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Author Topic: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland  (Read 205601 times)

Tor Bejnar

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #550 on: June 22, 2018, 03:56:09 PM »
Tracy and Heilprin Glaciers (see recent post - with map)
OMG, the water's warm! NASA study solves glacier puzzle
in Psy.Org - June 22, 2018 by Alan Buis, Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Quote
A new NASA study explains why the Tracy and Heilprin glaciers, which flow side by side into Inglefield Gulf in northwest Greenland, are melting at radically different rates.

Using ocean data from NASA's Oceans Melting Greenland (OMG) campaign, the study documents a plume of warm water flowing up Tracy's underwater face, and a much colder plume in front of Heilprin. Scientists have assumed plumes like these exist for glaciers all around Greenland, but this is the first time their effects have been measured.
...
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Tor Bejnar

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #551 on: July 18, 2018, 04:21:51 PM »
Petermann Glacier's mid-glacier transverse crevasse is 'full' of water.  Sentinel-hub Playground images from July 16.  By comparing the colors in the mid-glacier stream with the crevasse water, it appears to me that deeper water is darker blue.  Clearly, the crevasse is not draining at this time (which rather surprises me).  (image has a '100 m' scale showing) 

Edits: A year ago (2017-8-29) shows a different distribution of water, including, it seems, water in the middle of the crevasse instead of the up-steam edge.  Crevasse is wider now.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2018, 04:51:05 PM by Tor Bejnar »
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Tor Bejnar

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #552 on: July 19, 2018, 09:28:15 PM »
What a difference a day can make (July 17 and July 18 - dates at top of gif): check out the higher resolution Sentinel-hub images.
Looks like the drain was pulled.  Or did something else happen? (e.g., big wet blotches disappeared, too.  Sun angle? Deep freeze?  [No clouds nearby])

That was "Natural Color".
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Tor Bejnar

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #553 on: July 23, 2018, 09:38:31 PM »
In yesterday's PolarView, I see lineations on Petermann Glacier again (still): this time a fairly straight one within the long oval going from edge to mid-glacier crevasse.  (Second image has suggestive dots.  There are alternate routes.)  There is a parallel lineation segment just below the dashed like.  (I don't see anything on Sentinel-hub Playground to support there being a crack here.)

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #554 on: July 25, 2018, 10:59:53 PM »
As of the 23rd a large floe has broken loose and has started moving.

http://ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/images/MODIS/Kennedy/20180724AQUA.jpg

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #555 on: July 27, 2018, 04:09:19 AM »
What do you think?
Any chance of these breaking off later this year?
On the south side.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2018, 06:34:53 AM by Thomas Barlow »

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Neven

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #557 on: July 30, 2018, 08:27:13 PM »
Darn it, too busy. How big is this one compared to the previous two?
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Tor Bejnar

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #558 on: July 30, 2018, 09:05:03 PM »
Neven, it is just sea ice that has broken off the front of the glacier.  There is no new iceberg.
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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #559 on: July 31, 2018, 12:15:34 AM »
Thanks, Tor! I thought it looked too blue to be true.
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Thomas Barlow

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #560 on: August 01, 2018, 04:02:15 AM »
Yea, not  the sea-ice. The other bits look precarious on that south side is what I was looking at, but I'm realizing they are much more stable than they look.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2018, 04:08:37 AM by Thomas Barlow »

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #561 on: August 12, 2018, 04:46:35 PM »
It looks like we had a tiny calving at Petermann, no risk for shipping or sea level rise, the small inserted image from today August 12 2018 07:45 UTC Aqua / MODIS, the calving is in the middle of glacier front above the pink arrow.
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Espen

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #562 on: August 12, 2018, 11:20:34 PM »
False alarm

Here is the a link to the image from where I got the wrong information, sorry:

https://lance.modaps.eosdis.nasa.gov/cgi-bin/imagery/single.cgi?image=crefl2_143.A2018224074500-2018224075000.2km.jpg
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Espen

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #563 on: August 31, 2018, 09:56:32 PM »
A minor starboard calving has happened at Petermann Gletscher:
« Last Edit: August 31, 2018, 10:07:39 PM by Espen »
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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #564 on: September 07, 2018, 04:27:01 PM »
A significant calving? (Worldview from 5/9, can't see anything for clouds on 6/9)  Or is this just worldview drawing a previous line?

