liked: 280
  • Likes Given: 195
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #202 on: March 08, 2019, 09:40:58 PM »
Thankfully, there are other voices in the US that go beyond the irrelevant narratives:

Il faut comparer, comparer, comparer, et cultiver notre jardin

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #203 on: March 09, 2019, 02:06:58 AM »
Sanders: I think the evidence is clear that the last election in Venezuela was not a free and fair election, and under international supervision, I want to see a free and fair election.

Which elections is he speaking about - I want to be sure.

The Presidential Election in 2018?

Or the last election for the Constituent Assembly?

Or the Constitutional Assembly Referendum?

Or the last election for the National Assembly where Guaido won his Assembly seat?

Or the last election for the eternally rotating seat of "President" of the National Assembly (the equivalent to being elected as the US House Speaker) ?

PS question:

Why do you keep picking on Neven Rob? As opposed to pointing out all the "errors" of fact and the many "disturbing" opinions found in my comments/posts?

You are coming across like you're on a personal crusade against Neven. Is his "opinion" far more important to you than the poor suffering souls in Venezuela? It sure looks like it. But I could be wrong, which is why I ask openly. :)

When will you have the courage and moral virtue to admit you don't know what you are talking about here? Are spreading false information here and acting as a Neoliberal Corporatists Donald Trump shill and nothing like a Progressive/Liberal pro-climate change action Bernie Sanders supporter - but instead operating as a typical Right Wing Warmongering Conservative GOP Voter?

I ask because that is precisely what you sound like Rob. Where is the Nuanced evidence based long term big-picture analysis? It's literally missing in action! :)
« Last Edit: March 09, 2019, 04:10:32 AM by Lurk »
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #204 on: March 09, 2019, 02:13:07 AM »
German ambassador to Venezuela declared persona non grata

....who is backed by China, Russia and Turkey.

Plus over 70% of all nations of the world who represent even more the population of the world.

Denying the facts and not reporting on them does not make those facts go away Rob. That's what Propagandists do isn't it?

Maybe DW is just another arm of the Global Neoliberal MIC octopussy? Where the Ambassador is one of it's henchmen playing a role? :)


Democractic Party Rep. Ro Khanna says:
Quote
I was just in Venezuela what
04:49
is crippling the country is the economic
04:52
sanctions the government does not have
04:54
enough money to pay wages take care of
04:58
the needs of the people I suppose that
05:00
is the very effect that the Trump
05:02
administration wants to have


The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, a Michelle Barcia, the former President of Chile said:
Quote
this situation has been
03:22
exacerbated by [US] sanctions and the
03:24
resulting current political economic
03:27
social institutional crisis is alarming

Why are you supporting the starvation, ill health and deaths of everyday Venezuelans Rob?

See, you are not the only person who can ask really manipulative questions of others to smear them. :)
« Last Edit: March 09, 2019, 04:17:08 AM by Lurk »
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #205 on: March 09, 2019, 03:33:19 AM »
Anyway this is an interesting video of a venezuelan living in America and trying to explain reality from confusion in the least possible ideological position.

LOL oh boy that really made me cry laughing.

Quote
And I lie you not, I have heard narrative along same lines told to me by Venezuelan refugees in Madrid, people that left their country with not much apart from willing to have a life with dignity.

With their white skin and suit case full of US Dollars and jewellery.  :)

Damn if only I had seen this 5 minute "fact filled" rant by a wealthy well-to-do upper class white American Jewish lady on a couch!

Think of all the time I could have saved looking up historical and present day facts and the opinions of professionals and others from in and out of Venezuela. Man am I an idiot or what?
Quote

As a white Latina with a Jewish last name. [...] I think it's interesting to look at my family history, because my family history is a lot about immigration. On my father's side my grandparents were Holocaust survivors that went to Venezuela. On my mother's side it's Cuban exiles from Fidel Castro's regime. And my parents found each other — first generation Venezuelans. I was second generation Venezuelan and then I had to leave. So it's a lot of moving, and a lot of creating a new home in a new place.

And I feel very very proud to be Venezuelan. Particularly because the Venezuela that I was taught of was the Venezuela of inclusion, the Venezuela that opened its doors to immigrants. The Venezuela where the son of a Jewish family met a Cuban exile and had a child.
https://www.npr.org/2016/03/05/469211567/a-comedian-rants-on-different-latino-cultures

Yes, it is an Ideology free zone there for sure.

Quote
Joanna Hausmann is a Venezuelan-American comedian, writer, and actor who is critical of Nicolás Maduro’s authoritarian regime in Venezuela.
https://oslofreedomforum.com/speakers/joanna-hausmann
Quote
Related Pages Jorge Ramos Journalist (dig deeper if you dare)
https://www.facebook.com/joannahausmanncomedy/
Quote
Another Ideology free zone full of facts
https://www.instagram.com/johaus/?hl=en


Quote
Joanna Hausmann Jatar -- with comments by Jorge Ramos Journalist
‏Verified account @Joannahausmann
Feb 26
My grandma passed away because of lack of medicine. My uncle is imprisoned for posting articles against the government. My cousin was shot in a protest. My extended family has lost their life savings. But sure Brad, go ahead and tell me I don't understand Venezuela.
https://twitter.com/joannahausmann?lang=en

Joanna, you don't understand Venezuela or much else either. :)

Ideology free-zone here: Wikipedia says
Quote
She is the daughter of Harvard University economist Ricardo Hausmann, as well as journalist and former CNN en Español host, Ana Julia Jatar.

Her brother is Michel Hausmann, a Venezuelan theater director who endured a case of discrimination after an orchestra cancelled their collaboration with his production of Fiddler on the Roof, citing their concern for government funding under Hugo Chávez, who had been [accused of] inciting antisemitism.

[ Who hasn't been accused of anti-Semitism? It's a much shorter list as it has become an international Sport these days! ]

She is also the niece of well-known Venezuelan political prisoner, Braulio Jatar.

She is a [...]  vocal critic of the government of Nicolas Maduro in her native Venezuela.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joanna_Hausmann

No Ideology anywhere to be seen - not a bit! :)

Quote
Braulio Jatar Alonso
@BraulioJatarA

translated Tweet goes like this: Let us be clear that for the future of Venezuela, it is necessary to understand its past beyond twenty years. ["Communism has never come to power in a country that was not interrupted by war or corruption or, both"] John F. Kennedy
https://twitter.com/brauliojatara?lang=en

Quote
Braulio Jatar
Reporte Confidencial | Imprisoned in Venezuela | September 03, 2016

 a day after he reported on an anti-government protest, according to news reports and his wife, with whom CPJ spoke. [...] his sister told Reuters. [ ie Ana Julia Jatar in the USA mother of Joanna Hausmann ]

Jatar is also a lawyer and a political activist. In the 1990s he worked as a legal adviser to the Venezuelan Congress. He faced charges of extortion in 1991 and fled to Miami, according to news reports. He was later exonerated, according to reports.

