Arctic Sea Ice : Forum

AGW in general => Science => Topic started by: prokaryotes on August 11, 2013, 07:41:25 AM

Title: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: prokaryotes on August 11, 2013, 07:41:25 AM
Good read.

http://climatestate.com/2013/08/11/climate-change-deniers-cant-spin-the-truth/ (http://climatestate.com/2013/08/11/climate-change-deniers-cant-spin-the-truth/)
Title: Re: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: FredFriendly on August 11, 2013, 03:45:59 PM
I do have a PHD and have had peer reviewed grants and papers and I fully agree with this view of the current chase for money that dominates the scientific endeavor:

http://www.bmartin.cc/pubs/92prom.html (http://www.bmartin.cc/pubs/92prom.html)

It is getting old, but the key tenets are still true.  Always make sure you study the real data, yourself, before you buy either side of a scientific argument.  It does not mean you can do the science, but the data should be consistent with other publications and literature.  Fortunately in climate science this is dead easy as governments of the world publish it daily, compiled here and elsewhere:

www.solen.info (http://www.solen.info)
www.climate4you.com (http://www.climate4you.org)
www.woodfortrees.org (http://www.woodfortrees.org)
Title: Re: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: ccgwebmaster on August 11, 2013, 04:54:50 PM
Fortunately in climate science this is dead easy as governments of the world publish it daily, compiled here and elsewhere

How do figure that? It's terribly difficult to obtain papers sometimes if you're not either rich or a member of an institution that has blanket access. I can't say raw data is easier to obtain than papers.

Plenty of people are happy not to read them anyway before buying into a given argument - as demonstrated by the arguments about methane clathrate recently.
Title: Re: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: blumenkraft on October 22, 2019, 04:26:46 PM
They can, and they do. Still.

ExxonMobil Is Still Bankrolling Climate Science Deniers

Link >> https://truthout.org/articles/exxonmobil-is-still-bankrolling-climate-science-deniers/
Title: Re: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: Klondike Kat on October 22, 2019, 04:41:38 PM
They can, and they do. Still.

ExxonMobil Is Still Bankrolling Climate Science Deniers

Link >> https://truthout.org/articles/exxonmobil-is-still-bankrolling-climate-science-deniers/

The U.S. chamber of commerce is considered a science denier?
Title: Re: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: blumenkraft on October 22, 2019, 05:15:45 PM
Enlighten me, Kat. What's their climate plan?
Title: Re: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: Klondike Kat on October 22, 2019, 07:12:42 PM
Enlighten me, Kat. What's their climate plan?

Don't know.  I do know that they released American Energy:  Cleaner, Stronger earlier this year, promoting technological development and innovation in energy for the 21st cetury.   
Title: Re: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: Tor Bejnar on October 22, 2019, 07:31:10 PM
Quote
The Chamber’s Position (https://www.uschamber.com/climate-change-position)

The climate is changing and humans are contributing to these changes. We believe that there is much common ground on which all sides of this discussion could come together to address climate change with policies that are practical, flexible, predictable, and durable. We believe in a policy approach that acknowledges the costs of action and inaction and the competitiveness of the U.S. economy.
...
Inaction is not an option.
...
[bold and font size in the original]


There is more at the link, of course.  I'll let others cypher how healthy or unhealthy their positions are.  They are blind to some things, of course, but they're not the Heartland Institute.
Title: Re: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: blumenkraft on October 22, 2019, 07:40:16 PM
Quote
The US Chamber of Commerce, which represents the interests of over 3 million companies and spent $104 million on lobbying in 2016, has been less than willing acknowledge the role that humans, and businesses, play in climate change.

When the Chamber’s representative was asked whether climate change was real and caused by humans in a 2014 Senate hearing, she dodged the question until finally saying that it was “an ongoing discussion.”

Following president Donald Trump’s executive actions that would gut the Obama administration’s policies to curb global warming, the chamber’s president, Thomas Donohue, said, “These executive actions are a welcome departure from the previous administration’s strategy of making energy more expensive through costly, job-killing regulations that choked our economy.”

Link >> https://qz.com/967035/the-climate-change-denying-us-chamber-of-commerce-is-losing-the-support-of-companies-like-hewlett-packard-hpe-and-starbucks-sbux-and-disney-dis-and-pepsi-pep-are-being-pressured-to-lea/
Title: Re: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: Tor Bejnar on October 22, 2019, 08:46:14 PM
Undoubtedly the U.S. Chamber of Commerce was slow to awareness:  just contrast that 2014 response to their current website  (https://www.uschamber.com/climate-change-position)(also linked earlier).

They write (https://www.uschamber.com/addressing-climate-change):
Quote
We stand with every American seeking a cleaner, stronger environment—for today and tomorrow.
 
Our climate is changing and humans are contributing to these changes. Inaction is simply not an option.

Combating climate change will require citizens, government, and business to work together. American businesses play a vital role in creating innovative solutions to protect our planet.

A challenge of this magnitude requires collaboration, not confrontation, to advance the best ideas and policies. Together, we can forge solutions that improve our environment and grow our economy—leaving the world better for generations to come.
I will quibble with their antagonism to confrontation and their faith in economic growth, but they are not the voice of a certain President of the United States (any more).
Title: Re: Climate Change Deniers can’t Spin the Truth!
Post by: gerontocrat on October 22, 2019, 10:03:26 PM
Undoubtedly the U.S. Chamber of Commerce was slow to awareness:  just contrast that 2014 response to their current website  (https://www.uschamber.com/climate-change-position)(also linked earlier).

They write (https://www.uschamber.com/addressing-climate-change):
Quote
We stand with every American seeking a cleaner, stronger environment—for today and tomorrow.
 
Our climate is changing and humans are contributing to these changes. Inaction is simply not an option.

Combating climate change will require citizens, government, and business to work together. American businesses play a vital role in creating innovative solutions to protect our planet.

A challenge of this magnitude requires collaboration, not confrontation, to advance the best ideas and policies. Together, we can forge solutions that improve our environment and grow our economy—leaving the world better for generations to come.
I will quibble with their antagonism to confrontation and their faith in economic growth, but they are not the voice of a certain President of the United States (any more).

Can we have our cake & eat it ?

"Together, we can forge solutions that improve our environment and grow our economy"