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When will the Arctic Extent dip below 1,000,000 Km^2

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Voting closed: July 27, 2018, 07:46:32 AM

Author Topic: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?  (Read 503073 times)

Richard Rathbone

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2700 on: November 17, 2023, 06:17:58 PM »

It is forever, at the very least.

Ten degrees is impossible to reach. Every doubling of CO2 causes between 1.5 and 4 degrees C rise in temperatures (the jury is still out on this very important metric!).

Let us go with the absolute maximum of 4C for each doubling. We have already gone from 280 to 415 ppm, so still some distance to go for a full doubling (145 ppm, or about 60 years at the current rate of increase of CO2).

The second doubling, which would take us to 8 degrees, would need to add 560 ppm to the atmosphere, which would be doable within 225 years at current rate of emission. So after 225+60 = 285 years we might just have reached 8 degrees above pre-industrial, given the current rate of emissions. The extra 2 degrees could be reached within another 200 years, so let us say 500 years.

This is the short term response without feedbacks that operate on multidecadal to millenia timescales. One you start to consider what happens after centuries to millenia at doubled CO2, its higher, potentially a lot higher. This is where Hansen's 10C comes from. Keep emitting just enough to hold atmospheric concentrations at their current values for 2000 years and he calculates that the equilibrium would be 8-10C.  (Atmospheric equilibrium for zero emissions would be lower concentration and hence lower temperature)

None of us are going to live long enough to find out just what the effect of centuries of icecap melt is, but it wouldn't take anything like the amount of increasing concentration to get to 10C that you calculate because the long term feedbacks add substantial warming once the timescale is measured in centuries.

morganism

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2701 on: November 17, 2023, 09:03:47 PM »
binntho, i was trying to find if the Alutian Islands were geologically part of the Juneau portion of Alaska, and if the Juan De Fuca plate had "spun" them out there.

If a "big" quake hits there again, I could imagine all the clathrate from Washington state to the Bering strait letting go. That would give a big pulse to the climate.
Would also be interested if the tsunami across to the siberian shelf would lower the water pressure enough to release some of that clathrate too...

kiwichick16

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2702 on: November 18, 2023, 02:55:10 AM »
@  RR  ......+1


also  continental drift could make large parts of the planet "uninhabitable"

https://scitechdaily.com/pangea-ultima-the-supercontinent-that-could-wipe-out-nearly-all-mammals/










binntho

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2703 on: November 18, 2023, 07:32:17 AM »
... at a higher temperature, the doubling of CO2 would cause a different temperature change.  This might be part of why scientists cannot really nail down what the temperature delta is for a doubling of CO2. [For all I know, the Δt/doubling CO2 is 4.0ºC at the current temperature and 6.0ºC when it's 3º warmer that it is now.]

Interesting point. The doubling of CO2 causes temperature rise due to two seperate factors: 1) The CO2 itself, which causes appr. 1°C direct rise per doubling regardless of prior levels, and 2) The concomitant rise in H2O vapour as a result of increased temperatures. Water vapour is a very potent greenhouse gas. The question of how much H2O will rise during our "current" doubling is what causes the very large margin of error in estimating total temperature rise.


And there is that thing I read in The World Before Us which claimed an 7-10º increase in 3 years (14,700 years ago).  I know; this may not be true, even though published.

This is a very often repeated misunderstanding. Ice cores from Greenland do show a very sharp rise in temperatures at the start of the so-called Bølling-Allerød warming period 14.700 years BP. This warming changed the temperatures and chemical composition of the Northern Atlantic (possibly because of a resurgence of the AMOC) and the snow that falls on Greenland is sourced from this area. So the Greenland ice core shows a very sharp increase in Northern Atlantic temperatures. On a global scale, the temperature increase was much more modest, perhaps 1 or 2 degrees. The difference between the last glacial minimum and current holocene maximum is around 8 degrees globally.
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binntho

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2704 on: November 18, 2023, 07:35:40 AM »

This is the short term response without feedbacks that operate on multidecadal to millenia timescales. One you start to consider what happens after centuries to millenia at doubled CO2, its higher, potentially a lot higher. This is where Hansen's 10C comes from. Keep emitting just enough to hold atmospheric concentrations at their current values for 2000 years and he calculates that the equilibrium would be 8-10C.  (Atmospheric equilibrium for zero emissions would be lower concentration and hence lower temperature)

That does not make sense in any way. Paeloclimate does not show 10 degrees higher temperatures than today from current CO2 levels, so why should the future result in this? What mechanism wold cause 10 degrees warming from 415 ppm CO2 equivalent? This sounds like a lot of rubbish to me, who is this Hansen guy anyway  :P ?
because a thing is eloquently expressed it should not be taken to be as necessarily true
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binntho

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2705 on: November 18, 2023, 07:44:54 AM »
@  RR  ......+1


also  continental drift could make large parts of the planet "uninhabitable"

https://scitechdaily.com/pangea-ultima-the-supercontinent-that-could-wipe-out-nearly-all-mammals/

This is all very much fun but, well, the last time we had a Pangea, there were no mammals either. Looking at CO2 levels from that time (which are admittedly not all that well established), the formation of the last Pangea raised CO2 from around 1000ppm to 2000 ppm.

So the next pangea, after 250 million years - but mammals will be long extinct by then, unless we humans make sure that enough CO2 stays in the atmosphere to maintain something close to current climatic levels.

Without our human input, life constantly drains CO2 from the atmosphere (as it has done for the last 500 million years), and after another 250 million years of this, the planet will be in the deep freezer and I wouldn't like to give mammals (or any higher lifeforms, i.e. anything other than bacteria) much of a change.
because a thing is eloquently expressed it should not be taken to be as necessarily true
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oren

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2706 on: November 18, 2023, 09:51:57 AM »
While I enjoy reading the lively discussion, it is my duty to point out is has nothing to do with the subject of this thread - When will the Arctic go ice free in summer (for the first time; or regularly if you insist).
Continental drift, the sun expanding, slow feedbacks that operate over thousands of years - are all irrelevant to this.
If this is to continue, why not start a thread "What would it take for global temps to rise 10C or more?" or some such, and have a go at it?