The journalist, who is a dual Venezuelan-Chilean citizen, has worked closely with the former opposition mayor of Caracas, Antonio Ledezma. 

https://cpj.org/data/people/braulio-jatar/index.php

Why is that hundreds of other Journalists report on anti-government demonstrations, and other critical things against the Govt and yet all of them are not arrested as well? Something does not add up here.... the issue is not simply being an anti-government Journo

Quote
Braulio Jatar, un preso político que quiere ayudar a Venezuela a través de sus libros
“Ver el sufrir de mi hija o de mi hijo cuando me vieron con cabeza rapada, uniforme de preso y convertido en pellejo por la pérdida de más de veinte kilos, es un momento inolvidable”.
María Corina Roldán Robles | 10/11/2018
http://eltiempolatino.com/news/2018/oct/11/braulio-jatar-un-preso-politico-que-quiere-ayudar-/

Translation:
Quote
The humanitarian crisis in Venezuela is a well-known and discussed topic worldwide, but the harshness of the stories and suffering of each individual is lost due to the monumental amount of murder figures, deaths due to malnutrition, biblical migrations and evidence of Human Rights violations. .

Through the keyhole of the door that prevents us from seeing in detail all the horror that Venezuela is experiencing, we interviewed Braulio Jatar Alonso, editor of the Confidential Report web portal in that country and who according to the NGO Penal Forum, is one of the 262 political prisoners whose freedom has been deprived for opposing the regime of Nicolás Maduro.

But there's more to this story about the Hausmanns ..... and Joanna's obvious and overt personal  IDEOLOGICAL RACIAL CLASS BIASES :)
« Last Edit: March 09, 2019, 04:21:51 AM by Lurk »
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #206 on: March 09, 2019, 03:45:04 AM »
Bloomberg Markets News :)

Quote
Harvard Adviser to Venezuela’s Guaido Has Harsh Message for Bondholders
By Ben Bartenstein

30 January 2019
    Ricardo Hausmann has sketched out Venezuela reconstrucion plan
    One thing is clear, he says: ‘The haircut has to be large’

For years now, Ricardo Hausmann, the acclaimed Venezuelan economist who runs Harvard University’s Center for International Development, has been sketching out what he calls the morning-after plan. The morning after, that is, the socialist regime of Nicolas Maduro is ousted.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-01-30/harvard-guru-advising-guaido-has-harsh-message-for-bondholders

Say no more!

Oh, that still not enough to prove beyond all doubt the guy is has a permanent seat at the Neoliberal Boardroom Table?

OK OK

Quote
Ricardo Hausmann, a former minister of planning of Venezuela and former Chief Economist of the Inter-American Development Bank, is Director of the Center for International Development at Harvard University and a professor of economics at the Harvard Kennedy School.
https://www.project-syndicate.org/columnist/ricardo-hausmann

Quote
He co-introduced several regularly used concepts in economics including original sin, growth diagnostics, self-discovery, dark matter, the product space, and economic complexity.

Ricardo is the father
of art historian Carolina Hausmann, comedian Joanna Hausmann and playwright Michel Hausmann. 

Concurrently with his position at CID, Hausmann has also held several positions at profit and non-profit organizations: he was a member of the board of Venezuela's full-service telephone company CANTV (2001–2007), of microfinance institution ACCION International (2009–2011), and of the advisory board of Abengoa, a renewable energy and engineering company based in Spain

 From 2010 to 2011, he was also the elected president of the Latin-American and Caribbean Economic Association. 

Before coming to Harvard in September 2000, Hausmann served as the first Chief Economist of the Inter-American Development Bank (1994–2000), where he created the Research Department.

From 1992 to 1993, he served as Minister of Planning of Venezuela and as a member of the Board of the Central Bank of Venezuela.

Around the same time, he was Chair of the IMF-World Bank Development Committee. From 1985 to 1991, he was Professor of Economics at the Instituto de Estudios Superiores de Administracion (IESA) in Caracas, where he founded the Center for Public Policy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ricardo_Hausmann

Not an ideological political bone in his body that man!

Like everyone else he truly believes his beliefs are true - who doesn't?

But at least he and his daughter are NOT biased!!! :)
« Last Edit: March 09, 2019, 03:51:04 AM by Lurk »
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #207 on: March 09, 2019, 05:01:53 AM »



About Ex-Pats

In 2003 instead of listening to the sage advice oif the UNSC members, instead of listening to the Europeans, instead of listening to the US Intel Agencies, instead of listening to the UN Weapons Inspectors, instead of listening to Russia and China, instead of listening to reason and logic VP Dick Cheney and all the Neocons like John Bolton made unilateral decisions that made much more sense to them to instead listen to and believe wholeheartedly the unproven evidence free word of Iraqi Ex-Pats instead - and use that to push for Regime Change based on a dire WMD threat.

And they all knew they were lying about everything - they knew that - as does Trump, Pence, Bolton, Rubio and Pompeo also know they are lying about Venezuela too. Along with all the MSM pushing the "lying narratives" all over the world just as they did in 2003.

People like Ahmed Chalabi
Quote
Once dubbed the "George Washington of Iraq" by American supporters, he later fell out of favor and came under investigation by several U.S. government sources. 

Chalabi left Iraq with his family in 1958 - aged 13 years old, following the 14 July Revolution, and spent most of his life in the United States and the United Kingdom [ As has Joanna  Hausmann !!! ]

Chalabi was a bold and shrewd investor, amassing a fortune of $100 million. During his life he was accused of corruption many times.

In 1977, he founded the Petra Bank in Jordan with Crown Prince Hassan, the King's brother.

In May 1989, the Governor of the Central Bank of Jordan, Mohammed Said Nabulsi, issued a decree ordering all banks in the country to deposit 35% of their reserves with the Central Bank.  Petra Bank was the only bank that was unable to meet this requirement.

An investigation was launched which led to accusations of embezzlement and false accounting. The bank failed, causing a $350 million bail-out by the Central Bank. Chalabi fled the country, in the trunk of a Jordanian prince's car, before the authorities could react.

Chalabi was convicted and sentenced in absentia for bank fraud by a Jordanian military tribunal to 22 years in prison. Chalabi maintained that his prosecution was a politically motivated effort to discredit him sponsored by Saddam Hussein.

Living abroad by 1992 in London, and unable to return home for fear of his life, he set up the Iraqi National Congress with an agenda of regime change for his homeland. The organization was open to all ethnic Iraqis - Kurds and Arabs - as well as Sunnis and Shias. Already a fluent English speaker, he turned his attention to Washington DC.

In 1995 after preparation and lobbying he persuaded President Bill Clinton to fund an expedition into northern Iraq to use subterfuge to start an insurgency. Chalabi was convinced that the Iraqi military would rise up to overthrow the dictator.

[ What an IDIOT! And the dumb American IDIOTS like Clinton who believed him. ]

The commanders to whom he had spoken, were the same who openly supported Saddam and crushed his opponents in the Kurdish and Shi'ite revolts. The insurgency failed, lacking the promised ground troops, and 100 insurgents were killed by the military. The command structure of INC fell apart with factional infighting.

Chalabi was banned from those frequent visits to CIA headquarters at Langley, Virginia. Nonetheless Chalabi was doggedly determined: in 1998 Congress passed the Iraq Liberation Act passing into American law the objective of "regime change" in Iraq.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmed_Chalabi

Birds of a feather stick together. Chalabi was created in the very same petri dish as Dick Cheney was. And while less known individuals it appears that Ricardo Hausmann and Joanna Hausmann were too.

