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Messages - nanning

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1
Thank you for that great post ShortBrutishNasty :) .

Re: extremely intelligent 16 year olds. To understand, don't think of them as children, not in the sense of not being developed. They may not have yet our detail of certain understanding of culture but their view of reality is sharper than extremely intelligent grown-ups. They are not yet blinded by what grown-ups call 'normal' without thinking about it. These young humans are used to thinking and learning. Most grown-ups are not. This is a completely new situation and the grown-ups seem stuck in their non-learning ways.

2
The rest / Re: Good music
« on: Today at 10:59:11 AM »
Osborne Brothers - Rocky Top (1967)


3
That would be a very good first test of finding out the melting properties of ice contaminated with microplastics.

How to get pure water?
How to contaminate pure water with a known amount and one specific type and size of microplastics?
How to get a homogenous distribution of microplastics in the ice?

I would advise to do the test not only with warming by insolation, but also with warming the tray or warming a layer of pure water underneath the ice.

4
Consequences / Re: Prepping for Collapse
« on: September 15, 2019, 05:40:19 PM »
- Why has there been no success in eliminating tax havens?
- Why is the Keeling curve accelerating since the 2015 Paris accord?
- Why are there still massive subsidies given to fossil fuel related corporations?
(I could make this list much longer)

Please think about what these questions tell us about our leadership?
(hint: There's no meaningful effort at all, just make-belief and BAU)

Is really nothing big going to change? (Apart from the elimination of ecosystems and all other lifeforms, and receiving increasingly catastrophic weather)
How long is this going to go on?
In this way you are assured of collapse, almost working towards it in the most effective way.

I'd say supporting the current systems is very very stupid in this regard.
Very stupid to acquiesce with this destructive insane system that is responsible, and work towards your own lifestyle's quick end.

Please stop your bad behaviour. Please don't give in to ease, perceived 'comfort' and temptation; it is not the 'good life' you are sold, it is a destructive and by MSM/advertising conditioned 'dream'.
Why have a career? Just have a good and full and, yes, more difficult life. You'll get richer!

5
The forum / Re: ASIF Statistics
« on: September 15, 2019, 06:52:34 AM »
From 2015 to may2019 I have lurked here. You can lurk without signing up.

6
Permafrost / Re: Arctic Methane Release
« on: September 15, 2019, 05:42:13 AM »
^^
From the article:
Quote
What can we learn from the bacteria?

"Although there is a lot of energy in methane, methane as a molecule is difficult to activate and break apart, says Professor Thamdrup.

"Finding out how microorganisms do the job is not only important for understanding the process. In the long term, it may also potentially be of biotechnological value. Maybe it can help us convert methane into other useful products."

Univ. of S.Denmark says "What can we learn from the bacteria?" -> products & exploitation.

This is from the natural sciences no less. Behaving like corporations subsidised by us.
There probably are exceptions but I see in biotech and microbiology absolutely NO RESPECT for other lifeforms and ecosystems.

   Other lifeform = potential product.  Nefarious.

7
Policy and solutions / Re: Carbon tax
« on: September 14, 2019, 06:36:13 AM »
For direct emissions: Since we should have decabonised >2 decades ago, I propose a meaningful carbon tax of EUR 5000/tonne (EUR 5/Kg). This also applies to personal travel by aeroplane, boat and bus. But not for public transport which is exempted.
Corporations are legal persons and to be treated as natural persons wrt carbon tax.

To ease the change, step it up in three years from EUR 500, EUR 1000 to EUR 5000. Right now, we should be shaking from being in a feverish hurry to change our ways if we take reality and eco/climate science seriously. "I want you to panic".

Half of the carbon tax revenue must be distributed to poor people in your rich country, so rich people will have a strong incentive to change their behaviour. The other half must be invested in electrification of all public transport and making it free for all. A beautiful effect will be the disappearance of the abomination of foodbanks. And oil-derived biocides.

For indirect emissions of products (food, clothes, packaging etc): make it mandatory to state the carbon footprint per unit of mass/volume on the packaging so consumers are aware of the real cost. After 2 years, impose the same carbon tax on the products. By this time the poor people should have enough money cover the increased costs of basic products such as food. Organic food (local) will be cheaper so that sector can grow and expand.


I haven't really thought it through for the many unintended/unforeseen consequences (too complex and not enough knowledge). Financial breakdown is not an unintended consequence. We need to stop these high energy, high carbon footprint lifestyles! We are already too late to prevent catastrophic climate change (>2C GMST).


edit: changed "a" to "the same" in 2nd to last pararaph.

8
Science / Re: Trump Administration Assaults on Science and the Environment
« on: September 13, 2019, 08:20:33 PM »
Thanks vox_mundi. This wall is abominable and obscene.
(I think you forgot to give the link to the article)

9
A reaction to the recent post by ALSR from 7PM.
https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,2205.msg228282.html#msg228282

Thanks ASLR (I'm not specifically addressing you in this post).

I agree with what ALSR wrote but disagree with the article.

We NEED to lose the capitalist system asap. Not change it. Fundamental changes are paramount. We NEED to lose the concept of rich people (=all non-poor people). They are the culprits. They have the power (direct or via consuming choices) but are so deeply addicted and insane that they fight any fundamental change. They just don't want to change their behaviour.

In order to heal, many times you have to go through a painful phase.

The longer you postpone healing, the more painful it will get. In this metaphore it will not get more painful for just the non-poor (ie the rich), but for all life on Earth, not just humans.
If you could take a photograph of this low morality and insanity of rich people, you would get a very black and dirty picture. Stinking.