Richard Rathbone

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2707 on: November 18, 2023, 12:39:44 PM »
While I enjoy reading the lively discussion, it is my duty to point out is has nothing to do with the subject of this thread - When will the Arctic go ice free in summer (for the first time; or regularly if you insist).
Continental drift, the sun expanding, slow feedbacks that operate over thousands of years - are all irrelevant to this.
If this is to continue, why not start a thread "What would it take for global temps to rise 10C or more?" or some such, and have a go at it?
The main thread for discussion of when the arctic goes ice free in summer is in the stickies. If you don't want this one to evolve into when the arctic goes ice free in winter, I suggest you lock the thread.

gerontocrat

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2708 on: November 18, 2023, 10:03:29 PM »
Steven has produced Arctic Ocean surface air temperature data from NCEP.

So I've had a first look at it. On the one hand we have bottom melt from ocean water, and on the other hand we have both freezing and melt from surface air temperatures. I thought I would see if the trend in increasing surface temperatures could be seen to increase the vulnerability and fragility of Arctic sea ice.

The attached graph is my first attempt. It is obvious that average annual Arctic surface air temperatures are increasing. Of interest is that the average is now breaching -10 Celsius.

Minus 10 is often quoted as when freezing of sea ice is guaranteed.
So I looked at how many days temperaures are above that.
Then I looked at -1.8 celsius, the freezing point of sea water.
And finally at -5, with the vague idea it is perhaps odds-on whether at that temperature bottom melting from ocean water and surface freezing might be in a 50-50 situation.

The graph shows that inexorably the number of days when temperature is above these levels is increasing over time.

I could apply this graph to the indvidual regions, but my download from Steven's data has no row 1 with the region names on each column. I would also like a version (because i am greedy) of the Arctic ocean area to exclude Baffin Bay which is separate from the Arctic Ocean proper.

If nothing else it does show that the number of winter days is going down and the number of summer days is going up.
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Glen Koehler

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2709 on: November 18, 2023, 10:12:37 PM »
     Great work! It belongs on your greatest hits album.  The folks that create the Cryosphere Report Card should put you on their team.
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binntho

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2710 on: November 19, 2023, 06:40:28 AM »
Glen, excellent idea! But I worry that the area behind Steve's numbers reach far outside the Arctic proper, into areas where ice never forms even during winter. Also using 925mb temperatures (if that is what he is doing) makes me very unsure if you can apply the -10°C criteria.

See this post in Slater's thread.
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Phil.

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2711 on: November 19, 2023, 05:09:31 PM »
The red zone shown is within the Arctic circle, what do you term "the Arctic proper".

gerontocrat

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2712 on: November 19, 2023, 06:41:24 PM »
The red zone shown is within the Arctic circle, what do you term "the Arctic proper".
Horses for courses

The subject of this thread is "When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?".  So for that purpose one should look at air temperatures in regions which are likely to be the last refuge of sea ice? The last remaining sea ice will be somewhere in the High Arctic, i.e. the Kara, Laptev, ESS, Chukchi, Beaufort, CAA, & Central Arctic regions. One could exclude those regions that are ice-free in most summers already, the Kara?, the Chukchi? The Laptev is also a maybe. Baffin Bay is only connected to the High Arctic via the Nares Strait, and anyway melts out most years.

Sea ice area graphs attached - the Kara does not go down to zero because of the NSIDC mask.


So I have downloaded Steven's Regional NCEP surface air temperature data which will form the basis for a 2nd attempt.

But to recreate Slater's projection a more comprehensive selection is required which is certainly beyond my capabilities to attempt.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2023, 03:16:44 PM by gerontocrat »
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binntho

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2713 on: November 20, 2023, 07:18:09 AM »
The red zone shown is within the Arctic circle, what do you term "the Arctic proper".

My confusion stems from the map published by Stephen in the other thread (linked in my post) which shows a lot more than just the Arctic circle. The map that Glenn publishes is very different, but I would still like to get clarification.

EDIT the "Arctic Ocean" numbers use this map here, it is only the individual regional graphs that make use of the other map. So thanks for the clarifiation.



Stephen seems to be using 925mb temperatures in an area that is much much larger than the Arctic itself. Two points that work against Glen's conclusion, i.e. if he is basing his graph on Stephen's numbers.

So please again ... a lot of clarification is needed for Glen's graph: What area is actually being used, and is it 925mb temperatures or surface temperatures? Without those questions answered, the graph is useless.

We still need to clarify whether these are surface temperatures or 925mb temperatures.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2023, 07:27:10 AM by binntho »
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Steven

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2714 on: November 20, 2023, 06:43:45 PM »
We still need to clarify whether these are surface temperatures or 925mb temperatures.

I made the data files available for both surface air temperature and 925mb temperature.

The title of gerontocrat's graph upthread is "Arctic Ocean surface air temperatures", so it's safe to assume he used the surface data rather than the 925mb data.

gerontocrat

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2715 on: November 20, 2023, 07:44:58 PM »
We still need to clarify whether these are surface temperatures or 925mb temperatures.
Steven provides both.
For my graphs on this thread I am using surface temperature data, as I want the temperature at the surface not the temperature at 925 mb.

From Steven's website : https://sites.google.com/view/arctic-sea-ice/home/temperature
Data spreadsheets
925 millibars temperature for Slater's region
Surface temperature for Slater's region
925 mb daily regional data
925 mb monthly regional data
Surface daily regional data
Surface monthly regional data

Here are a couple of graphs about temperatures in the High Arctic - which is basically Slater's region without Baffin Bay which I exclude basically because it is outside the main Arctic ocean & only connected by the Nares Strait..

If nothing else the first graph of daily temperatures 1979-2023 shows that the increase in winter temperatures far exceeds that of summer. Of note is that the increase in temperatures is highest in the period September to Novenmber.
Also the The graph is very noisy - so I am thinking a 7 day trailing average might sort that out a bit. (The noise shows up far more in graphs for the smaller indvidual regions).


The 2nd to 4th graphs show the number of days exceed various levels for each year 1979-2022..
All show a gradual but persistent increase.

I am not confident in how much use all of this is in answering the question "When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?"
« Last Edit: November 20, 2023, 08:02:49 PM by gerontocrat »
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gerontocrat

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2716 on: November 20, 2023, 09:41:14 PM »
Graphs showing how noise gets reduced from using a 7 day trailing average
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Stephan

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2717 on: November 21, 2023, 10:15:38 PM »
Great work, gerontocrat. Much appreciated.

If I look at the decadal averages I see the largest heating trend for Sep-Oct-Nov, and the smallest trend for Apr - May. I compared these months with the slopes of the linear extrapolations of extent, area, volume and thickness of Arctic Sea Ice.
They are steepest in Aug to Oct and the flattest between March and May. Any coincidence?
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gerontocrat

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2718 on: November 21, 2023, 10:31:52 PM »
Great work, gerontocrat. Much appreciated.