Yeah Chalabi is a SAINT - an Arab version of George Washington no less. What a joke this all is, to have some nobody, no better than Ahmed Chalabi - a 1 percenter loud mouthed white ignoramus EX-PAT sitting on a couch in the USA - spewing all these "non-ideological facts" about Venezuela.   

But some people consciously choose ignorance over wisdom. Despite this reality, positive change and some sanity can still happen - maybe.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2019, 06:36:40 AM by Lurk »
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #208 on: March 09, 2019, 05:02:28 AM »
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #209 on: March 09, 2019, 06:18:52 AM »
It's true - Too many facts, too many first hand reports, can make the brain hurt. Sorry about that. :)

Quote
02:26
"The opposition was far more weak than I had anticipated. The coup had much less momentum and was indeed a Reality TV show kind of Virtual-reality coup. And i was actually stunned at how, despite an economic crisis which was real, how functional like the daily life in Venezuelan society in Caracas was. Down to the situation in the poor and working-class Barrios where people are subsisting thanks to state subsidized food what they call the clap boxes.

The CLAP (sic) is the government program to supply the basic foodstuffs and sanitary needs for people who are living off of very meager salaries at a time of hyperinflation. And you know getting to visit those markets talking to the people in the barrios and seeing government ministers including the mayor of Caracas who's a really interesting person Erica Farr.

Yes actually you know comes to the markets and meets with constituents and to see the support they get. Just the genuine grass roots support they get, it really shows you that what we're hearing from these you know Senate committees, like the one that Marco Rubio chaired today, about you know this being a kind of crime family and a regime with no support in the streets that's on its way to collapsing.

It's just a bunch of hot air it's a PSYOP another humanitarian interventionist PSYOP.

And i think one of the most remarkable scenes for me was on february 23rd that was the day when the u.s. plan to ram through its so-called humanitarian aid across the Santander bridge between Colombia and Venezuela this was the big stunt"



From yet another alternative news analysis youtube channel The Zero Hour with RJ Eskow
Published on 7 Mar 2019
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #210 on: March 09, 2019, 07:18:55 AM »
From above:


Quote
30:13
"One of the biggest successes for the US was when the as far as regime change in Venezuela went was in 2014 when the price of the barrel oil barrels went down dramatically.

Why did it go down? Because and this was reported in The Wall Street Journal in oil industry
publications at the time that SoS John Kerry under President Obama had made a deal with I think King Abdullah in Saudi Arabia or it was the crown prince to increase Saudi capacity production in order to harm Russia Iran and Venezuela, which rely heavily on you know high oil prices.

And in exchange Saudi Arabia would gain US support in Syria and the US [the Barack Obama Administration ] would increase its you know delivery of weapons to Saudi backed rebels.


This was like reported openly in the wall street Journal and this is what tanked the Venezuelan economy beginning in 2014 and made it so hard for Venezuela's government to start to offset the speculative black market economy with price controls. This was kind of the beginning of the crisis that we're now seeing.

And so it wasn't something that occurred organically, it was due to the Petro Dollar and the US
special relationship with Saudi Arabia
. Maduro actually came out and openly said they're doing this to harm Russia when he himself was a target."

Quote
RJ Eskow31:38
"The other implication of that of course is that it it was done to undermine the form of government."

RJ Eskow 31:55
"So I guess just my closing thought is this, and what you're really describing - you know there's a lot of talk now here in this country about a green new deal about a jobs guarantee about and a debate - where I stand on this debate is that it's we have to look at these things in a kind of system's way and in an integrated way

That you can't really illiminate or reduce our dependence on climate destroying fossil fuels without also changing our economic system that generates that,
that allows people to exploit that.

And I think a lot of people who consider themselves progressive in this country understand that it's a puzzle with pieces that fit together but I think for a lot of people that mental puzzle image is missing a very big piece. And that piece is foreign policy!

And that if you don't understand the way that Petro Politics and other kinds of geopolitics and military adventurism or whatever (really works in our world) - you want to call it Imperial policies - how they play into all of this you don't have a fully three-dimensional view of the world.

And it's critical, not only as a moral imperative because we're for American citizens, but just a complete understanding of the world around you for you to understand what's going on in a country like Venezuela!"

There are a lot of people who need to listen and look but do not.

PS this was discussed in the video too
"We hate Russia. They lie. They are a threat to us. You shouldn't buy Gas from Russia!"

U.S. Imports from Russia of Crude Oil and Petroleum Products (Thousand Barrels) to 2018
https://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=PET&s=MTTIM_NUS-NRS_1&f=M

Too much information? (smile)
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Sterks

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 265
  • Member # 1000
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 11
  • Likes Given: 17
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #211 on: March 09, 2019, 10:51:14 AM »

...
With their white skin and suit case full of US Dollars and jewellery.  :)

Damn if only I had seen this 5 minute "fact filled" rant by a wealthy well-to-do upper class white American Jewish lady on a couch!

RACIAL CLASS BIASES

Haha you like that other Austrian from the 40's
So you cannot be Latin American and Jewish at the same time. And you cannot complain if you are Jewish.
You are full of shit

Sterks

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 265
  • Member # 1000
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 11
  • Likes Given: 17
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #212 on: March 09, 2019, 11:03:29 AM »
Neven, it is just that this issue touches me closer and somebody opened this thread.

Is Maduro/Chaves neo-con (yes yes at least their pockets are). Is Putin neo-con? (maybe). Is Xi? Sí. The Norwegians? (perhaps)

All in common is human greed, just as those far left guys that fly around in private jets.

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #213 on: March 09, 2019, 01:15:59 PM »

...
With their white skin and suit case full of US Dollars and jewellery.  :)

Damn if only I had seen this 5 minute "fact filled" rant by a wealthy well-to-do upper class white American Jewish lady on a couch!

RACIAL CLASS BIASES

Haha you like that other Austrian from the 40's
So you cannot be Latin American and Jewish at the same time. And you cannot complain if you are Jewish.
You are full of shit

Such bad language, tsk tsk. So quick with Godwin's Law. 

The issue is one of privilege. Joanna's grandfather arrived from Europe, her grandparents were not Latinos. Maybe her mother was, I've not checked that far into it. But they most definitely are not Mestizos nor the descendants of Afro-Venezuelan slaves either.  She was never called "ese mono" or "el Negro" in the streets.

It is a Privilege to be born Jewish anywhere, on many levels. Anyone born white in Venezuela is also born into Privilege - Joanna is no exception, in fact her privileged life is greater than most. Guaido knows first hand how privileged she is. Where is she living now, for example?

She exited Venezuela as a teen like Chalabi. Now she rants from her couch as if she is an expert on all things Venezuela and you, another born into Privilege and living in it 24/7, just lap it up.
Quote
Wow I must say I am surprised you believe these distorted facts just like that.

The video you posted?

Quote
an interesting video of a Venezuelan living in America and trying to explain reality from confusion in the least possible ideological position.

The daughter of Ricardo Hausmann no less. The niece of Braulio Jatar no less.
 