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #565 on: September 07, 2018, 04:33:41 PM »
Ignore previous post - looks like it is a feature of Worldview I hadn't noticed before.

Tor Bejnar

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #566 on: September 11, 2018, 04:06:59 PM »
New ice in Petermann Fjord. (Sentinel-hub Playground)
P.S. The ~700 m wide rhombus (diamond) shaped iceberg near the left shore short broke off of Petermann Glacier between September 5 and 7.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2018, 08:35:20 PM by Tor Bejnar »
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Phil.

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #567 on: September 11, 2018, 06:47:20 PM »
New ice in Petermann Fjord. (Sentinel-hub Playground)
P.S. The ~700 m wide rhombus (diamond) shaped iceberg near the left short broke off of Petermann Glacier between September 5 and 7.

Looks like there could be a couple more fragments in the near future too.


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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #569 on: October 10, 2018, 11:16:52 PM »
It looks like the big side crack made a turn and started growing towards the centre crack. When they connect the next big calving is 3/4 complete.

http://bslmagb.nerc-bas.ac.uk/iwsviewer/?image=DataPolarview/111_S1jpeg2000_201810/S1A_IW_GRDH_1SDH_20181010T113546_FB8F_N_1.8bit.jp2

Espen

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #570 on: October 11, 2018, 10:00:30 PM »
It looks like the big side crack made a turn and started growing towards the centre crack. When they connect the next big calving is 3/4 complete.

http://bslmagb.nerc-bas.ac.uk/iwsviewer/?image=DataPolarview/111_S1jpeg2000_201810/S1A_IW_GRDH_1SDH_20181010T113546_FB8F_N_1.8bit.jp2

Tealight nice spotting, we may have a very large calving next summer?
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Tor Bejnar

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #571 on: October 19, 2018, 08:30:46 PM »
I repeatedly see 'lineations' that run from the mid-glacier crevasse to the 'left' (west) edge of the glacial tongue on PolarView images (e.g., January and July), as well as from the lateral crevasse to the well developed cracks on the eastern side (as does Tealight).  However, I have not seen supportive imagery using Sentinel Hub. [PolarView image from yesterday.  SentinelHub image from Sept. 11 of yellow circle area.]
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Tor Bejnar

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #572 on: November 14, 2018, 08:48:03 PM »
Hiawatha Glacier was mentioned in this thread once, so I post this here.

Impact crater 19 miles wide found beneath Greenland glacier
The Guardian  -  November 14, 2018
Quote
A mile-wide iron asteroid hit the Hiawatha glacier perhaps as recently as 12,000 years ago. The resulting impact crater 19.3 miles wide has remained hidden under a half-mile-thick ice sheet until now
Much better article in Science Magazine.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2018, 09:41:11 PM by Tor Bejnar »
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Tor Bejnar

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #573 on: December 17, 2018, 06:46:35 PM »
Once again I'll show an image suggesting a connection between the mid-glacier crevasse and down-fjord side crevasses  I wonder how many of you think I'm "seeing things" (that aren't there) ...

Dec. 16 image from PolarView.
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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #574 on: December 17, 2018, 07:28:40 PM »
Once again I'll show an image suggesting a connection between the mid-glacier crevasse and down-fjord side crevasses  I wonder how many of you think I'm "seeing things" (that aren't there) ...
My eyes say yes to the connection but they cannot be relied upon.
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Re: Petermann Gletscher / North West Greenland
« Reply #575 on: December 20, 2018, 12:35:31 PM »
Petermann is EXACTLY where it was last year on this date (area wise).  The shape of the terminus and it's position relative to the valleys north and south of it is unchanged. There are no major fractures sen either.  This summer has been the coldest in at least 7 years in NW Greenland as well.
It is still flowing 3+ m/day and the past summer looks "normal" to me. The graph is from Enveo Cryoportal.

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #576 on: December 20, 2018, 04:12:15 PM »
Petermann not moving?
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Re: Petermann Gletscher / North West Greenland
« Reply #577 on: December 20, 2018, 04:17:08 PM »
Petermann is EXACTLY where it was last year on this date (area wise).  The shape of the terminus and it's position relative to the valleys north and south of it is unchanged. There are no major fractures sen either.  This summer has been the coldest in at least 7 years in NW Greenland as well.

Note this post is dated 2013!

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #578 on: January 27, 2019, 12:55:47 PM »
Slow and steady growth of the side crack continued, now growing directly towards the centre crack and about halfway there. I'd bet they connect by the start of summer.