If I look at the decadal averages I see the largest heating trend for Sep-Oct-Nov, and the smallest trend for Apr - May. I compared these months with the slopes of the linear extrapolations of extent, area, volume and thickness of Arctic Sea Ice.
They are steepest in Aug to Oct and the flattest between March and May. Any coincidence?
IMO definitely not a coincidence.
I am starting to think about looking at the dates when temperatures pass various temperatures over the years and trending them into the future (using more than one trend equation).
Also relating that to trends in sea ice area.

I would use 7 day averages on data to date to smooth things out a bit. Vedry speculative but might be interesting to see where it leads.

A task for a non-busy day. We are getting a 3 day gale up here very soon so maybe....
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kassy

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2719 on: November 21, 2023, 11:11:32 PM »
If I look at the decadal averages I see the largest heating trend for Sep-Oct-Nov, and the smallest trend for Apr - May.

So the biggest difference is summer/autumn melt.
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gerontocrat

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2720 on: November 22, 2023, 12:58:02 AM »
If I look at the decadal averages I see the largest heating trend for Sep-Oct-Nov, and the smallest trend for Apr - May.

So the biggest difference is summer/autumn melt.
Methinks mostly at and after the summer minimum and during the first 2 months of the freeze.

I attach the Chukchi sea ice area graph turned upside down and the Chukchi temperture graph just to make a visual comparison (I haven't down the other regions temperature graphs yet).

Perhaps the increase in Autumn temperatures is imprinting winter sea ice growth (thickness?) enough to bring down the following minimum. Speculation but worth a longer look.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2023, 01:10:29 PM by gerontocrat »
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Andruin

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2721 on: November 22, 2023, 12:58:39 PM »
If I look at the decadal averages I see the largest heating trend for Sep-Oct-Nov, and the smallest trend for Apr - May.

So the biggest difference is summer/autumn melt.

Makes sense. The temperatures over ice should be similar, but temperatures over a mix of ice and water, or over just water should vary quite a bit.

There might be a way to correlate ice cover with temperature, but it's not something I have the time to do.

Daniel

kassy

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2722 on: November 24, 2023, 09:36:59 PM »
Well it is ice flows that bump into each other which (still) happens quite a lot.

Quote
According to the definition by the World Meteorological Organization, an ice ridge is a line or wall of broken ice that is forced up by pressure (WMO, 2014). ...

It's the pressure that is wanting in today's Arctic. Floes bumping into each other isn't enough to create ice ridges.

And this you can see in the decline of the old ice skeleton which gets squeezed into Greenland.
Overall this will result in thinner ice so more melting in the CAB over time. Add to that some more export and you get the end of the slow transition. Removing ice early will lead to more vertical heat mixing so a lot more open water which will result in some fractional BOE years before we hit the proper value.

Anyway we know that ice around 1900 was a lot thicker but that either melted or got flushed out. Then we get to the time we have data on and a lot of the old thick ice got exported. History repeats because there are not that much variations. This year we saw a lot of export and what is exported does not need to melt in the Arctic plus it leaves a hole although it won´t be at the location where the export is. There can be ice that grows near Siberia but it´s not going to be as thick as the exported ice so it does not look as a hole on extent or area but it is one in thickness.



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Glen Koehler

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2723 on: December 03, 2023, 06:58:12 AM »
David I. Armstrong McKay et al. Exceeding 1.5°C global warming could trigger multiple climate tipping points.  Science377,eabn7950(2022).DOI:10.1126/science.abn7950
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abn7950

     Mackay et al. 2022 define tipping points as
'critical thresholds beyond which a system re-organises, often abruptly and irreversibly, and are highly dangerous because they can be crossed so fast that humans and natural systems are unable to adapt.'  Loss of Summer Arctic sea ice does not meet that definition because it is expected to be reversible (if human behavior allowed it).
 
     "A subcase is abrupt loss of Barents Sea winter ice (BARI), which occurs at ~1.6°C in two CMIP5 models, is self-reinforced by an increased inflow of warm Atlantic waters, and has substantial impacts on atmospheric circulation, European climate, and potentially the AMOC.  We consider BARI a probable regional impact tipping element (medium confidence) with a threshold of 1.6°C (1.5 to 1.7°C) (low confidence), a timescale of ~25 years (low confidence), and regional warming (high confidence)."

     From the Supplement:  "We take qualitative change for BARI collapse to be <10% annual mean sea ice cover remaining."

     [Hmmm.  So they thought +1.6C was 25 years away.  I guess things are getting out of hand when a paper from 2022 already sounds dated.  Hansen et al. think that with accelerated warming we will reach +1.6C in about 10 years.  The baseline even without El Nino and other temporary effects is already at ca. +1.3C, though you hardly ever see that in print.  +1.1 or +1.2 get stated more frequently, but those values do not really reflect the current status.]

     "By contrast Arctic summer sea ice (ASSI)—despite declining rapidly since the 1970s and outpacing previous IPCC projections since the 1990s—is responding linearly to cumulative emissions.  This decline is amplified by the ice-albedo feedback and possibly feedbacks to cloud cover but damped by negative heat loss feedbacks.  CMIP6 models better capture historical ASSI decline and project that ice-free Septembers will occur occasionally above 1.5°C GMST, become common beyond 2°C, and remain permanent at ~3°C.  However, the linear modeled and observed responses suggest that ASSI is unlikely to feature a tipping point beyond which loss would self-perpetuate. Hence, we recategorize ASSI as a threshold-free feedback."

     Those temperature estimates refer to long-term averages (I think), not single-year values.  But in a bascially monotonic warming trend (albeit with temporary ENSO excursions up or down), once you reach a temperature it essentially becomes the new baseline.  Regardless, seeing 1.5C as the opening for loss of summer Arctic sea ice adds sobering weight to the fact that the global average surface temperature for 2023 is almost certainly going to exceed 1.5C above preindustrial (as per Berkeley Earth).  The El Nino bump does not fully kick in until 2024 (+ the small but real boost from nearing the solar cycle maximum) so an equal or higher global average temperature in 2024 seems likely.

     In the data Supplement, McKay et al. define the regional temperature impact from loss of Arctic summer sea ice as an extra ~0.25-0.5°C and the effect on global average temperature as an extra 0.19-0.3°C. 