So it's debatable who is actually full of shit. I'll posit it's Joanna who wins 1st prize. :)

Quote
“And if you look at the upper socio-economic levels of the country,” Acosta-Alzuru said, “they tend to be whiter than on the lower socio-economic levels. That is something that is very apparent to everybody.”

“And this is also where it’s very different from the United States: You had people upset and even saying they were disgusted at having to look at Chavez.

"He was often called ‘the black’ (el Negro) by Venezuelan elites and also understood to be Afro- and indigenous—as opposed to mestizo,” Ciccariello-Maher said.

“Part of what angered elites so much when Chavez came to power was that he was a person who didn’t look like he was ‘fit’ to govern,” said George Ciccariello-Maher, an assistant professor of political science at Drexel University in Philadelphia, is the author of We Created Chávez: A People’s History of the Venezuelan Revolution.

https://www.voanews.com/a/are-race-and-class-at-the-root-of-venezuelas-political-crisis/1886458.html
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Neven

  • Administrator
  • ASIF Royalty
  • *****
  • Posts: 6325
    • View Profile
    • Arctic Sea Ice Blog
  • Liked: 280
  • Likes Given: 195
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #214 on: March 09, 2019, 03:04:40 PM »
Neven, it is just that this issue touches me closer and somebody opened this thread.

Is Maduro/Chaves neo-con (yes yes at least their pockets are). Is Putin neo-con? (maybe). Is Xi? Sí. The Norwegians? (perhaps)

All in common is human greed, just as those far left guys that fly around in private jets.

Yes, it's a systemic problem. Which makes it so stupid to just focus on one little aspect of it. That's exactly what they want you to do.
Il faut comparer, comparer, comparer, et cultiver notre jardin

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #215 on: March 10, 2019, 05:46:25 AM »
Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro accused the US of waging an 'electricity war' against the country, as Caracas and other cities were plunged into darkness Thursday night. The government says the incident is likely sabotage.

8 Mar, 2019
https://www.rt.com/news/453310-venezuela-outage-sabotage-us/

9 Mar, 2019
https://www.rt.com/news/453403-veneuzuela-outage-cyber-attack/

9 Mar, 2019
https://www.rt.com/news/453434-venezuela-maduro-cyberattack-power-grid/

"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2204
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 84
  • Likes Given: 92
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #216 on: March 10, 2019, 07:44:18 AM »
Quote
<It is entirely irrelevant to what the real point is, so it doesn't matter whether I agree or not. I do however agree that sanctions need to be lifted, and everyone needs to leave Venezuela alone to deal with its issues, and not overtly or covertly push for regime changes; N.>

Thank you for your opinion.

Personally, I'm with the 50 countries that call for UN supervised free and fair elections.

If Maduro is confident that he has the majority vote, he should not have any problem with that.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2019, 09:22:41 AM by Rob Dekker »
This is our planet. This is our time.
Let's not waste either.

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2204
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 84
  • Likes Given: 92
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #217 on: March 10, 2019, 08:38:48 AM »
Today's protests, as seen through the eyes of the obviously "US imperialist" Al Jazeera :



Note Maduro's speech at 2:20 which blamed the power outage in Venezuela on the US for a "highly scientific energy attack", "with advanced technology" which "what our experts called an electromagnetic attack".

Sure, buddy. I'm sure Venezuela was the victim of the "electromagnetic attack" app that is trending on iPhone lately.
This is our planet. This is our time.
Let's not waste either.

Neven

  • Administrator
  • ASIF Royalty
  • *****
  • Posts: 6325
    • View Profile
    • Arctic Sea Ice Blog
  • Liked: 280
  • Likes Given: 195
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #218 on: March 10, 2019, 09:35:55 AM »
Sure, buddy. I'm sure Venezuela was the victim of the "electromagnetic attack" app that is trending on iPhone lately.

I wonder where he got that idea from. USA-Gate?  ;D
Il faut comparer, comparer, comparer, et cultiver notre jardin

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #219 on: March 10, 2019, 03:31:34 PM »
U.S. military action in Venezuela would be unconstitutional without congressional authorization and illegal internationally

Just a small point. It appears that what the USA is already doing re Venezuela is already Unconstitutional acts and speech by the WH as it is a clear breach it's Treaty obligations to the UN under the UN Charter of which it is a party to said Treaty - and therefore a clear breach of the US Constitution by the Trump Regime in Washington.

Of course this is not the first time, and it won't be the last time that such Constitutional Breaches are ignored by everyone in the USA from SCOTUS down to the local school janitor.

The things the US is doing that are illegal under international law and multiple other treaties are too many to list but they to will be ignored.

Might is always Right in this world. In this case, as they have been before many times, the American people are again incredibly weak. Just sharin' the truth bro! You know what I'm sayin' :)

What happened in 1998 was not that unlike what happened to South Africa when the ANC under Mandela formed the new Government. Change and major reform is always a little messy. High expectations are certain to be not met as well as people hoped. But it is not the end of the world - far from it.  What's happened since Chavez passed away is not that dissimilar to when Mandela left office - things got a little rocky for a while. It's what happens. It's natural. It's quite normal in fact when there are big shoes to fill in any nation.  On top of that there's the centuries of entrenched racism and injustices to work out in the wash. People in glass houses and all ...
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #220 on: March 10, 2019, 04:19:23 PM »
Here's a Murdoch press report that will suit the conservative external regime change minded nicely edited and definitely biased/unbalanced so should make many happy. :)



The question remains between the last two videos - one shows a distant broad shot of the pro-Maduro red shirt  crowds and the other a distant broad shot of white shirt crowds. It's up to the viewer which one they see more clearly and which which one they choose to believe is more relevant.

There's another hidden question is that is are those videos of the crowds actually taken on the day the reports are about .. or another day? Such the unreliability of all news services these days, especially in a crisis like Venezuela.

I also think it odd the man would say, hey look at that cue to the gas station in such a rich oil country .... while ignoring the fact it's after a day or two of massive power outages. But that's our news media for you.

Any "shortages" were not stopping the hundreds of cars on the freeway system shown in the rest of the video while the guy was on his motorcycle.

It never surprises me how these things are played out in our media in this day and age and how most people keep on believing what they want to believe anyway. Lakoff is right - whatever the real facts are they make so little difference to anyone. ergo climate denial all other forms of denial as well.

It's just the way it is - what caused the power outages is  matter of belief not one of evidence.
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #221 on: March 11, 2019, 02:54:29 AM »
Greenwald rips US media for warmongering lies:

"What we have here is classic Fake News – spread on Twitter, by U.S. officials and U.S. media stars – with the clear and malicious intent to start a war. But no western proponents of social media censorship will call for their accounts to be cancelled nor call for their posts to be deleted.

That’s because “Fake News” and the war against it is strictly a means of combating propaganda by U.S. adversaries; the U.S. and its allies maintain extensive programs to spread Fake News online and none of those anti-Fake News crusaders call for those to be shut down."