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #579 on: January 27, 2019, 02:15:40 PM »
Once again I'll show an image suggesting a connection between the mid-glacier crevasse and down-fjord side crevasses  I wonder how many of you think I'm "seeing things" (that aren't there) ...

Tried to be non destructive/creative with the enhancements. Polarview, yesterday.
edit: Same treatment on jpg2000, never looked at those before. No default as it's practically all black.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2019, 02:48:15 PM by uniquorn »

Espen

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #580 on: January 27, 2019, 02:56:00 PM »
Or year to year:
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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #581 on: January 27, 2019, 04:54:50 PM »
Much lower resolution but worldview brightness temperature might add some background info.
https://go.nasa.gov/2FQMJqT

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #582 on: February 07, 2019, 10:17:34 AM »
New paper our, stating that Petermann velocity has increased by 10% after the 2012 mega-calving, and that new one is coming. From AWI:

Quote
Risse kündigen Abbruch eines großen Eisberges am Petermann-Gletscher an

AWI-Forscher messen höheres Fließtempo des Gletschers und sagen eine weitere Beschleunigung im Falle eines Abbruchs voraus

[06. Februar 2019]
Risse in der schwimmenden Eiszunge des Petermann-Gletschers im äußersten Nordwesten Grönlands deuten auf einen weiteren Abbruch eines großen Eisberges hin. Wie Glaziologen des Alfred-Wegener-Institutes, Helmholtz-Zentrum für Polar- und Meeresforschung (AWI) in einer neuen Studie berichten, hat sich seit einem Eisberg-Abbruch im Jahr 2012 das Fließtempo des Gletschers um durchschnittlich 10 Prozent erhöht, sodass in der Folgezeit neue Risse entstanden sind – ein durchaus natürlicher Vorgang. Modellsimulationen der Forscher zeigen jedoch: Sollten auch diese Eismassen abbrechen, wird sich der Petermann-Gletscher vermutlich weiter beschleunigen und mehr Eis ins Meer transportieren, mit entsprechenden Folgen für den globalen Meeresspiegel. Die Studie ist im „Journal of Geophysical Research: Earth Surface“ erschienen und frei erhältlich.

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #583 on: February 07, 2019, 04:05:38 PM »
New paper our, stating that Petermann velocity has increased by 10% after the 2012 mega-calving, and that new one is coming. From AWI:

Quote
Risse kündigen Abbruch eines großen Eisberges am Petermann-Gletscher an

AWI-Forscher messen höheres Fließtempo des Gletschers und sagen eine weitere Beschleunigung im Falle eines Abbruchs voraus



[06. Februar 2019]
Risse in der schwimmenden Eiszunge des Petermann-Gletschers im äußersten Nordwesten Grönlands deuten auf einen weiteren Abbruch eines großen Eisberges hin. Wie Glaziologen des Alfred-Wegener-Institutes, Helmholtz-Zentrum für Polar- und Meeresforschung (AWI) in einer neuen Studie berichten, hat sich seit einem Eisberg-Abbruch im Jahr 2012 das Fließtempo des Gletschers um durchschnittlich 10 Prozent erhöht, sodass in der Folgezeit neue Risse entstanden sind – ein durchaus natürlicher Vorgang. Modellsimulationen der Forscher zeigen jedoch: Sollten auch diese Eismassen abbrechen, wird sich der Petermann-Gletscher vermutlich weiter beschleunigen und mehr Eis ins Meer transportieren, mit entsprechenden Folgen für den globalen Meeresspiegel. Die Studie ist im „Journal of Geophysical Research: Earth Surface“ erschienen und frei erhältlich.

There will always be a new one, thats the nature of a glacier?
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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #584 on: February 07, 2019, 05:46:38 PM »
Has anyone been able to find an animation which shows the location of the calving events and the new cracks?    From what I can tell, the flow is about 3,000 Ft / yr, so the face has moved ~9,000 feet, or a little less than 2 miles in since the 2016 calving.  The new cracks are 8 miles from the face, so if we assume it calves this summer, that would be a retreat of about 6 miles?

FK

Tor Bejnar

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #585 on: March 29, 2019, 06:29:41 PM »
Sentinel-hub images of Petermann Glacier have started to be available this season - surprise, surprise, lots of snow, and the boundary between the end of the shelf and the start of fast ice is subtle (which I do not attempt to show). 

