Support the Arctic Sea Ice Forum and Blog

Author Topic: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs  (Read 26054 times)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #100 on: December 03, 2019, 04:19:08 PM »
Anyone would think winter had arrived.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #101 on: December 05, 2019, 07:21:51 PM »
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current - 4 Dec

But how much melt before the next blast ?
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #102 on: December 09, 2019, 11:58:03 AM »
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current - 4 Dec

Qu: But how much melt before the next blast ?
_____________________________
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current - 8 Dec

A:  Quite a lot (North America and Eurasia)

My speculation that belongs to me (mostly stolen from real scientists) - for North America especially ↠↠
Global heating ↠ Weak Polar Vortex
↠ ↠ large slow-moving Rossby Waves 
↠ ↠ influx of cold & snow from the North
↠ ↠ followed by influx of warmth from the South

= record snowfall & storms followed by strong melt = overall average snow cover.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

Shared Humanity

  • Guest
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #103 on: December 09, 2019, 10:42:10 PM »
47F and raining in Chicago.

Shared Humanity

  • Guest
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #104 on: December 15, 2019, 03:07:30 PM »
Generally, over recent years, snow cover extent has lagged snow water equivalent in the NH.

https://www.ccin.ca/index.php/ccw/snow/current

If we look at the current map for snow depth anomalies, it is clear what is happening. Positive anomalies are generally occurring at higher elevations and latitudes while negative anomalies are occurring at lower elevations and latitudes. Kind of expected, IMHO.


gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #105 on: December 18, 2019, 02:37:34 PM »
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current as at 17 December

New snow in North America, but wunderground.com say temperatures will rise in the US Lower 48. A thaw coming?

In Eurasia only modest new snowfall.

Overall snow cover extent for the Northern Hemisphere very much average.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #106 on: December 23, 2019, 06:12:10 PM »
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current as at 22 December

Interesting contrast between Snow Cover Extent (SCE) and Snow Water Equivalent (SWE).

In North America (NA) SCE is a average after a thaw at low latitudes, relatively low compared with the last 2 years. But SWE is above average.

Eurasia (EU) SCE is very much below average, mainly due to an absence of snow cover in Europe. But SWE is well very much above average.

In other words, where there is snow its thickness and therefore mass is very much above average.

We are also getting close to the maxima of SCE and SWE for the northern hemisphere, though from now to March or even April large snowfalls can happen.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #107 on: January 04, 2020, 08:26:48 PM »
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 3 January 2020

The situation as described below on 22 December has not changed. i.e. Snow Cover Extent at or below average, Snow Water Equivalent well above average, meaning average snow thickness (where it is lying) very much above average.

https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current as at 22 December

Interesting contrast between Snow Cover Extent (SCE) and Snow Water Equivalent (SWE).

In North America (NA) SCE is at average after a thaw at low latitudes, relatively low compared with the last 2 years. But SWE is above average.

Eurasia (EU) SCE is very much below average, mainly due to an absence of snow cover in Europe. But SWE is well very much above average.

In other words, where there is snow its thickness and therefore mass is very much above average.

From now to March or even April large snowfalls can happen.

ps: Snowfall on Greenland is also a bit below average.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

Tammukka

  • New ice
  • Posts: 13
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 4
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #108 on: January 17, 2020, 09:44:21 AM »
Im from Finland and I was amazed about inaccuracies on snow cover data. We have 1/4 country, about 80 000 km^2 snow free, and in nooa and rutgers it seem all snow here.

Shared Humanity

  • Guest
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #109 on: January 17, 2020, 03:21:43 PM »
The Snow Cover Extent and Snow Water Equivalent metrics are getting a little crazy.

(I miss having bbr2314 here saying it is heralding a new ice age.)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #110 on: January 17, 2020, 04:23:37 PM »
And so it goes on
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 16 January 2020

The situation as described in the quotes below has not really changed. i.e. Snow Cover Extent at or below average, Snow Water Equivalent well above average, meaning average snow thickness (where it is lying) very much above average.

