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Tom_Mazanec

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #100 on: June 22, 2019, 07:13:08 PM »
SHARKS (CROSSED OUT) MONGEESE (SIC) WITH FRICKIN LASER BEAMS ATTACHED TO THEIR HEADS

Tom_Mazanec

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SHARKS (CROSSED OUT) MONGEESE (SIC) WITH FRICKIN LASER BEAMS ATTACHED TO THEIR HEADS

vox_mundi

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #102 on: August 10, 2019, 01:04:06 AM »
The Trump Administration Killed a Self-Driving Car Committee — and Didn’t Tell Members
https://www.theverge.com/2019/8/9/20791454/trump-obama-autonomous-self-driving-car-group-apple-zipcar-uber-lyft

An all-star team of transpo bigwigs had just one meeting before the DOT went radio silent

The Trump administration quietly terminated an Obama-era federal committee on automation in transportation earlier this year, the Department of Transportation confirmed to The Verge this week. What’s more, the DOT never informed some members that the advisory group didn’t exist anymore, including Captain Chesley “Sully” Sullenberger, Zipcar founder Robin Chase, Apple vice president Lisa Jackson, and even the committee’s own vice chair, The Verge has learned.

... The group was brought together “to serve as a critical resource for the Department [of Transportation] in framing federal policy for the continued development and deployment of automated transportation,” according to its landing page on the DOT’s website.

The committee held its lone meeting on January 16th, 2017, four days before Trump’s inauguration. The DOT never called the committee to meet again, and the press release detailing it was scrubbed from the DOT’s website sometime around April of this year, according to the Internet Archive’s Wayback Machine.

The committee’s dissolution comes at a critical moment in the development of automated vehicles in the United States. During the two-plus years that it sat dormant, multiple companies have rolled out small commercial fleets of automated vehicles that perform a variety of tasks. Big money is pouring into some of the most visible companies in the space. And there’s been a human cost, too: one of Uber’s prototype autonomous vehicles killed a pedestrian in Arizona in 2018, and at least two people were killed while using Tesla’s Autopilot suite of driver assistance systems.
“There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see.” ― Leonardo da Vinci

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TerryM

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #103 on: August 10, 2019, 04:14:54 AM »
^^ That's a strange development.


My recollection is that DARPA initiated the robo-vehicle movement by hosting the cross country driverless challenges held yearly from Barstow to Las Vegas. They even paid off the million dollar prize!
Self driving tanks, flame throwers, howitzers and grenade launchers were assumed to be the applications they had in mind.


Advanced autonomous robots that could be deployed against the enemy du jour could be a cost effective method of conducting the endless wars that DARPA is tasked with fighting, and it would make the selling of these wars much easier on the home front.


------------


People like to drive. Even Tesla offers a "driving game" designed to relieve the boredom when your vehicle has stripped the drivers of the joy of driving the open highway.


Is there just a whiff of irony in the above?
Terry

vox_mundi

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #104 on: August 11, 2019, 12:29:00 AM »
Not to worry Terry, the military is still 'all-in' in the autonomous vehicle arena. This is just typical White House pigheadedness.When I have more time I'll post more on AI. robots and the military.

--------------------

Army Futures Command (AFC) commander Gen. John Murray briefed reporters on Thursday ... what's coming down the pipe to help soldiers win the conflicts of the future.

... There are "pretty much autonomous systems" operating in the air and on the sea already, and the commercial industry is plowing ahead on getting autonomous vehicles on highways, Murray said, but the idea of having fully autonomous vehicles drive cross-country is another issue entirely.

"If you're going completely cross-country, there are no lane markings, there are no street signs, there's no vehicles around you ... to help you identify where you are," Murray said. "That's not anything that's coming in the near-term (6 month-1 year), but as we start to look and increment out what comes next (5-10yr), I think that's probably it."

Murray said that using AI to acquire targets may reduce the possibility of deadly mistakes.