"That’s not because U.S. media stars are ordered to do this. They don’t need to be ordered. They know propaganda is their job. More to the point, they are über-patriotic jingoists who revere U.S. officials "

https://theintercept.com/2019/03/10/nyts-expose-on-the-lies-about-burning-humanitarian-trucks-in-venezuela-shows-how-us-govt-and-media-spread-fake-news/

posted by sidd on journalism thread

Quote
Every major U.S. war of the last several decades has begun the same way: the U.S. Government fabricates an inflammatory, emotionally provocative lie which large U.S. media outlets uncritically treat as truth while refusing at air questioning or dissent, thus inflaming primal anger against the country the U.S. wants to attack. That’s how we got the Vietnam War (North Vietnam attacks U.S. ships in the Gulf of Tonkin); the Gulf War (Saddam ripped babies from incubators); and, of course, the war in Iraq (Saddam had WMDs and formed an alliance with Al Qaeda).

This was exactly the tactic used on February 23, when the narrative shifted radically in favor of those U.S. officials who want regime change operations in Venezuela. That’s because images were broadcast all over the world of trucks carrying humanitarian aid burning in Colombia on the Venezuela border. U.S. officials who have been agitating for a regime change war in Venezuela – Marco Rubio, John Bolton, Mike Pompeo, the head of USAid Mark Green – used Twitter to spread classic Fake News: they vehemently stated that the trucks were set on fire, on purpose, by President Nicolas Maduro’s forces.

    Each of the trucks burned by Maduro carried 20 tons of food & medicine. This is a crime & if international law means anything he must pay a high price for this. #23FAyudaHumanitaria https://t.co/IrGzrOUX09

    — Marco Rubio (@marcorubio) February 23, 2019

    Masked thugs, civilians killed by live rounds, and the burning of trucks carrying badly-needed food and medicine. This has been Maduro’s response to peaceful efforts to help Venezuelans. Countries that still recognize Maduro should take note of what they are endorsing. pic.twitter.com/KlSebd2M5a

    — John Bolton (@AmbJohnBolton) February 23, 2019

    .@SecPompeo: We denounce Maduro’s refusal to let humanitarian assistance reach #Venezuela. What kind of a sick tyrant stops food from getting to hungry people? The images of burning trucks filled with aid are sickening. https://t.co/zzFNYVly2c

    — USConsulateFrankfurt (@usconsfrankfurt) February 24, 2019

    #Maduro ordering the firing on and burning of trucks filled with
    humanitarian aid & attacking volunteers is unconscionable. I condemn the killings & human rights abuses committed by Maduro. Violent attacks against life-saving aid for #Venezuela is despicable. #EstamosUnidosVE https://t.co/BOSuVP1mTL

    — Mark Green (@USAIDMarkGreen) February 23, 2019



I saw it on social media so it must be true. Donald Trump said it. Marco Rubio said it. John Bolton said it. CNN said it. Hannity said it. It must be all true! We have to help those poor suffering unfree Venezuelans or I won't be able to sleep at night any more.

Don't you agree? And if not why don't you agree with ME and all the US media and the US Congress and the White House and all decent people everywhere?
Quote

U.S. news stars and think tank luminaries who lack even a single critical brain cell when it comes to war-provoking claims from U.S. officials took a leading role in beating the war drums without spending even a single second to ask whether what they were being told were true:

    This is just evil https://t.co/kDOJBZ48td

    — Kasie Hunt (@kasie) February 23, 2019

I think there is something permanently not right with the people who cannot work out for themselves that they are being played again again and again. Zero critical thinking skills combined with billions of Gullibility Genes maybe?
« Last Edit: March 11, 2019, 03:20:09 PM by Lurk »
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #222 on: March 11, 2019, 03:10:31 AM »
If you are implying that it's all because Maduro can't handle the hyperinflation, and so now some Harvard agent can rightfully proclaim himself king, with the entire world simply ignoring international law and accepting him as such, then you are wrong.

And I lie you not, I have heard narrative along same lines told to me by Venezuelan refugees in Madrid, people that left their country with not much apart from willing to have a life with dignity. This Already started going south from the times of the other mofo, the insufferable Chaves, now happily sleeping the eternal dream after screwing all he could.
Confy in your cab in Northrn Europe? Enjoy! We are really lucky people.


PS Israeli + Venezeulan

Brookings Inst. Economist Biased Racist Shill for Empire without a critical brain cell or an ounce of morality in his whole body? Or truth teller?



"While the NYT’s article and video are perfectly good and necessary journalism, the credit they are implicitly claiming for themselves for exposing this lie is totally undeserved.

That’s because independent journalists – the kind who question rather than mindlessly repeat government claims and are therefore mocked and marginalized and kept off mainstream television – used exactly this same evidence on the day of the incident to debunk the lies being told by Rubio, Pompeo, Bolton and CNN."
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #223 on: March 11, 2019, 03:10:50 AM »
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #224 on: March 11, 2019, 03:55:22 AM »
It's really never ending .. more from Greewald (not news to me)

Quote
Equally false is the widespread, popular media claim that Maduro has refused to allow any humanitarian aid to enter Venezuela. That, too, is an outright lie. The Venezuelan government has allowed substantial amounts of aid into their country from countries that have not threatened to overthrow the President with an external coup;

Maduro has only blocked trucks and planes from entering that come from those countries (the U.S, Brazil, Colombia) that have been threatening Venezuela. something any country would do.

Indeed, both the Red Cross and the United Nations expressed concerns about “humanitarian aid” from the U.S. on the ground that it was a pretext for regime change and would politicize humanitarian aid).
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2204
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 84
  • Likes Given: 92
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #225 on: March 11, 2019, 07:45:47 AM »
Today, two fact-check reports were published, both about the burning of humanitarian aid trucks at the Venezuelan border during the protests on February 23.

One is from the New York Times :

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/10/world/americas/venezuela-aid-fire-video.html

Quote
Unpublished footage obtained by The New York Times and previously released tapes — including footage released by the Colombian government, which has blamed Mr. Maduro for the fire — allowed for a reconstruction of the incident. It suggests that a Molotov cocktail thrown by an antigovernment protester was the most likely trigger for the blaze.

and one part of a wider open-source investigation of the Feb 23 protests by Bellingcat :

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/americas/2019/03/10/fire-on-the-border-analyzing-venezuelas-february-23-border-clashes/

Quote
The open source evidence examined for this article is not complete: it does not show the moment of ignition. For this reason, it is not possible to make a definitive determination regarding the cause of the fire. However, the available evidence does suggest the possibility that the fire was started when a Molotov cocktail thrown by a man at the police missed its mark.

Both reports are based on open-source data (social media videos mostly) and both contradict the statements from Trump administration officials like this one :



which suggested that Maduro's people caused the fire.
This is our planet. This is our time.
Let's not waste either.

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2204
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 84
  • Likes Given: 92
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #226 on: March 11, 2019, 09:24:04 AM »
Quote
<It is entirely irrelevant to what the real point is, so it doesn't matter whether I agree or not. I do however agree that sanctions need to be lifted, and everyone needs to leave Venezuela alone to deal with its issues, and not overtly or covertly push for regime changes; N.>

Thank you for your opinion.

Personally, I'm with the 50 countries that call for UN supervised free and fair elections in Venezuela.

If Maduro is confident that he has the majority vote, he should not have any problem with that.
This is our planet. This is our time.
Let's not waste either.