The snow drought in much of Europe is impressive (see next post)
Snowfall on Greenland is somewhat below average (see next post)

https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 3 January 2020

The situation as described below on 22 December has not changed. i.e. Snow Cover Extent at or below average, Snow Water Equivalent well above average, meaning average snow thickness (where it is lying) very much above average.

https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current as at 22 December

Interesting contrast between Snow Cover Extent (SCE) and Snow Water Equivalent (SWE).

In North America (NA) SCE is at average after a thaw at low latitudes, relatively low compared with the last 2 years. But SWE is above average.

Eurasia (EU) SCE is very much below average, mainly due to an absence of snow cover in Europe. But SWE is well very much above average.

In other words, where there is snow its thickness and therefore mass is very much above average.

From now to March or even April large snowfalls can happen.

ps: Snowfall on Greenland is also a bit below average.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #111 on: January 17, 2020, 04:24:55 PM »
The snow drought in much of Europe is impressive
Snowfall on Greenland is somewhat below average
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

SimonF92

  • Frazil ice
  • Posts: 227
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 91
  • Likes Given: 47
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #112 on: January 17, 2020, 04:40:24 PM »
An interesting paper on modelling changes in Arctic precipitation over time

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-018-34450-3
Check out our home-grown ASIF MOSAiC website @ www.mosaic-ice.com:8501

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #113 on: January 22, 2020, 06:27:55 PM »
https://www.wunderground.com/article/storms/winter/news/2020-01-21-persistent-winter-storm-track-not-favorable-snow-south-east-us

illustrates ice deficit at lower latitudes, ice surplus at higher latitudes - the dividing line very much according to the average storm track largely determined by the track of the polar jet stream.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #114 on: January 23, 2020, 02:09:16 PM »
And so it goes on
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 22 January 2020

North America
Despite storms and headlines about Newfoundland under a record blanket of snow,
North America Snow Cover Extent (SCE) is back to within +1SD of average, while Snow Water Equivalent (SWE) remains very high

Eurasia
The snow drought in much of Europe and lower latitudes in Asia  is impressive, resulting in SCE at more than 1SD below average.
Even more impressive is SWE, steeply increasing and at a guess +2SD above average.

In other words, where there is snow its thickness and therefore mass is very much above average.

From now to March or even April large snowfalls can happen.
________________________________________________
(Snowfall on Greenland to date is also somewhat below average)
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

be cause

  • Nilas ice
  • Posts: 1307
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 567
  • Likes Given: 412
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #115 on: January 23, 2020, 07:32:27 PM »
Is it reasonable to assume that high SWE relates to deeper snow ? Could it not be wetter snow ? b.c.
2007 + 5 = 2012 + 4 = 2016 + 3 = 2019 + 2 = 2021 
 (phew)

kassy

  • Nilas ice
  • Posts: 2185
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 1182
  • Likes Given: 894
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #116 on: January 23, 2020, 11:03:05 PM »
Could be. That is why they do SWE in the first place.

To determine snow depth from SWE you need to know the density of the snow. The density of new snow ranges from about 5% when the air temperature is 14° F, to about 20% when the temperature is 32° F. After the snow falls its density increases due to gravitational settling, wind packing, melting and recrystallization.

https://www.nrcs.usda.gov/wps/portal/nrcs/detail/or/snow/?cid=nrcs142p2_046155

Þetta minnismerki er til vitnis um að við vitum hvað er að gerast og hvað þarf að gera. Aðeins þú veist hvort við gerðum eitthvað.

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #117 on: January 27, 2020, 08:31:09 PM »
And so it goes on
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 26 January 2020

North America
Despite storms and headlines about Newfoundland under a record blanket of snow,
North America Snow Cover Extent (SCE) has reduced to average, while Snow Water Equivalent (SWE) remains very high, though not increasing

Eurasia
The snow drought in much of Europe and lower latitudes in Asia  is impressive, resulting in SCE at more than 1SD below average.
Even more impressive is SWE, steeply increasing and at a guess +2SD and maybe moreabove average.

In other words, where there is snow its **thickness(?) and therefore mass is very much above average.

From now to March or even April large snowfalls can happen.