"I just remember back ... working with kids we were going to put behind the main gun of a [tank]. If you were 80% accurate using flash cards, like I learned math in high school, you went behind it,"
he said.

-------------------

Daniel Dravit: ... Ohhh him there with the five-and-a-half hat size has the makings of a bloody hero!

- The Man Who Would Be King (1975)
« Last Edit: August 11, 2019, 03:06:54 PM by vox_mundi »
“There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see.” ― Leonardo da Vinci

Insensible before the wave so soon released by callous fate. Affected most, they understand the least, and understanding, when it comes, invariably arrives too late

TerryM

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #105 on: August 11, 2019, 06:39:49 AM »
Not to worry Terry, the military is still 'all-in' in the autonomous vehicle arena. This is just typical White House pigheadedness.When I have more time I'll post more on AI. robots and the military.

--------------------

Army Futures Command (AFC) commander Gen. John Murray briefed reporters on Thursday ... what's coming down the pipe to help soldiers win the conflicts of the future.

... There are "pretty much autonomous systems" operating in the air and on the sea already, and the commercial industry is plowing ahead on getting autonomous vehicles on highways, Murray said, but the idea of having fully autonomous vehicles drive cross-country is another issue entirely.

"If you're going completely cross-country, there are no lane markings, there are no street signs, there's no vehicles around you ... to help you identify where you are," Murray said. "That's not anything that's coming in the near-term (6 month-1 year), but as we start to look and increment out what comes next (5-10yr), I think that's probably it."

Murray said that using AI to acquire targets may reduce the possibility of deadly mistakes.

"I just remember back ... working with kids we were going to put behind the main gun of a [tank]. If you were 80% accurate using flash cards, like I learned math in high school, you went behind it," he said.

-------------------

Daniel Dravit: ... Ohhh him there with the five-and-a-half hat size has the makings of a bloody hero!

The Man Who Would Be King (1975)
Well that's certainly reassuring. :P
Terry

vox_mundi

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #106 on: August 15, 2019, 11:26:33 PM »
UPS Has Been Delivering Cargo in Self-Driving Trucks for Months And No One Knew
https://gizmodo.com/ups-has-been-delivering-cargo-in-self-driving-trucks-fo-1837272680

The self-driving freight truck startup TuSimple has been carrying mail across the state of Arizona for several weeks.

UPS announced on Thursday that its venture capital arm has made a minority investment in TuSimple. The announcement also revealed that since May TuSimple autonomous trucks have been hauling UPS loads on a 115-mile route between Phoenix and Tucson.

TuSimple claims it can cut the average cost of shipping in a tractor-trailer by 30 percent.


Warning: Turn audio down.
“There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see.” ― Leonardo da Vinci

Insensible before the wave so soon released by callous fate. Affected most, they understand the least, and understanding, when it comes, invariably arrives too late

Sigmetnow

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #107 on: August 16, 2019, 03:27:09 AM »
UPS Has Been Delivering Cargo in Self-Driving Trucks for Months And No One Knew
...

I wonder if the truck has been pre-programmed to be in a specific lane, regardless of other traffic.  (Like a Cadillac CT6, although with that you can change lanes manually, without disengaging the system.)  In the 3+ lanes segment, many cars were passing the truck on the right. (Around 2:15 in, or ~25+ minutes on their time-lapse.)
« Last Edit: August 16, 2019, 03:54:20 AM by Sigmetnow »
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vox_mundi

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #108 on: August 16, 2019, 09:20:33 PM »
Quote
... I wonder if the truck has been pre-programmed to be in a specific lane, regardless of other traffic.

UPS monitors everything, especially speed limits. Sensors inside the truck monitor everything from whether the driver’s seat belt is buckled to how hard they’re braking, and if the truck’s doors are open or closed. All this data is compiled for UPS analysts who use it to come up with time-saving tactics.