     The small difference between the regional and global temperature impacts seems to imply a reduction in Arctic amplifciation as the Earth warms (i.e. less of a difference between Arctic and global average temperature, and a more equable climate.) 

     From Harvard University:  "Equable climates are periods of roughly equal temperatures throughout the world. A more detailed description focuses on the equator to pole temperature difference and the seasonality in the high-latitudes, or regions that are above 60°N or below 60°S." (Picture alligators and camels on Ellesemere Island.  It's happened before.) https://groups.seas.harvard.edu/climate/eli/research/equable/climate.html#:~:text=What%20Is%20An%20Equable%20Climate,or%20below%2060%C2%B0S.

     McKay et al. do define Arctic Winter sea ice an irreversible tipping point, but one that would only occur at a temperature threshold of ca. 6.3C above the preindustrial average (range 4.5 - 8.7C, high confidence from CMIP5 models).  So that is your climate change good news for the day: There will continue to be Arctic winter sea ice for the foreseeable future.  And if warming continues, long after human civilization would likely no longer be functioning in any currently recognizable form (for good or for bad) so there might not be many people around to see it if it did happen.  Back in 2010 the World Bank opined that global civilization would cease to operate at ca. +4C.

PS Would "When will the Arctic go ice-free in Summer?" be a better name for this thread?  The discussion is almost always about when will we first see a September BOE. 

1st attached graph is from: Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development.  The risks of crossing climate tipping points.  https://www.oecd.org/coronavirus/en/data-insights/the-risks-of-crossing-climate-tipping-points.  It is based on vales from McKay et al. 2022.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2023, 09:47:40 AM by Glen Koehler »
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kassy

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2724 on: December 03, 2023, 06:43:24 PM »
Thanks for BARI.

So they thought +1.6C was 25 years away.  I guess things are getting out of hand when a paper from 2022 already sounds dated.

Isn´t it just a scientific shorthand? Papers don´t go for one date but they show a range. Depending on the measure they use this could be fair. If you use a 15 year mean for climatology that means next 10 years trend will be informative. That way it is not hard to get to 2047 which is again consistent with the older Notz assessments where in was 2050.

Quote
PS Would "When will the Arctic go ice-free in Summer?" be a better name for this thread?  The discussion is almost always about when will we first see a September BOE.

Maybe to distinguish it from the current active poll but the issues themselves can not be separated. September is the end of season date so that is a convenient time to use for papers BUT what happens next in winter depends on the timing of when the last bits melt out or how long certain areas are open for mixing up heat from below.

Also it is highly likely that if year X hits the september threshold then year X+1 will probably hit that too.

Quote
In the data Supplement, McKay et al. define the regional temperature impact from loss of Arctic summer sea ice as an extra ~0.25-0.5°C and the effect on global average temperature as an extra 0.19-0.3°C.

So we will go from 1,6 to about 1,8 in a short time. That is a free bonus El Nino.
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Stephan

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2725 on: December 09, 2023, 06:41:19 PM »
It is time for the monthly update of my extrapolation when the extent [Ausdehnung], volume [Volumen], thickness [Dicke] and area [Fläche] will reach zero. The extrapolation occured linearly and by a logarithmic function; the latter one almost constantly resulting in earlier times (valid all year round for volume and thickness, not for extent and area in the winter months). The November value now includes 2023.

Position of November 2023 towards the long-term trend lines
Area, extent, thickness and volume are above the linear trend line.

Trend of the trends
The slopes of area, extent, volume and thickness have become - once again - flatter compared to last year (November 2022).
The "BOE numbers" increased by 10 years (area), increased by 6 years (extent), increased by 2 years (volume) and stayed more or less the same (thickness) compared to November 2022.

The order (earlier → later BOE) generally is volume < thickness < area < extent.

Please note that this is not a forecast but a trend!
See attached table.
y-AA = linear function value at t = 0. Stg = slope (negative values).

Click to enlarge it.
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Glen Koehler

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2726 on: January 04, 2024, 09:44:00 PM »
      From the latest update by James Hansen and friends:
https://mailchi.mp/caa/groundhog-day-another-gobsmackingly-bananas-month-whats-up?e=5ac94e8902
    "The recent spike of absorbed solar radiation to almost 3 W/m2 (Fig. 2) may be related in part to the fact that it occurred during the season when solar insolation was rising in the region of Southern Hemisphere sea ice when sea ice cover was at its lowest point in the period of satellite data. Large variability of clouds, unforced and forced, complicates interpretation of anomalies, but spatial variations may help untangle the situation."

     It occurs to me that changes in cloud cover caused by the Hunga Tonga injection of water vapor into the upper atmosphere combined with the "shocking" (Walt Meiers, NSIDC) decline in Antarctic sea ice cover in 2023 could be a big factor for why 2023 is breaking the previous annual average temperature record by a large margin.   That is as good an explanation as I've seen anywhere else.  Which begs the question of what will Antarctic sea ice area be in 2024?  Even Andrew Dressler, Zeke Hausfather, and Gavin Schmidt look back at 2023 and inconclusively conclude "WTF?"

     Hansen projects that more "gobsmackingly bananas" monthly anomalies are likely in the coming months, which is not surprising given the midwinter ENSO peak and its 3-4 month lag effect on temperature. 

     The 2023 annual average surface temperature is close to or above +1.5C (e.g. Japanese JRA-55 at +1.43C, likely 2023 average from Berkeley Earth to be > +1.5C) due to internal variability.  With or without continuation of the hard-to-explain internal variability of 2023 (i.e. solar radiation on low Antarctic sea ice area), 2024 is likely to be at or above +1.5C due to El Nino.  Going forward from 2025, the average anomaly over preindustrial (i.e. 1850-1900 average proxy) will progress from +1.5C due to the decadal rate of warming now exceeding 0.3C = an average of +0.03C per year.  Which results in sneaking up on the +1.7C threshold which seems to be the consensus for ASI September minimum to go below 1M km2 (e.g. State of the Cryosphere 2023 https://iccinet.org/statecryo23/, Notz and Stroeve 2018).
 
     I don't expect it to start this year because I suspect the "open water - winter refreeze" "Slow Transition" negative feedback still has a couple of years left in the tank.  But sooner than later, (2027?), after 12-15 years of post-2012 relative stability, the ASI September Area minimum could begin a multi-year slide down to <=1M km2 in ca. 2035.  If that progresses somewhat linearly, then the current 2012 record low Sept. Area Minimum could be breached around 2028-2029 (?).  And that mystical BOE we've been discussing would arrive in 2034 (which may only last about a week, generate some headlines, then the deniers will talk about the great recovery underway.)   