** OK - as the season progresses new snow will compress older snow.
________________________________________________
(Snowfall on Greenland to date is also somewhat below average)
[/quote]
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

The Walrus

  • Grease ice
  • Posts: 519
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 80
  • Likes Given: 23
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #118 on: January 27, 2020, 10:20:22 PM »
In all likelihood, the decreased snow cover can be related to the positive AO and fast polar jet stream.  This has locked up the cold air closer to the pole.  This is likely the cause of the colder Arctic and increased sea ice this winter.

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #119 on: January 30, 2020, 02:57:34 PM »
And so it goes on
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 29 January 2020


The map shows the low latitudes and Europe where the snow isn't where it should be and where it is well below average depth,

and the higher latitudes where it is at greater depth than usual.
__________________________________
(Snowfall on Greenland to date is also somewhat below average)
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

Tom_Mazanec

  • Young ice
  • Posts: 3144
    • View Profile
    • Planet Mazanec
  • Liked: 589
  • Likes Given: 219
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #120 on: January 30, 2020, 06:48:42 PM »
I imagine snow cover would be much more variable than sea ice, right?
SHARKS (CROSSED OUT) MONGEESE (SIC) WITH FRICKIN LASER BEAMS ATTACHED TO THEIR HEADS

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #121 on: February 01, 2020, 07:52:21 PM »
And so it goes on
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 31 January 2020

North America
Despite storms and headlines about Newfoundland under a record blanket of snow,
North America Snow Cover Extent (SCE) is at  average or even belw, while Snow Water Equivalent (SWE) remains very high, and increasing

Eurasia
The snow drought in much of Europe and lower latitudes in Asia  is impressive, resulting in SCE at much more than 1SD below average.
Even more impressive is SWE, steeply increasing and at a guess +2SD and maybe more above average.

In other words, where there is snow its **thickness(?) and therefore mass is very much above average.

Even so, from now to March or even April large snowfalls can happen.

** OK - as the season progresses new snow will compress older snow.
________________________________________________
(Snowfall on Greenland to date is also somewhat below average)
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #122 on: February 05, 2020, 05:46:15 PM »
And so it goes on
https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 31 January 2020

North America
North America Snow Cover Extent (SCE) is at  average or even below, while Snow Water Equivalent (SWE) remains very high, and increasing. (NO IMAGES TODAY)

Eurasia
The snow drought in much of Europe and lower latitudes in Asia is even more impressive, resulting in SCE at very much more than 1SD below average.

Even more impressive is SWE, still steeply increasing and at a guess +2SD and maybe more above average.

In other words, where there is snow its **thickness(?) and therefore mass is very much above average.

Even so, from now to March or even April large snowfalls can happen, but each day the window closes a bit.

** OK - as the season progresses new snow will compress older snow.
________________________________________________
(Snowfall on Greenland to date is also somewhat below average)
[/quote]
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #123 on: February 06, 2020, 07:49:47 PM »
I wanted a closer look at Europe Snow - & the penny dropped.

Tealight (aka Nico Sun) has some really good stuff @ https://cryospherecomputing.tk/index.html

Shows how really low snow cover in Europe is, especially compared with last year. More than 2 SDs below average.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #125 on: February 12, 2020, 02:33:54 PM »
Life is getting interesting for this thread. While Snow Water Equivalent continues to strongly increase, it is possible that Snow Cover Extent is reaching or has reached maximum for the winter 2019-20. It is more than 50 days after solstice. So at lower latitudes especially, on sunny days solar radiation is strong enough to melt snow even if air temperatures are at freezing.

So when will Snow Water Equivalent maximum be reached this year?

https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 11 February 2020

North America

The snow that last week reached as far south as Texas has melted away, bringing North America Snow Cover Extent (SCE) back to average or even below, while Snow Water Equivalent (SWE) remains very high, and increasing.

Eurasia
The snow drought in much of Europe and lower latitudes in Asia remains impressive, and looks like continuing for at least the next few days as the jet stream continues to hurl mild air nto Europe fom the West.

SCE is wobbling up and down at 1SD or more below average.

SWE is still steeply increasing and at a guess +2SD and maybe more above average.

In other words, where there is snow its **thickness(?) and therefore mass is very much above average.

Even so, from now to March or even April large snowfalls can happen, but each day the window closes a bit.