Neven

  • Administrator
  • ASIF Royalty
  • *****
  • Posts: 6325
    • View Profile
    • Arctic Sea Ice Blog
  • Liked: 280
  • Likes Given: 195
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #227 on: March 11, 2019, 09:46:36 AM »
Yes, it has been clear that you're with Trump's 'Coalition of the Willing', Rob:



Quote
SHARMINI PERIES: It’s The Real News Network. I’m Sharmini Peries, coming to you from Baltimore.

A favorite talking point of those who support the Trump administration’s policies towards Venezuela <looking at you again, Rob! N.> is that 50 countries have recognized the opposition leader Juan Guaido as the interim president of Venezuela, and this includes countries like Canada and Europe. So people are very confused. When it is pointed out that 50 out of the 195 countries is only about 1/4 of the world’s countries, and less than 20 percent of the world’s population, the Trump administration argues that these are the world’s main democracies that support Guaido.

Part of the reason for assembling this coalition of countries that are willing to recognize the parallel government in Venezuela is to provide legitimacy to the Trump administration’s effort to oust Nicolas Maduro, the elected president of Venezuela. In some ways, this is similar to the coalition of the willing that President George W. Bush assembled to oust Saddam Hussein from Iraq. But who is this anti-Maduro coalition of the willing? And why are they supporting Trump?

Well, to discuss all of this with me today I’m joined by Mark Weisbrot. And he’s joining us from Washington, DC, where he is the co-director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research. Thanks for joining us, Mark.

Quote
MARK WEISBROT: Yes. Well, first I want to emphasize that even if these were the most wonderful governments in the world, there’s no legitimacy to the effort to overthrow the Venezuelan government. And that’s because, first of all, the sanctions that they’re using are illegal. They’re illegal under the Charter of the Organization of American States. They’re illegal under the Charter of the United Nations. And they are illegal under various conventions that these countries, and the United States in particular, have signed. So it wouldn’t be legitimate even if they had only the best countries, and even if they had a majority of countries. It’s just, it’s just illegal. And of course it’s immoral, because they’re using collective punishment against the population of Venezuela by depriving them of medicine and food and other essential goods.

(...)

And so I think they generally–they don’t have an independent foreign policy most of the time, you know, from the United States, Europe in the whole post-World War II period, but on Latin America especially they tend to go along with the U.S.

(...)

But Europe is, you know, it’s problematic. A lot of people see Europe as more progressive than the U.S. And of course it is in terms of healthcare, and education, and internally. But on foreign policy, the general rule–and there are exceptions–but the general rule is they go with the U.S. And a lot of that is because they’re rich countries, and they control the major institutions of global governance. The IMF, the World Bank, the World Trade Organization.

(...)

And so that’s how they see the world; their leaders, not necessarily the people. And so it’s not really that surprising, although this is kind of an extreme move. I mean, recognizing Guaido, this is outside the bounds of any kind of diplomatic protocol. You don’t get to choose the president of another country, normally. And it also, as I’ve said before, and a lot of people don’t know this, the recognition of Guaido automatically imposed a trade embargo on Venezuela, because the government can–which is exporting, getting all the foreign exchange of the country and everything you need for food and medicine, comes from the oil sales. The government can’t sell that oil in about three quarters of its markets once the Guaido government is recognized by these countries as the legitimate recipient of any oil sales for the government. So that’s why, you know, things are going to get drastically worse, even worse, very soon there.
Il faut comparer, comparer, comparer, et cultiver notre jardin

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2204
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 84
  • Likes Given: 92
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #228 on: March 11, 2019, 09:59:41 AM »
Yes, it has been clear that you're with Trump's 'Coalition of the Willing', Rob:

Personally, I'm with the 50 countries that call for UN supervised free and fair elections in Venezuela.

And who are you with ?
This is our planet. This is our time.
Let's not waste either.

Neven

  • Administrator
  • ASIF Royalty
  • *****
  • Posts: 6325
    • View Profile
    • Arctic Sea Ice Blog
  • Liked: 280
  • Likes Given: 195
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #229 on: March 11, 2019, 10:17:44 AM »
I'm with nobody.
Il faut comparer, comparer, comparer, et cultiver notre jardin

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #230 on: March 11, 2019, 03:33:05 PM »
Yes, it has been clear that you're with Trump's 'Coalition of the Willing', Rob:

Personally, I'm with the 50 countries that call for UN supervised free and fair elections in Venezuela.

Are you sure all 55 countries are calling for that? The United States is not, at least I have not seen Trump or anyone else ask for that.

Quote
And who are you with ?

With the United Nations charter, the UN Declaration of Human Rights, the US Constitution and the Venezuelan Constitution and International Laws and Treaties, and the right of the Venezuelans to determine their own future and make their own decisions with anyone else telling them what to do and how to do it or when to do it. 

Which much places me with the clear 75-80% majority. Seems like I am the traditionalist conservative populist now. :)
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #231 on: March 12, 2019, 06:13:34 AM »
see https://www.gregpalast.com

Big Oil Controls the World | Interview with Greg Palast with only 9,996 views

breaking the set on RT
Published on 27 Mar 2013

Abby Martin talks to investigative journalist, Greg Palast, about US interests in a post-Chavez Venezuela, and how 'Big Oil' could shape future policy.



2013 right - in the middle of the Obama Administration, the same Administration that began placing sanctions and barriers upon Venezuela and manipulating the global Oil price to push it down and financially strangle the Maduro Govts ability to pay it's bills etc and which has subsequently caused the humanitarian and political crisis in Venezuela today.   

The XL pipeline is still not delivering Canadian Tars sands oil to the Koch Bros refinery 5 years later.

[quoting]
The Koch brothers are the impetus behind the XL pipeline.

"It's true that they have their
correctly denied that they have no
direct ownership of the pipeline or its
oil but why is the oil going all the way
from Canada all the way out to Houston
why are we taking oil from Canada to
Houston after all Texas has some oil the
answer is is that the Koch brothers
refinery is at the end of the Excel
pipeline the Flint Hills refinery
that's
where most of the oil will end up

Right now they have to buy their oil from
Venezuela the heavy oil that Hugo Chavez
is government produced and Chavez that
wouldn't give it away the Venezuelan oil
cost about a hundred and one dollars a
barrel - it's $33 a barrel cheaper to
bring in that glop that melted liquid
filthy crud asphalt that would come down
from melting the Canadian tar sands
through the XL pipeline the only reason
America is facing a 2,000 mile toxic
slash across its belly is so that the
Koch brothers can save 33 bucks a barrel
and it adds up it's about 2 billion plus
a year for them to have the XL pipeline
bring in the crud from Canada rather than
the much much less polluting oil from Venezuela


Venezuelan oil has about one-fifth of
the sulphur of the Canadian tar sands
so
we'd be burning up this planet in fact
of all that tar sands oil comes down to
the coke refinery they'll save 2 billion
dollars a year but the planet
temperature in of the the entire planets
temperature will rise by about one
degree Fahrenheit "

[end quote]
« Last Edit: March 12, 2019, 06:21:11 AM by Lurk »
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #232 on: March 12, 2019, 07:14:43 AM »
    The U.S. will withdraw all remaining personnel from @usembassyve this week. This decision reflects the deteriorating situation in #Venezuela as well as the conclusion that the presence of U.S. diplomatic staff at the embassy has become a constraint on U.S. policy.
    — Secretary Pompeo (@SecPompeo) March 12, 2019
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #233 on: March 12, 2019, 03:27:38 PM »
 US diplomats are undermining Venezuelan peace and stability, the nation’s Foreign Minister Jorge Arreaza said, setting a deadline for them to vacate the embassy in Caracas. Washington vowed to hurry the evacuation of its mission.