     Regardless of the specific dates, if this scenario is realistic then the recent stall in the decline trend of September ASI Area could resume its downward movement within the next few years, and provide a clear signal on how just much we have irritated Wally Broecker's angry beast.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2024, 06:49:30 PM by Glen Koehler »
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kassy

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2727 on: January 05, 2024, 04:50:00 PM »
I think it is realistic but in a schematic way which just means that results in a given year can vary. What will be the result of the next ´2012 type´ year whenever that may be.

Also in BOE year 1 it might be more then just a week but that depends on mobility, rate of open water over the season etc.
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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2728 on: January 05, 2024, 05:24:59 PM »
The Tonga eruption cloud cover may indeed account for much of the Antarctic sea ice decline.  The "open water - winter refreeze"  "Slow transition" negative feedback may have more than couple of years left.  Arctic sea ice fall growth shows a strong response to open water. 

binntho

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2729 on: January 06, 2024, 07:24:07 AM »
There are several explanations of the large heat spike in the second half of this year. One is the rapid reduction in sulphur emissions by the shipping industry since 2020 agreement to reduce sulphur content in maritime fuels. It is unclear how big this effect is (clouds being, as usual, the biggest source of uncertainty), but it is a long-time change.

Another anomaly last year was the near total absence of sand from Sahara blowing out over the Atlantic last summer. Interesting to see if this repeats or is a one-off.
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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2730 on: January 06, 2024, 09:01:33 AM »
There are several explanations of the large heat spike in the second half of this year. One is the rapid reduction in sulphur emissions by the shipping industry since 2020 agreement to reduce sulphur content in maritime fuels. It is unclear how big this effect is (clouds being, as usual, the biggest source of uncertainty), but it is a long-time change.

Another anomaly last year was the near total absence of sand from Sahara blowing out over the Atlantic last summer. Interesting to see if this repeats or is a one-off.

Another suspect is the loss of Antartctic sea ice and consequent albedo change. I find this explanation quite good.

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2731 on: January 06, 2024, 11:02:02 AM »
I agree (FWIW) that the albedo change will likely have had an effect.  Some numbers..
Surface area of the Earth: 510 million sq km.
Surface area of the Pacific Ocean: 162 million sq km.
For much of last year Antarctic ice extent was about 2 million sqm km less than 'normal'.
So the loss of ice cover exposed when the sun was shining on the Pacific (most of the ice loss was in the deep South Pacific, as I understand it) was about 1% more dark sea surface to the sun than usual.  (Ignoring angles of insolation etc).
Given the knife-edge of the energy balance calculation, 1% in the wrong direction at this delicate time could be 'unhelpful'.

binntho

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2732 on: January 08, 2024, 06:54:02 AM »
There are several explanations of the large heat spike in the second half of this year. One is the rapid reduction in sulphur emissions by the shipping industry since 2020 agreement to reduce sulphur content in maritime fuels. It is unclear how big this effect is (clouds being, as usual, the biggest source of uncertainty), but it is a long-time change.

Another anomaly last year was the near total absence of sand from Sahara blowing out over the Atlantic last summer. Interesting to see if this repeats or is a one-off.

Another suspect is the loss of Antartctic sea ice and consequent albedo change. I find this explanation quite good.

The point being that we are stacking up the good explanations, and as usual, we haven't got a clue. The significant increase in ASI extent just now is mocking all our attempts at understanding.

As with so many things, if you have many explanations, you have none.
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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2733 on: January 08, 2024, 07:40:10 AM »
I do not agree with you. There are many things in the world that are multicausal. It is absolutely possible that this year's temp jump is due to a confluence of factors, like El Nino, solar maximum, hunga tonga, Antarctic albedo change and a drop in aerosols.

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2734 on: January 08, 2024, 12:19:53 PM »
I do not agree with you. There are many things in the world that are multicausal. It is absolutely possible that this year's temp jump is due to a confluence of factors, like El Nino, solar maximum, hunga tonga, Antarctic albedo change and a drop in aerosols.

Of course you are right, and it is most likely a confluence of factors in a complex multicausal system. But why is this happening now? What are these factors? Why can't we even count them, let alone quantify their status and their contributions to what is happening?

Just like last summer's very unusual lack of wind-drive sand from the Sahara, leading to significantly more insolation along the Atlantic tropics. Why did that happen?

We are at best able to see the very big picture, and even there we are stumped. We know that the world is getting warmer, but we cannot explain the big jump in the second half of last year. We don't know what the actual warming due to current CO2 levels will be, and the uncertainty is huge.
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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2735 on: January 12, 2024, 09:08:42 PM »
It is time for the monthly update of my extrapolation when the extent [Ausdehnung], volume [Volumen], thickness [Dicke] and area [Fläche] will reach zero. The extrapolation occured linearly and by a logarithmic function; the latter one almost constantly resulting in earlier times (valid all year round for volume and thickness, not for extent and area in the winter months). The December value now includes 2023.

Position of December 2023 towards the long-term trend lines
Area, extent are above, thickness and volume are way above the linear trend line.

Trend of the trends
The slopes of area, extent, volume and thickness have become - once again - flatter compared to last year (December 2022).
The "BOE numbers" increased by 11 years (extent), increased by 7 years (area), increased by 3 years (thickness) and increased by 1 year (volume) compared to December 2022.

The order (earlier → later BOE) generally is volume < thickness < area < extent.

Please note that this is not a forecast but a trend!
See attached table.
y-AA = linear function value at t = 0. Stg = slope (negative values).

Click to enlarge it.
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Stephan

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2736 on: February 13, 2024, 08:39:14 PM »
It is time for the monthly update of my extrapolation when the extent [Ausdehnung], volume [Volumen], thickness [Dicke] and area [Fläche] will reach zero. The extrapolation occured linearly and by a logarithmic function; the latter one almost constantly resulting in earlier times (valid all year round for volume and thickness, not for extent and area in the winter months). The January value now includes 2024.

Position of January 2024 towards the long-term trend lines
Area, extent and volume are way above the linear trend line, thickness is slightly above it.

Trend of the trends
The slopes of area, extent and volume have become - once again - flatter compared to last year (January 2023). The thickness slope hasn't changed significantly.
The "BOE numbers" increased by 30 years (area), increased by 19 years (extent) and increased by 2 years (volume) compared to January 2023. The value for thickness didn't change.