** OK - as the season progresses new snow will compress older snow.
________________________________________________
(Snowfall on Greenland to date is also somewhat below average)
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

kassy

  • Nilas ice
  • Posts: 2185
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 1182
  • Likes Given: 894
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #126 on: February 12, 2020, 03:31:00 PM »
For example, say there is a swimming pool that is filled with 36 inches of new powdery snow at 10% snow water density. If you could turn all the snow into water magically, you would be left with a pool of water 3.6 inches deep. In this case, the SWE of your snowpack would equal 36" x 0.10 = 3.6 inches.

...

To determine snow depth from SWE you need to know the density of the snow. The density of new snow ranges from about 5% when the air temperature is 14° F, to about 20% when the temperature is 32° F. After the snow falls its density increases due to gravitational settling, wind packing, melting and recrystallization.


So density 5% at 10C and 20% at around 0C.
So there is more water in snow at higher temperatures.

So the snow is in an overall warmer temperature range i guess.
Þetta minnismerki er til vitnis um að við vitum hvað er að gerast og hvað þarf að gera. Aðeins þú veist hvort við gerðum eitthvað.

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #127 on: February 16, 2020, 07:48:11 PM »

Tealight (aka Nico Sun) has some really good stuff @ https://cryospherecomputing.tk/index.html

The Graph Shows how really low snow cover in Europe is, and my guess its going to shrink some more.

The map shows snow extent at lower latitudes is well below average pretty much everywhere in the Northern Hemisphere.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

Shared Humanity

  • Guest
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #128 on: February 16, 2020, 08:53:18 PM »
Are the positive ice anomalies showing where freezing rain is occurring instead of snow?

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #129 on: February 16, 2020, 09:11:48 PM »
Are the positive ice anomalies showing where freezing rain is occurring instead of snow?
I think "ice" refers to sea ice.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

Shared Humanity

  • Guest
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #130 on: February 16, 2020, 11:39:24 PM »
Are the positive ice anomalies showing where freezing rain is occurring instead of snow?
I think "ice" refers to sea ice.
should have put that in stupid questions thread

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #131 on: February 18, 2020, 05:07:15 PM »
While Snow Water Equivalent continues to strongly increase, it is possible that Snow Cover Extent is reaching or has reached maximum for the winter 2019-20. It is more than 55 days after solstice. So at lower latitudes especially, on sunny days solar radiation is strong enough to melt snow even if air temperatures are at freezing.

So when will Snow Water Equivalent maximum be reached this year?

https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 17 February 2020

North America

North America Snow Cover Extent (SCE) is back to average or even below, while Snow Water Equivalent (SWE) remains very high, and still increasing strongly.

Eurasia
The snow drought in much of Europe and lower latitudes in Asia remains impressive,

SCE is wobbling up and down at around 1SD below average.

SWE is still increasing, at a guess +2SD and maybe more above average, but maybe a slowing down in the rate of increase.

Where there is snow its mass per km2 is very much above average.

We will probably see some wobbles from now on in SCE and in SWE very soon.
________________________________________________
(Snowfall on Greenland to date remains somewhat below average)
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #132 on: February 20, 2020, 12:42:39 PM »
When will Snow Water Equivalent maximum be reached this year?

https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 19 February 2020


Eurasia
The snow drought in much of Europe and lower latitudes in Asia remains impressive,

SCE is wobbling up and down at around 1SD below average, wih a significant drop on the 18-19 Feb.

SWE has a kink downwards on the 19th Feb - first dip since the snowfall season got underway

Has the max in Eurasia happened?
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

blumenkraft

  • Young ice
  • Posts: 4841
  • Fans of Hans Ø Club - circa 2018
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 1693
  • Likes Given: 2765
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #133 on: February 22, 2020, 09:48:48 PM »
Europe's snow cover is way down again. (left-hand scale is extent in 10^6km2)
“I’m an introvert. I’m just different that’s all. I’m so sorry. I don’t have a gun. I don’t do that stuff... All I was trying to do was to become better. I’ll do it... You all are phenomenal. You are beautiful. And I love you. Try to forgive me. I’m sorry.”

Elijah McClain

Comradez

  • New ice
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 29
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #134 on: February 24, 2020, 06:38:52 PM »
Wow, Northern hemisphere snow cover has gotta be approaching 2 standard deviations below normal now.  The albedo difference will now be having a signficant impact. 