Certain states outlaw Trucks in the left lane on Interstates. Other states require all vehicles to stay out of the left lane except to pass another vehicle. Many states’ laws say that you must stay in the right lanes if you’re driving slower than either the normal or legal rate of speed, unless you’re passing someone or making a legal left turn.

'No Trucks in the Left Lane' Laws by State
https://injury.findlaw.com/car-accidents/no-trucks-in-the-left-lane-laws-by-state.html

In Arizona:

- Must drive in right lane if driving slower than normal speed of traffic, except to pass another vehicle or turn left.
- Certain vehicles over 26,000 lbs. (or if pulling pole trailer over 6,000 lbs.) must use specific lanes if designated to do so by local authority.
“There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see.” ― Leonardo da Vinci

Insensible before the wave so soon released by callous fate. Affected most, they understand the least, and understanding, when it comes, invariably arrives too late

Sigmetnow

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #109 on: August 16, 2019, 09:41:27 PM »
Quote
... I wonder if the truck has been pre-programmed to be in a specific lane, regardless of other traffic.
...
Certain states outlaw Trucks in the left lane on Interstates.

Unless I’m mistaken, the truck at the stretch I mentioned was in the middle of three lanes, and cars were passing it in the right (slower) lane (which I think is illegal) which indicates the truck was going slower than the flow of traffic.  A Tesla using Nav on Autopilot would have moved into the right lane in such a situation.  That’s why I wondered if the trucks are using a simple “follow this line” programming, on a fixed route and in pre-determined lanes, and does not have any traffic-flow intelligence — other than perhaps traffic-aware cruise control (i.e., don‘t run into the car ahead of you in your lane), and I’m not sure the video even showed any instances of that:-\
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vox_mundi

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #110 on: August 16, 2019, 10:24:38 PM »
Truckers can't use the left lane and and they HATE using the right (slow) lane because of traffic from onramps. Braking and speeding up are inefficient for large trucks. That leaves the middle lane. The goal is to maintain a constant 65-68 mph for the entire trip.

Sadly, many non-truckers have absolutely no concept how to use freeway ramps - onramps in particular - and frequently cut in front of truck traffic that's going 20-30 MPH faster than they are. 40 tons of 'road locomotive' does not stop on a dime.

Since the vehicle is programmed not to exceed the speed limit it's probably happy to have people passing on either side. Less chance for an accident.
“There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see.” ― Leonardo da Vinci

Insensible before the wave so soon released by callous fate. Affected most, they understand the least, and understanding, when it comes, invariably arrives too late

Sigmetnow

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #111 on: August 17, 2019, 02:02:16 AM »
Truckers can't use the left lane and and they HATE using the right (slow) lane because of traffic from onramps. Braking and speeding up are inefficient for large trucks. That leaves the middle lane. The goal is to maintain a constant 65-68 mph for the entire trip.

Sadly, many non-truckers have absolutely no concept how to use freeway ramps - onramps in particular - and frequently cut in front of truck traffic that's going 20-30 MPH faster than they are. 40 tons of 'road locomotive' does not stop on a dime.

Since the vehicle is programmed not to exceed the speed limit it's probably happy to have people passing on either side. Less chance for an accident.

Avoiding the merging traffic makes sense.  But... I watched the video again, and the truck does slow down, multiple times, to 10 or even 15 mph below the speed limit, when cars merge in front of it.  It seems to maintain a huge following distance to whatever car is in front of it at speed  — maybe 4 or 5 semi-truck lengths — and it obeys the speed limit to the point where it’s almost always the slowest thing on the road.  Even other semis pass it. 
Quote
In Arizona:
- Must drive in right lane if driving slower than normal speed of traffic, except to pass another vehicle or turn left.

So it does ignore this law, when it stays in the middle lane while faster traffic moves by in the left and right lanes, even though it does handle merging vehicles just fine.  It’s definitely a conservative program, and I bet it is “lane locked.”  That kind of driving would never work in Los Angeles*, for example, where even Tesla’s “Mad Max” setting is not aggressive enough. ;)  But it’s an interesting experiment for trucks in what looks like a rather rural section of Arizona.