The order (earlier → later BOE) generally is volume < thickness < area < extent.

Please note that this is not a forecast but a trend!
See attached table.
y-AA = linear function value at t = 0. Stg = slope (negative values).

Click to enlarge it.
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gerontocrat

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2737 on: March 05, 2024, 08:24:24 PM »
Yet another paper on "When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?"

It states that a BOE for one day will happen much earlier than for one month (somewhat obvious).
It also clearly distinguishes between Sea Ice Area (SIA) and Sea Ice Extent (SIE) - the first paper I have read that clearly does this.
It also makes a point that there is not a universally accepted definition of a BOE, nor of the particular product to be be used as the measure.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s43017-023-00515-9
Quote
Projections of an ice-free Arctic Ocean
Abstract
Observed Arctic sea ice losses are a sentinel of anthropogenic climate change. These reductions are projected to continue with ongoing warming, ultimately leading to an ice-free Arctic (sea ice area <1 million km2). In this Review, we synthesize understanding of the timing and regional variability of such an ice-free Arctic. In the September monthly mean, the earliest ice-free conditions (the first single occurrence of an ice-free Arctic) could occur in 2020–2030s under all emission trajectories and are likely to occur by 2050.

However, daily September ice-free conditions are expected approximately 4 years earlier on average, with the possibility of preceding monthly metrics by 10 years. Consistently ice-free September conditions (frequent occurrences of an ice-free Arctic) are anticipated by mid-century (by 2035–2067), with emission trajectories determining how often and for how long the Arctic could be ice free.

[b]Results
Contrasting definitions[/b]
The definition of an ‘ice-free Arctic’ has varied over time. Early on, it referred to the nearly complete disappearance of all sea ice, or zero SIE (refs. 9,60,67). However, as thick sea ice remains north of Greenland and the Canadian Arctic Archipelago more than a decade after the rest of the Arctic Ocean becomes ice free in September60,68, a SIE threshold of 1 million km2 became commonplace48.

This 1 million km2 threshold, however, can also introduce differences depending on the sea ice metrics it is applied to. For instance, an ice-free Arctic occurs earlier when the threshold is used with SIA rather than SIE (ref. 69) (Fig. 3a). Specifically, for the select CMIP6 models10, ice-free conditions occur 0–47 years earlier (mean, mode and standard deviation of 8, 3 and 10 years, respectively) when using SIA instead of SIE. Moreover, differences occur when SIA calculations use a minimum threshold of 15% sea ice concentration70,71, producing even earlier ice-free dates compared with using the standard SIA.

Another important issue to consider is when the Arctic sea ice community will consider that an ice-free Arctic has been reached. Deciding on these criteria ahead of reaching ice free conditions is prudent given the various definitions as well as observational uncertainty in satellite-derived sea ice products (Fig. 1d). As such, it is possible that the 1 million km2 ice-free threshold will be crossed in some SIA or SIE products under some definitions but not in others. Clarity on how this issue will be handled will facilitate communication around the occurrence of the first ice-free Arctic when it occurs.

Specifically, there is potential for ice-free conditions in May–January and August–October by 2100 under a high-emission and low-emission scenario, respectively. In all cases, sea ice losses begin in the European Arctic, proceed to the Pacific Arctic and end in the Central Arctic, if becoming ice free at all. Future research must assess the impact of model selection and recalibration on projections, and assess the drivers of internal variability that can cause early ice-free conditions.

« Last Edit: March 05, 2024, 08:29:33 PM by gerontocrat »
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Glen Koehler

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2738 on: March 12, 2024, 01:34:10 AM »
     Jahn et al. 2024 posted by Gero above is a very nice paper.  It is very readable and provides much-needed clarifications on the various definitions for BOE and ranges of estimates for driving factors and potential date ranges for ASI Area going below 1M km2. 
   
      As a backbench armchair amateur, I think the ASI research community is still underestimating the importance of qualitative condition of the ASI and what it means for the timing of BOE.  I am referring to the impact of ice thickness, salinity, and pack cohesion / mechanical strength / fracturing.  Also, the increasing impact of rain on snow/ice events and potential increase of atmospheric rivers and storm activity in the Arctic Ocean do not seem to get enough attention.  Lacking metrics other than some previous posts about accelerating melt as ice thickness gets below 0.8 M, all I have is hunches.
     
     It is interesting to see a similar view for different reasons from people who do know what they are talking about. 
https://scitechdaily.com/experts-warn-current-arctic-climate-modeling-too-conservative/

     "Two recent scientific studies involving researchers from the University of Gothenburg compared the results of the climate models with actual observations. They concluded that the warming of the Arctic Ocean will proceed at a much faster rate than projected by the climate models."

---------------------------------------------------------
Heuzé, C., H. Zanowski, S. Karam, and M. Muilwijk, 2023: The Deep Arctic Ocean and Fram Strait in CMIP6 Models. J. Climate, 36, 2551–2584, https://doi.org/10.1175/JCLI-D-22-0194.1.

     "Arctic sea ice loss has become a symbol of ongoing climate change, yet climate models still struggle to reproduce it accurately, let alone predict it. A reason for this is the increasingly clear role of the ocean, especially that of the “Atlantic layer,” on sea ice processes. "

     "Coupled climate models are routinely used for climate change projection and adaptation, but they are only as good as the data used to create them.  And in the deep Arctic, those data are scarce. We determine how biased 14 of the most recent models are regarding the deep Arctic Ocean and the Arctic’s only deep gateway, Fram Strait (between Greenland and Svalbard).  These models are very biased: too cold where they should be warm, too warm where they should be cold, not stratified enough, not in contact with the surface as they should, moving the wrong way around the Arctic, etc.  Some problems are induced by biases in regions outside of the Arctic and/or from the sea ice models."

     "In this study, we first quantified biases in the Atlantic Water in all deep basins of the Arctic.  In agreement with Khosravi et al. (2022), we find that its core is too cold by 0.48C on average,
too deep by 400 m, and in half of the models the Atlantic layer extends all the way to the seafloor, i.e., the properties do not evolve with depth as they do in the real ocean.  Besides, in most models the properties do not change from basin to basin.  We attribute these inaccurate properties and behavior to a lack of shelf overflows in most models found in ocean-only simulations (Ilicak et al. 2016), and inaccurate heat and volume fluxes through Fram Strait."