Cryosphere Computing now has the northern hemisphere ice extent anomaly at -203,735 km^2 and the snow extent anomaly at -2,673,110 km^2...or a combined anomaly of -2,876,845 km^2.  This will be an interesting number to track this upcoming melting season.

The Walrus

  • Grease ice
  • Posts: 519
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 80
  • Likes Given: 23
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #135 on: February 24, 2020, 08:22:53 PM »
The Eurasian snow cover is approaching 2 sds below normal.  North America has near normal snow cover, but that is likely to change with the big snowstorm this week.  Overall, the snow cover is below normal, especially considering that the Eurasia snow cover is about twice that of North America.

Comradez

  • New ice
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 29
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #136 on: February 26, 2020, 09:19:58 PM »
Latest from Cryosphere Computing as of Feb. 25th:

Sea ice extent anomaly:  -331,629 km^2
Land snow extent anomaly:  -3,407,589 km^2
Combined:  -3,739,218 km^2

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #137 on: March 01, 2020, 12:36:06 PM »
With just 3 weeks to the Sping Equinox, at lower latitudes especially, on sunny days solar radiation is strong enough to melt snow even if air temperatures are at freezing.

So when will warmth defeat cold this year?

https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 29 February 2020

North America

North America Snow Cover Extent (SCE) - it snows, it melts, but the direction of travel is definitely down.
Snow Water Equivalent (SWE) remains very high, and still increasing strongly.

Eurasia
The snow drought in much of Europe and lower latitudes in Asia remains impressive.

As for North America, it snows, it melts, but the direction of travel of SCE is definitely down.

SWE is still increasing, at a guess +2SD and maybe more above average, but just maybe is peaking.

Where there is snow - i.e. at high latitudes -  its mass per m2 is very much above average.
Could this slow the final thaw?


________________________________________________
(Snowfall on Greenland (SMB) at this moment in time is significantly below average)
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

Comradez

  • New ice
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 29
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #138 on: March 05, 2020, 02:42:58 AM »
March 3rd, 2020 NH snow and ice extent anomalies:
Ice:  -233,268 km^2
Snow:  -2,734,452 km^2
Total:  -2,967,720 km^2

More warm weather in North America and Eurasia on the way...

wdmn

  • Grease ice
  • Posts: 520
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 217
  • Likes Given: 154
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #139 on: March 05, 2020, 06:26:24 AM »
March 3rd, 2020 NH snow and ice extent anomalies:
Ice:  -233,268 km^2
Snow:  -2,734,452 km^2
Total:  -2,967,720 km^2

More warm weather in North America and Eurasia on the way...

What are these numbers in relation to? What is the baseline?

Thanks

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #140 on: March 05, 2020, 01:10:58 PM »
March 3rd, 2020 NH snow and ice extent anomalies:
Ice:  -233,268 km^2
Snow:  -2,734,452 km^2
Total:  -2,967,720 km^2

More warm weather in North America and Eurasia on the way...

What are these numbers in relation to? What is the baseline?

Thanks
According to https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current

Northern Hemisphere Snow Cover Extent - SCE @ 4 march circa 38 million km2.
Nearly 1SD below average

Northern Hemisphere Snow Water Equivalent (mass) - SWE  @ 4 march circa nearly 4,000 km3 (GT).
At least 2 SD (600 km3) above average.

"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

Comradez

  • New ice
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 29
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #141 on: March 06, 2020, 05:01:04 PM »
March 5th, 2020 NH snow and ice extent anomalies:
Ice:  -247,586 km^2
Snow:  -2,852,769 km^2
Total:  -3,100,355 km^2
« Last Edit: March 08, 2020, 03:06:04 PM by Comradez »

Comradez

  • New ice
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 29
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #142 on: March 08, 2020, 03:05:44 PM »
March 7th, 2020 NH snow and ice extent anomalies:
Ice:  -381,036 km^2
Snow:  -2,927,178 km^2
Total:  -3,308,214 km^2

This spring is definitely going to be a test of whether Warm Arctic/Cold Continents (more like 2019) or Cold Arctic/Warm Continents (this spring of 2020 so far) is eventually more damaging to the summer sea ice. 