*Edit:  Actually, it’s likely this truck only has the programming to drive this one specific route.

Another edit:  A post re the Tesla electric semi (and recent performance testing thereof) in the Electric Cars thread.
https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,2686.msg222775.html#msg222775
« Last Edit: August 17, 2019, 02:12:13 PM by Sigmetnow »
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vox_mundi

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #112 on: August 17, 2019, 11:50:12 PM »
2 things to remember when watching that video

The video is sped up 16× so the illusion of vehicles passing it might not as very apparent in real time.

They're driving in the rain so the system was compensating while the drivers that were passing may not have.

Having lived in Arizona for 8 years and driven that route, I can attest that drivers drive stupid in the rain. Too fast for the conditions.
“There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see.” ― Leonardo da Vinci

Insensible before the wave so soon released by callous fate. Affected most, they understand the least, and understanding, when it comes, invariably arrives too late

TerryM

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #113 on: Today at 12:49:34 AM »
2 things to remember when watching that video

The video is sped up 16× so the illusion of vehicles passing it might not as very apparent in real time.

They're driving in the rain so the system was compensating while the drivers that were passing may not have.

Having lived in Arizona for 8 years and driven that route, I can attest that drivers drive stupid in the rain. Too fast for the conditions.
Waiting for them to try it on a run up to Flagstaff in February. ::)
Terry

vox_mundi

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #114 on: Today at 01:14:18 AM »
I worked a year up in Flag; '97 if I recall.

36" of snow in the middle of January

I-40 backed up 20 miles, SUV's flipped on their roofs.

I think the state of AZ owns 2 snowplows.

It was a very interesting year.
“There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see.” ― Leonardo da Vinci

Insensible before the wave so soon released by callous fate. Affected most, they understand the least, and understanding, when it comes, invariably arrives too late

TerryM

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #115 on: Today at 02:03:27 AM »
I worked a year up in Flag; '97 if I recall.

36" of snow in the middle of January

I-40 backed up 20 miles, SUV's flipped on their roofs.

I think the state of AZ owns 2 snowplows.

It was a very interesting year.


I managed to get snow bound in El Paso one winter.
Rigs flipped in both directions on I-10
I don't think anyone there had ever seen a snowplow. :)
Terry

Tor Bejnar

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #116 on: Today at 05:17:13 AM »
When I was at university (1070s) most of two hundred miles north of El Paso, Texas, an 8" snow fall (extremely rare for there) was followed by weeks of freezing weather (not rare), so the snow didn't melt.  The town or county put bulldozers and road-graters to work.  One road-grater cut too low and ripped out a half kilometer of pavement; so much for that experiment.  I commuted by bicycle and learned how to ride on ice.
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Sigmetnow

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #117 on: Today at 01:40:55 PM »
When I was at university (1070s) most of two hundred miles north of El Paso, Texas, an 8" snow fall (extremely rare for there) was followed by weeks of freezing weather (not rare), so the snow didn't melt.  The town or county put bulldozers and road-graters to work.  One road-grater cut too low and ripped out a half kilometer of pavement; so much for that experiment.  I commuted by bicycle and learned how to ride on ice.

 :o They let you use kilometers?  In Texas?!  ;D

In New York City, they put snow plows on garbage trucks when needed.  Those folks know the streets!  8)
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blumenkraft

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #118 on: Today at 03:28:11 PM »

 :o They let you use kilometers?  In Texas?!  ;D


... 8" snow ...

Just saying, but mixing metrics and imperial like that has killed one or another megaproject. ;)
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gerontocrat

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Re: Cars, cars and more cars Part Deux
« Reply #119 on: Today at 08:17:36 PM »

 :o They let you use kilometers?  In Texas?!  ;D


... 8" snow ...
A very expensive satellite............... and it is true
Just saying, but mixing metrics and imperial like that has killed one or another megaproject. ;)
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