     "At Fram Strait, we found that all models underestimate the volume fluxes in and out of the Arctic, i.e., all models are biased slow"


The Appendix might be of interest to hard core ASIF Arctic Ocean watchers:  available on Zenodo (https://doi.org/10.5281/zenodo.4606856).
APPENDIX
A More Detailed Look at the Model Biases
This appendix presents
• the models’ native grid (Fig. A1);
• the pan-Arctic biases in each water mass in temperature (Fig. A2) and salinity (Fig. A3);
• the models’ polynya activity (Fig. A4);
• the absolute age of the water (Fig. A5);
• the models’ pan-Arctic velocity of the AW core (Fig. A6) and at 2000-m depth (Fig. A7);
and
• the salinity across Fram Strait (Fig. A8).
It also presents the area-weighted mean biases in all basins  (Tables A1–A3).
« Last Edit: March 12, 2024, 01:57:38 AM by Glen Koehler »
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binntho

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2739 on: March 12, 2024, 06:58:11 AM »
Thanks Glen, interesting. But I find nothing in the papers to substantiate the claim that "... warming of the Arctic will proceed at a much faster rate than projected by the climate models".

Specifically, the word "much" in "much faster" - and more generally, the papers are about rates of melting and not rates of warming?

So a  bit of journalistic liberty there. But the main conclusion still holds, which is that them models used to predict future ice loss are very much(!) in need of updating, and are quite likely to be underestimating future melt.
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kassy

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2740 on: March 12, 2024, 05:23:45 PM »
Quote
the papers are about rates of melting and not rates of warming?

Abstract
Arctic sea ice loss has become a symbol of ongoing climate change, yet climate models still struggle to reproduce it accurately, let alone predict it. A reason for this is the increasingly clear role of the ocean, especially that of the “Atlantic layer,” on sea ice processes. We here quantify biases in that Atlantic layer and the Arctic Ocean deeper layers in 14 representative models that participated in phase 6 of the Climate Model Intercomparison Project. Compared to observational climatologies and hydrographic profiles, the modeled Atlantic layer core is on average too cold by −0.4°C and too deep by 400 m in the Nansen Basin. The Atlantic layer is too thick, extending to the seafloor in some models. Deep and bottom waters are in contrast too warm by 1.1° and 1.2°C. Furthermore, the modeled properties hardly change throughout the Arctic. We attribute these biases to an inaccurate representation of shelf processes: only three models seem to produce dense water overflows, at too few locations, and these do not sink deep enough. No model compensates with open ocean deep convection. Therefore, the properties are set by the inaccurate volume fluxes through Fram Strait, biased low by up to 6 Sv (1 Sv ≡ 106 m3 s−1), but coupled to a too-warm Fram Strait, resulting in a somewhat accurate heat inflow. These fluxes are related to biases in the Nordic seas, themselves previously attributed to inaccurate sea ice extent and atmospheric modes of variability, thus highlighting the need for overall improvements in the different model components and their coupling.

Abstract
The Arctic Ocean is strongly stratified by salinity in the uppermost layers. This stratification is a key attribute of the region as it acts as an effective barrier for the vertical exchanges of Atlantic Water heat, nutrients, and CO2 between intermediate depths and the surface of the Eurasian and Amerasian basins (EB and AB, respectively). Observations show that from 1970 to 2017, the stratification in the AB has strengthened, whereas, in parts of the EB, the stratification has weakened. The strengthening in the AB is linked to freshening and deepening of the halocline. In the EB, the weakened stratification is associated with salinification and shoaling of the halocline (Atlantification). Simulations from a suite of CMIP6 models project that, under a strong greenhouse gas forcing scenario (ssp585), the overall surface freshening and warming continue in both basins, but there is a divergence in hydrographic trends in certain regions. Within the AB, there is agreement among the models that the upper layers will become more stratified. However, within the EB, models diverge regarding future stratification. This is due to different balances between trends at the surface and trends at depth, related to Fram Strait fluxes. The divergence affects projections of the future state of Arctic sea ice, as models with the strongest Atlantification project the strongest decline in sea ice volume in the EB. From these simulations, one could conclude that Atlantification will not spread eastward into the AB; however, models must be improved to simulate changes in a more intricately stratified EB correctly.

The abstracts from the two papers Glen linked. Not much rate of melting in there...

Anyway if there is more warming now then the models predict that means a faster rate of warming. Seeing where we are now much is also justified. The discrepancies are quite big.
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binntho

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2741 on: March 13, 2024, 07:29:42 AM »
Quote
the papers are about rates of melting and not rates of warming?
The abstracts from the two papers Glen linked. Not much rate of melting in there...

Anyway if there is more warming now then the models predict that means a faster rate of warming. Seeing where we are now much is also justified. The discrepancies are quite big.

Agree that there is not much about rate of melting in these abstracts, and nothing about rates of warming either.  did read these abstracts and quite a bit more, and somehow got the impression that rates of melting were mentioned.

Jumping to conclusions by inference is journalism, not science. The papers do not justify words such as "much" or "little", nor do they specifically claim that the models will continue to underestimate warming, even if they are biased as they are. One can relatively safely make the deduction that if the bias is removed, the models will more correctly predict future warming, but the papers make no basis for the claim by the journalist. It is a value judgement based in personal feelings.
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kassy

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2742 on: March 14, 2024, 06:31:02 PM »
But the important point is that they will make a very different prediction. It takes time to warm up the Arctic deep water core 0,5C or to move it several hundreds of meters. How much that factors into the ultimate end date is anybodys guess. If we were to run the models from the data they used to point out the model failures this would also change the water properties at other levels nearer to the surface.

Ultimately everything we say about science papers when describing them is a value judgement. That itself is not a contra argument. Since faster is clearly a thing the question is which science would you need to show ´much faster´?
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kiwichick16

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2743 on: March 15, 2024, 11:06:43 AM »
see post 351 by freegrass on freezing thread  ......no arm .....

kassy

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2744 on: March 16, 2024, 11:08:46 PM »
Of older sea ice in the Beaufort. Well that has been an ongoing process.

In the long run this increases the risk of earlier open water in the Central Arctic sea. Give it enough time (some months) to mix with deeper saltier water and you can have open water that lasts well into the freezing season.
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Stephan

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2745 on: March 18, 2024, 06:06:06 PM »
It is time for the monthly update of my extrapolation when the extent [Ausdehnung], volume [Volumen], thickness [Dicke] and area [Fläche] will reach zero. The extrapolation occured linearly and by a logarithmic function; the latter one almost constantly resulting in earlier times (valid all year round for volume and thickness, not for extent and area in the winter months). The February value now includes 2024.