American diplomats must “abandon Venezuelan territory in the next 72 hours,”
with the countdown starting at the “zero hour” on Tuesday, Arreaza wrote on Twitter.

    Official Communiqué on the decision by the Bolivarian Government of Venezuela terminating the conversations with the US for the establishment of interest sections. The US diplomatic personnel must abandon Venezuelan territory in the next 72 hours: pic.twitter.com/FTPnXiFqU1
    — Jorge Arreaza M (@jaarreaza) March 12, 2019

Venezuela had earlier demanded that Washington clear the embassy in Caracas of any remaining personnel. The presence of American diplomats “entails risks to the country’s peace, integrity and stability,” the minister explained.

He accused the US of threatening the nation with military intervention and said that officials in Washington “have systematically lied to the world regarding Venezuelan reality.”

At the same time, Jorge Arreaza stressed that Venezuela stands ready to restart dialogue with the US, as long as the communication is based on “equality and mutual respect.” 

https://www.rt.com/news/453626-us-embassy-caracas-deadline/

fyi  Foreign Minister Jorge Arreaza is the son in law of former President Hugo Chavez
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #234 on: March 13, 2019, 06:28:12 AM »
Yes, it has been clear that you're with Trump's 'Coalition of the Willing', Rob:

Personally, I'm with the 50 countries that call for UN supervised free and fair elections in Venezuela.

And who are you with ?

Last time there was an election the Opposition demanded the UN not attend and observe the election.

The Opposition boycotted the elections - told people not to vote.

Opposition supporting groups engaged in massive violence at polling stations on the day and leading up to the elections. The Govt military and Police did not do such things.

Opposition protests and rallies continued throughout the election campaign period calling for the people to boycott the election to make it null and void.

Millions turned out anyway and voted for and against Maduro, as is their want - they Voted anyway.

There is a free press in Venezuela who together voiced major opposition to Maduro being re-elected - the people voted otherwise by a clear majority.

The Govt repeatedly requested for many months starting in 2016 the UN come and supervise / observe the elections in 2017 but a few days beforehand they refused and gave no reasons publicly.

The UN Rapporteur (already posted on these pages several times) has said there are no major human rights or unfair electoral issues in Venezuela. The Govt is legitimate.

The multinational team to did supervise observe the last elections all said there were no unfairness issues during the election of Maduro as President. Three candidates stood and Maduro won fair and square with a clear majority (unlike Donald Trump and unlike the institutional gerrymandering and voter fraud perpetrated by both the Democrats and GOP)   

The Election Commission of Venezuela declared the election as free and fair. Lawsuits against the results have not been upheld by the Venezuelan Judiciary or the High Court.

The last time there was an elction for the National Assmebly, that being in 2015, the electiosn were declared free and fair and legitiamte.

In that election it was the Opposition who won a  clear majority of seats in the national Assembly.

It was that election that Guaido was elected to his seat --- in an Assembly with a rotating "president" position which he only was assigned last year. 

Four winners of seats in that election were declared null and void and new elections for those seats were legally ordered to take place. The reason was the voting was not free and fair but had been manipulated by the Opposition parties on the ground.  Those 4 elections were corrupt. They have still not been re-run because the National Assembly refused to take the proper actions to make that happen under the Constitution. The NA acted against the Venezuela Constitution and the High court acted accordingly. Then it reversed it;s decision to allay fears of an all out violence on the streets. 

Evidence of these summaries have been posted to this very thread numerous times. Why do people chose to ignore it and not read and not understand such complex Historical issues that brought us to today?

Since 2015 this National Assembly has not debated or passed one N.A. Bill into Law. Not one. It was so dysfunctional that it was legally disbanded and all it's powers taken away because of this and other disruptive/ilegal activities.  The N.A.. is not doing the work they were elected to do.

So where was the problem of or evidence for unfree and unfair elections in 2015? Apart from 4 seats there was none.

The Opposition Coalition of multiple parties actually won that election with a powerful Majority. So where is the corruption? Where is the unfairness? The UN also observed these elections and there was no major problem. The OAS also observed, no problems declared. 

The Maduro 'Chavista" Govt did not win the election - they did not declare martial law, suspend the Constitution nor overturn that election result.

Where is the unfree and unfair complaints about that 2015 election won by the Opposition parties when Guaido won his seat?

Where is the evidence that the 2017 Election of Maduro as the President was corrupted?

If any nation needs to attend to it's corrupted electoral system it would be the United States - the laughing stock of the advanced economies and the western world.

If any nation was overdue for a Coup or a popular revolt on the streets because of it's corrupt Judicial System, it's dysfunctional and corrupted Electoral System, it's corrupt media system, it's non-stop illegal actions in the world and at home, it's illegal breaches of the United nations Charter, it's pathetic "national assembly" being both Houses of Congress, and it's Presidency it would be the nation currently led by Donald Trump.

But no, the ex-pat from the Netherlands doesn't complain about the acts of the invading right wing Nazis in his old country, no he blames the USSR/Russians instead. He doesn't care about the lying decietful Neo-Nazi right wing neo-liberal predatory thieving capitalist ideologues currently running his own adopted country and presenting the nightly news - while millions of children go hungry, others starve or are forced to eat out of garbage bins daily - or get arrested in order to survive!

How do people get so tied up in knots with such mental gymnastics of crying crocodile tears over Venezuela's situation?  ( A rhetorical question - as I already know the answers for this. )
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #235 on: March 13, 2019, 06:39:22 AM »
 Pompeo seeks to recruit top world oil execs to promote US foreign policy
Published time: 13 Mar, 2019
https://www.rt.com/usa/453676-pompeo-oil-foreign-policy/

Quote
US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo has sought to recruit some of the top oil industry guns to serve as Washington's foreign policy tools to crack down on "bad actors" like Venezuela, Russia and Iran.

Addressing the members of IHS Markit's CERAWeek annual energy conference in Houston, Texas, on Tuesday, Pompeo has divulged what has long been an open secret – that the US is willing to use all its political clout to propel its economic interests and vice versa.

Pompeo said that American shale oil and natural gas should become instruments to "strengthen" the US' "hand in foreign policy."

At the same time, Washington takes pains to squeeze out Iran's oil industry by pushing allies to cut their imports under threat of secondary sanctions. The ultimate goal here is to kill off Iran's crude exports completely, Pompeo reaffirmed.

"We're committed to bringing Iranian crude oil exports to zero as quickly as market conditions will permit," he said.

"We need to roll up our sleeves and compete – by facilitating investment, encouraging partners to buy from us, and by punishing bad actors."

One of the hindrances to the US energy dominance in Europe is Russia, with the $11 billion NordStream 2 pipeline, which is set to deliver gas to European consumers below the Baltic Sea, and is a thorn in Washington's eye. While the Trump administration's attempts to persuade Berlin to ditch the project in favor of more expensive American liquefied natural gas (LNG) have so far fallen flat, it has not given up on its efforts to derail the Russian pipeline.