Comradez

  • New ice
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 29
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #143 on: March 09, 2020, 05:31:32 PM »
March 8th, 2020 NH snow and ice extent anomalies:
Ice:  -387,800 km^2
Snow:  -2,707,626 km^2
Total:  -3,095,426 km^2

The weird thing is, NH snowcover in 2012 on this date was still waaaay above normal.  (And sea ice extent was not markedly different).  So I'm not sure how much this data series really matters at this point for predicting eventual September ice extent.  But the lower albedo in the NH in 2020 has got to be having an effect by now.  According to CCI Reanalyzer's 10-day forecast, the above-average warmth will continue along the snow retreat lines in the Eastern U.S. and in Europe and East Asia for the next 10 days, with average 24-hour temperatures being above freezing.  The Western U.S. may get some snowfall, but regardless we will likely be looking at a significant snow extent deficit heading into the spring equinox. 

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #144 on: March 10, 2020, 10:45:36 PM »
A couple of images from Nico Sun's site @ https://cryospherecomputing.tk/index.html

Snow extent drought in Europe really a wow observation.

ps: No a clue why Nico's anomalies should be a bit different from those quoted by Comradez.
pps: Snow mass in Asia and Ameriky still miles above average. https://ccin.ca/home/sites/default/files/snow/snow_tracker/nh_swe.png
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #145 on: March 14, 2020, 02:42:06 PM »
Just one week to the Spring Equinox.
At lower latitudes especially, on sunny days solar radiation is strong enough to melt snow even if air temperatures are at freezing.

The point at which warmth defeats cold this year may well have been reached.

https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 29 February 2020

North America

North America Snow Cover Extent (SCE) - it snows, it melts, but the direction of travel is definitely down.
Snow Water Equivalent (SWE) remains very high, and still increasing but only in fits and starts.

Eurasia
The snow drought in much of Europe and lower latitudes in Asia remains impressive.

As for North America, it snows, it melts, but the direction of travel of SCE is consistently down, with SCE more than 1SD below average.

Just maybe SWE is at the peak.

Where there is snow - i.e. at high latitudes -  its mass per m2 is very much above average.
Could this slow the final thaw?


________________________________________________
ps: Snowfall on Greenland (SMB) at this moment in time remains significantly below average.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #146 on: March 14, 2020, 02:46:42 PM »
& here are NICO SUN's images, showing
- the ridiculously low snow cover in Europe,
- how below average snow cover is at lower latitudes.

This year is bang online with the predictions of the climate science modellers.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

jdallen

  • Young ice
  • Posts: 3177
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 389
  • Likes Given: 197
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #147 on: March 18, 2020, 11:07:48 PM »
Just one week to the Spring Equinox.
<snip>
Where there is snow - i.e. at high latitudes -  its mass per m2 is very much above average.
Could this slow the final thaw?

<snip>

I suspect that will depend a great deal on local albedo. On Tundra and Prairie, maybe.  On Taiga or Boreal forest, probably not so much.

There *will* be a lot more melt running into Arctic river systems, for longer and possibly sooner, which could have a pronounced effect along the major river deltas.
This space for Rent.

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #148 on: March 21, 2020, 08:36:47 PM »
Below average Snow Cover Extent now confined entirely to Europe. Asia tiny bit above & North America significantly above average.

But there is a lot of very recent new snow in NA which could disappear very quickly.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

  • First-year ice
  • Posts: 8658
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 3400
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Northern Hemisphere Winter 2019-2020 Snowcover / Misc Obs
« Reply #149 on: March 28, 2020, 02:00:35 PM »
One week after the Spring Equinox, and winter just will not let go, especially in North America.

The point at which warmth defeats cold this year may well have been reached.

https://ccin.ca/ccw/snow/current Snow Cover Extent and Mass as at 29 February 2020

North America

North America Snow Cover Extent (SCE) - it snows, it melts, its snows.
Snow Water Equivalent (SWE) remains very high, and still increasing but only in fits and starts.

Eurasia
The snow drought in much of Europe remains impressive, in Asia not.
SCE definitely reducing

Just maybe SWE is at the peak.
________________________________________________
ps: Snowfall on Greenland (SMB) at this moment in time remains significantly below average.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)