Position of February 2024 towards the long-term trend lines
Extent is way above the linear trend line. Area and volume are above the linear trend line, thickness is slightly above it.

Trend of the trends
The slopes of area, extent and volume have become - once again - flatter compared to last year (February 2023). The thickness slope hasn't changed.
The "BOE numbers" increased by 22 years (area), increased by 13 years (extent) and increased by 3 years (volume) compared to February 2023. The value for thickness decreased by 5 years.

The order (earlier → later BOE) generally is volume < thickness < area < extent.

Please note that this is not a forecast but a trend!
See attached table.
y-AA = linear function value at t = 0. Stg = slope (negative values).

Click to enlarge it.
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jdallen

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2746 on: March 23, 2024, 08:08:55 PM »
   <snip
      As a backbench armchair amateur, I think the ASI research community is still underestimating the importance of qualitative condition of the ASI and what it means for the timing of BOE.  I am referring to the impact of ice thickness, salinity, and pack cohesion / mechanical strength / fracturing.  Also, the increasing impact of rain on snow/ice events and potential increase of atmospheric rivers and storm activity in the Arctic Ocean...
<snippage>
Very much concur.
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gerontocrat

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2747 on: March 23, 2024, 09:59:24 PM »
   <snip
      As a backbench armchair amateur, I think the ASI research community is still underestimating the importance of qualitative condition of the ASI and what it means for the timing of BOE.  I am referring to the impact of ice thickness, salinity, and pack cohesion / mechanical strength / fracturing.  Also, the increasing impact of rain on snow/ice events and potential increase of atmospheric rivers and storm activity in the Arctic Ocean...
<snippage>
Very much concur.
Perhaps one measure of pack cohesion / mechanical strength / fracturing is sea ice concentration. I spent some time today resurrecting my graphs thereof.

Of interest (to me) was comparing concentration in the High Arctic seas with that in the Peripheral seas. see graphs attached - I have used the same values in the y-axes to highlight the differences between the two.

The most obvious difference is the higher sea ice concentration in the High Arctic.

As time goes by concentration is substantially reducing in the High Arctic especially in the summer months, and concentration starts reducing earlier  in the year and increasing later.

The story is confused in the Peripheral seas.  In early summer and in late summer there is some reduction over time in concentration, but in high summer? - maybe by then most sea ice area and extent is reduced to sheltered areas with many obstinate small areas of thicker ice.

However, it is High Arctic where the BOE will happen, I wonder if there is a critical point when concentration is so low that "things fall apart, the centre cannot hold".
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gerontocrat

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2748 on: April 07, 2024, 03:56:51 PM »
Here is the view from NSIDC - https://nsidc.org/arcticseaicenews/

Basically a one-day BOE based on < 1 million km2 sea ice area could occur any year from now on, with the probability increasing year by year as greenhouse gas emissions continue to rise and by how much..

A BOE using sea ice extent is likely to happen up to 10 years after the sea ice area BOE.

Quote
Colleagues Alexandra Jahn and Jen Kay, from the University of Colorado Boulder, and Marika Holland from the National Center for Atmospheric Research recently synthesized our current understanding of the timing and regional variability of an ice-free Arctic. In reviewing the literature, they find that a variety of different definitions of “ice-free” conditions have been used in the past, with impacts on their projected timing. For example, ice-free conditions based on sea ice area occur usually 10 years prior to ice-free conditions based on sea ice extent.

Furthermore, they identify a need to clearly distinguish between projections of the first occurrence of ice-free conditions, based on the monthly average data, and consistently ice-free conditions, based on smoothed monthly averages, which occur about 10 years later than the first ice-free conditions.

Using sea ice area, the earliest ice-free conditions in the September monthly average are likely to occur by 2050, but could occur as early as the late 2020s and 2030s under all greenhouse gas emission trajectories. Ice-free conditions for at least a day in September are expected approximately four years earlier on average, with the possibility of preceding the monthly average metric by over 10 years. Consistently ice-free September conditions are anticipated by mid-century (2035 to 2067) under all emission trajectories.

However, future emission trajectories will determine how often and for how long the Arctic Ocean could be ice free in the future, with a possibility of ice-free conditions for nine months of the year by 2100 in some years under the high emission scenario.

Future research is needed on the impact of different model selection and refinement methods on sea ice projections, as well as on the impacts of different lengths of ice-free conditions on the climate system and the ecosystem.

Figure 5. These charts show different probabilities of ice-free conditions in a given year and month for selected climate models and emission scenarios. The earliest ice-free conditions can be inferred when any probability of ice-free conditions exists, whereas consistently ice-free conditions start to exist when the probability in a given year reaches the likely category. Probabilities are provided for different greenhouse gas emission scenarios with SSP5-8.5 representing the most aggressive emission scenario and SSP1-2.6 the most modest. There are large differences in how likely an ice-free Arctic is to occur in the months of a given year depending on the degree of emissions and climate warming.

Credit: Jahn et al. 2024
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
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Stephan

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Re: When will the Arctic Go Ice Free?
« Reply #2749 on: April 11, 2024, 09:29:44 PM »
It is time for the monthly update of my extrapolation when the extent [Ausdehnung], volume [Volumen], thickness [Dicke] and area [Fläche] will reach zero. The extrapolation occured linearly and by a logarithmic function; the latter one almost constantly resulting in earlier times (valid all year round for volume and thickness, not for extent and area in the winter months). The March value now includes 2024.

Position of March 2024 towards the long-term trend lines
Extent, area and volume are above the individual linear trend lines, thickness is slightly above it.
March 2024's area average is very close to the general average (1988-2024). Thickness is the second lowest in the satellite area.

Trend of the trends
The slopes of area, extent and volume have become - once again - flatter compared to last year (March 2023). The thickness slope hasn't changed.
The "BOE numbers" increased by 55 years (area), increased by 18 years (extent) and increased by 3 years (volume) compared to March 2023. The value for thickness decreased by 4 years.

The order (earlier → later BOE) generally is volume < thickness < area < extent.

Please note that this is not a forecast but a trend!
See attached table.
y-AA = linear function value at t = 0. Stg = slope (negative values).

Click to enlarge it.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2024, 09:44:50 PM by Stephan »
It is too late just to be concerned about Climate Change