Below is a pair of 'natural' views of the crack I'm obsessed with. The one with "E" is east of the mid-glacier [or floating ice tongue or shelf] valley, and to my surprise, the one with "W" (includes the mid-glacier valley) appears to show some melt water [pale blue]. Shadows and exposed ice just look different - if I understand what I'm seeing.  Any real experts on interpreting these images out there? (Best image this week is from March 24.)
« Last Edit: March 29, 2019, 06:35:43 PM by Tor Bejnar »
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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #586 on: March 29, 2019, 09:21:59 PM »
I am aware there are some movements around, but I do not expect a major calving this season, meaning a calving leaving an island of ice (an iceberg worth mentioning)  my observations around Greenland is we are in pause phase, but on the other hand I am listening to much to Led Zeppelin at moment then everything is relative. When the levee breaks comes to mind
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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #587 on: April 03, 2019, 05:23:36 PM »
Here's a nice clear Sentinel Image of the Petermann.


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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #588 on: April 04, 2019, 10:51:38 PM »
""we find an average acceleration of 10%""...

""This indicates that, from a dynamical point of view, the terminus region has already detached from the main ice tongue.""

""if the trend of a retreating calving front continues, PG is likely to further accelerate in the future. We attribute this to a loss of buttressing caused by the retreat further upstream and a subsequent loss of friction with the fjords walls.""

""the observed speedup in 2016 suggests that the ice in the frontal part is already detached from the stabilizing fjord walls. ""

Calving Induced Speedup of Petermann Glacier.
- Martin Rückamp  Niklas Neckel  Sophie Berger  Angelika Humbert  Veit Helm
First published: 11 January 2019

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2018JF004775
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 11:22:49 PM by Thomas Barlow »

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #589 on: April 04, 2019, 11:19:53 PM »
Just for fun. In light of paper posted above.
I wonder which area they are saying has detatched from main tongue, and how significant that could be?

Click to view animated gif of glacier over 1 year.
- April 5 2018 -> April 4 2019:
« Last Edit: April 13, 2019, 07:28:26 PM by Thomas Barlow »

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #590 on: April 04, 2019, 11:31:36 PM »
"Cracks herald the calving of a large iceberg from Petermann Glacier" - GeoSpace - Earth & Space Science.
""Cracks in the floating ice tongue of Petermann Glacier in the far northwest reaches of Greenland indicate the pending loss of another large iceberg.""

""Glaciologists from the Alfred Wegener Institute, Helmholtz Centre for Polar and Marine Research (AWI) in Bremerhaven, Germany report in a new study that the glacier’s flow rate has increased by an average of 10 percent since the calving event in 2012, during which time new cracks have also formed – a quite natural process.""

""However, the experts’ model simulations also show that, if these ice masses truly break off, Petermann Glacier’s flow rate will likely accelerate further and transport more ice out to sea, with corresponding effects on the global sea level.""

https://blogs.agu.org/geospace/2019/02/06/cracks-herald-the-calving-of-a-large-iceberg-from-petermann-glacier/
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 11:38:59 PM by Thomas Barlow »

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #591 on: April 04, 2019, 11:52:01 PM »
Or year to year:
I think you can kindof see it on my July 2017 post, in the zoomed in images and markings I made. It may have become clearer, maybe not much has changed structurally deep down.
https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,53.msg120534.html#msg120534
« Last Edit: April 05, 2019, 12:00:15 AM by Thomas Barlow »

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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #592 on: April 09, 2019, 04:56:31 AM »
Where's the grounding line on this?
Polar View April 8th

 


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Re: Petermann Gletscher / Petermann Fjord / North West Greenland
« Reply #594 on: April 13, 2019, 07:33:39 PM »
Where's the grounding line on this?
Much farther upstream, see:

https://www.cambridge.org/core/services/aop-cambridge-core/content/view/7309C276E62C3B38C05CC4379A7C8028/S0022143016000836a.pdf/div-class-title-grounding-line-migration-from-1992-to-2011-on-petermann-glacier-north-west-greenland-div.pdf

Thanks!
Most of that stuff in the image must be basically floating then?
I've seen a site that shows altitude changes (breaking and lowering closer to sea-level before they fully break off) for glaciers in the Antarctic. Is there something like that for Arctic region?
« Last Edit: April 13, 2019, 07:48:12 PM by Thomas Barlow »