"We don't want our European allies hooked on Russian gas through the NordStream 2 project, any more than we ourselves want to be dependent on Venezuelan oil supplies," Pompeo said just a day after US Energy Secretary Rick Perry confirmed that the US is mulling sanctions on the project.

Pompeo further alleged that Russia's involvement in the Ukraine conflict is a covert attempt to gain access to Ukrainian natural resources, including oil and gas reserves.

How many lies do they need to tell before the people stop believing them?

Quote
Venezuela, Iran may be crushed by sanctions, but oil market has not been
Published Mon, Mar 11 2019
Key Points
    The sanctioning of two OPEC members — Iran and Venezuela — by the Trump administration has caused some ripples in the oil market, but not the type of shortages for consumers that might have occurred.
    One big reason is that U.S. production continues to grow, and for every barrel displaced, a new one comes on line.
    U.S. output is now at 12.1 million barrels a day, up more than 1 million from this time last year, and IHS Markit expects it to be 13 million by the end of the year.

 “I think it’s obvious Iranian sanctions, either under Obama or Trump, would not work without the increase of U.S. production,” said Yergin. “Although it’s not the same grade of oil, it would have been very difficult to do that in the market.”

Yergin said he expects the U.S. to become a net exporter on a consistent basis within the next two to three years, something the U.S. has not been since the late 1940s.

“It’s [providing] the flexibility on sanctions. It also puts something very big on the table for the U.S.-Chinese trade negotiations,” said Yergin,

Yergin said the U.S. industry is now focused on ways to export more oil and expand Texan ports. “This is a dramatic reshaping of global trade flows,” he said.
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/03/11/venezuela-iran-may-be-crushed-by-sanctions-but-oil-market-has-not.html

Oh do wake up.

Secretary Pompeo will present a Special Keynote address on The Role of Energy in 21st Century Global Politics on Tuesday, March 12 at 6:00 PM.
https://ceraweek.com/index.html

Yesterday - hard not to smile, hard to wipe that smirk off his lying face.

"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2204
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 84
  • Likes Given: 92
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #236 on: March 14, 2019, 07:28:45 AM »
Contrary to Glenn Greenwald, who aggressively blames US media for spreading mis-information, here is a much more balanced report from TYT, which also rightfully so complements the New York Times for their investigation and their report :





This is our planet. This is our time.
Let's not waste either.

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2204
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 84
  • Likes Given: 92
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #237 on: March 14, 2019, 08:20:23 AM »
After accusing the US of bringing down the Venezuelan grid with a cyber attack, now the Maduro government found another cause :

https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/13/americas/venezuela-blackout-restored-intl/index.html

Quote
The Information Minister used to the press conference to accuse supporters of the opposition leader, and Venezuela's self-declared interim president, Juan Guaido, of trying to bring down the electrical grid by plugging in all their appliances.

You can't make this stuff up, folks.
This is our planet. This is our time.
Let's not waste either.

Neven

  • Administrator
  • ASIF Royalty
  • *****
  • Posts: 6325
    • View Profile
    • Arctic Sea Ice Blog
  • Liked: 280
  • Likes Given: 195
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #238 on: March 14, 2019, 09:23:49 AM »
You can't make this stuff up, folks.

Just like Russian cyber attacks on electric utilities and election committees! When Maduro says it, you see through it. When corporate US media and the Pentagon say it, you immediately and unquestioningly believe it. Facts! ;D
Il faut comparer, comparer, comparer, et cultiver notre jardin

Neven

  • Administrator
  • ASIF Royalty
  • *****
  • Posts: 6325
    • View Profile
    • Arctic Sea Ice Blog
  • Liked: 280
  • Likes Given: 195
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #239 on: March 14, 2019, 10:57:32 PM »


Quote
And when it comes to what you ask about the internal situation, again, it is very clear that anybody who has the notion of national sovereignty, that a foreign intervention such as the one that Mr. Guaido is requesting, must be opposed. But on the other hand, we are also in a day-to-day reality. Venezuela is undergoing a very serious economic and social crisis that has been made worse by the sanctions that the U.S. administration has been imposing in an increasing manner since August 2017.

So the problem is that the longer this crisis and the status quo of this duality of power and the power struggle that is going on in the country, the longer this crisis lasts, the more the destructive or disruptive effect of these sanctions will affect Venezuelan people. And this is something that, again, I try to raise awareness about. The imposition of sanctions will not precipitate the collapse of the Venezuelan institutions, leading, as it is expected by the U.S., to Mr. Guaido assuming the presidency. As we have seen, Venezuelan political reality is much more complex, and it is obvious that to get out of this crisis, at least the two camps—you know, the government and Mr. Guaido; at least Chavismo and its historic opposition—will have to gather around the table and try to negotiate or agree some sort of political Venezuelan internal way out of the crisis.

And the fastest, the quickest that we get to that negotiating point, the better it will be for the Venezuelan people, because again, unfortunately, the U.S. administration has made it clear that they will keep increasing the pressure on the Venezuelan people, and more sanctions are to be expected. So again, this is a very, very dangerous situation for the Venezuelan people, who can be, you know, potentially deprived of having access to food or to medicines that already can be in short supply in some areas of the country. But at least as of today you can have access to food in Caracas, for instance, if you have the money to buy it. What will happen if the U.S. administration sanctions or punishes foreign banks that just engage in trade banking with Venezuela? So Venezuela will not be able even to purchase the food it requires? Again, this is extremely serious, extremely dangerous. And again, the only rational way of addressing it is trying to create conditions first, and then try to reach a negotiated deal out of the crisis.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2019, 11:07:39 PM by Neven »
Il faut comparer, comparer, comparer, et cultiver notre jardin

Lurk

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 881
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 47
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: The Empire vs Venezuela - News and History
« Reply #240 on: March 18, 2019, 05:51:17 AM »
Another Independent Journalist Exposes U.S. News Venezuela Propaganda w/Eva Bartlett

35 minutes review. now 506,000 subscribers - added 8,000 in less than a week.


Quote
Comments
Let venezuela handle its own country. #handsoffvenezuala #fomentingdiscord

Thank you for giving Eva so much air time. She is one of the few honest journalists left. Do not trust your government!

Damn lefty reporters with their facts and such.

"I have certain rules I live by. My first rule, I don't believe anything the government tells me. Nothing. ZERO!" -George Carlin

Quote
8:35
"well who did the attack on Venezuela's electrical grid? Right, it wasn't like yeah it might be a
worn down grid and they have been told they have power outages and they fix them in two hours, they fix them but the whole grid was down and it was attacked repeatedly and stations were physically attacked. So this is not a case of infrastructure failing. This is a premeditated attack that I know max Blumenthal has written about. The fact that this was already detailed years prior that the U.S. saw this as a way to put even more pressure on the population in Venezuela in order to turn against the government. "
« Last Edit: March 18, 2019, 06:36:09 AM by Lurk »
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders and decrees. [...] A good person will resist an evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state is therefore a duty."
Mahatma Gandhi - Non-Violent Resistance