Quote
That level of sacrifice is unacceptable to most.

What is unacceptable to XR, Greta and me, is losing the future for all life on Earth and the likely extinction of the human species.
That is the real sacrifice! THE DESTRUCTION OF THE FUTURE OF ALL LIFE ON EARTH. In order for rich people to keep their high energy life styles today.

This real sacrifice is a couple of hops further on the inference chain, so less intelligent people don't 'see' it.
Well, of course they see the poor people around the world suffering from the consequences of their high energy lifestyles, but those poor people are not Real people like Us. They're just numbers. So they're not important...
Try telling a poor African about your imaginary sacrifices.


edit: improved wording of 2nd to last sentence

10
Policy and solutions / Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« on: September 13, 2019, 07:51:04 AM »
<snip>
Katowice (December 2018) interview Part 1:
Katowice interview Part 2, together with Kevin Anderson:
"... and we don't want to be screwed." -- Greta

Thank you for these links Florifulgurator. They were interesting to watch :).

Strangely and beautifully, I recognise a lot of arguments and acting upon them by Greta.
My very strong 'feeling' of justice (morality) and personal responsibility has made me go all the way to ZERO DIRECT EMISSIONS and move away from the civilisation interpretation of 'good life'. Live like people lived in the old days. And started my research in urban hermitage to find the reasons for civilisation and human behaviour.

I would expect all people like Greta and like me, to follow our paths. This is in general not what I observe.
Then again, I consciously never became a grown-up. Perhaps that is the distinction?

11
The rest / Re: Good music
« on: September 12, 2019, 04:30:19 PM »
A real classic (I can strongly recommend the movie as well :) ):
Oh how things were better in those days. Tranquility and freedom. And humour. And really deep connections and trust.

Henry Mancini - Theme From 'The Pink Panther' (i) (1975)


12
The rest / Re: Good music
« on: September 10, 2019, 08:23:25 AM »
Eric Clapton - Let It Grow (1974)


13
The rest / Re: Is Man the "Unnatural Animal?"
« on: September 09, 2019, 06:43:23 PM »
Thanks Human Habitat Index, I really liked that. Especially the music :)

Thanks for sharing Aporia. I want to ask you if you maybe could clarify this evolution thing:
I did accept that as an individual I won't change our evolutionary path
<snip>

Considering "our evolutionary path", I have my eye on the indiginous people, humans, of the Amazone for example. What do you mean by evolutionary path?



edit: changed " I want to point out this discrepancy:" to "I want to ask you if you maybe could clarify this evolution thing:"

14
The forum / Re: GIF size, your Internet, and what is usable?
« on: September 09, 2019, 12:00:02 PM »
Great post blumenkraft. Thanks for the info and tips :)

15
Policy and solutions / Re: Extinction Rebellion
« on: September 09, 2019, 08:49:06 AM »
Having seen the whole video, i have my doubts about Rupert Read. He may be an industry/government pawn.
Of course I mean no offence to the heroic people of the XR group :)

16
Consequences / Re: Hurricane Season 2019
« on: September 09, 2019, 07:31:44 AM »
  Typhoon Lingling: Powerful typhoon passes over North Korea

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-49621405

  Quote:
"A powerful typhoon has passed over the Korean peninsula, leaving five people dead and 460 houses damaged or destroyed in North Korea, according to state media.

The storm flooded 460 sq km (178 sq miles) of farmland, the official KCNA news agency said, in a country already suffering food shortages.

Typhoon Lingling earlier killed three people in South Korea.

Flights were cancelled and tens of thousands of homes left without power."


Earlier this year, the UN warned that up to 10 million North Koreans were "in urgent need of food assistance".

17
Science / Re: Carbon Cycle
« on: September 07, 2019, 05:41:13 AM »
<snip>
Article in Nature Climate Change is under a paywall, maybe someone would have access?

Is this the one?
https://sci-hub.tw/https://doi.org/10.1038/s41558-019-0557-y

18
The rest / Re: Is Man the "Unnatural Animal?"
« on: September 05, 2019, 08:02:57 AM »

It's a cultural disgrace of our hubris thinking that we are different because we are better.

Or that we are better because we are different [partly kidding]
<snip>

"we are better": What does it mean?

19
The rest / Re: Is Man the "Unnatural Animal?"
« on: September 05, 2019, 07:13:56 AM »
Hi binntho, sorry for the delay.

First I think your ideas of morality are conflicting. From these two quotes:
Morality only exists as a human construct.
and
Quote
It simply means that much of what we would normally call moral behavior has biological underpinnings.


Quote
Concepts like "morality" and "code of conduct" imply that there is a choice between right and wrong or good and bad. But again, these are value judgments and as such they only belong to abstract thought and cannot be applied to other than us humans.
Exactly.
We have the 'luxury'(insanity) to not be constrained by living nature/ecosystem limits because we have technology.
An utopia is a high level organisation of humans (culture etc) you could call optimal because it respects all other life and ecosystems, optimal organisation is to abide by nature's constraints.
Because we have technology to dismiss the constraints, we have to restrain ourselves. That is high morality. It takes the whole life system into account, long term.
Behaviour that would fall under high morality in that regard can be called 'good' behaviour. And 'bad' means low morality behaviour and sliding to dystopia.
High morality takes effort and discipline but we have nurture and humans brains are neuroplastic, so this high morality can be engrained/programmed in the brains of the human group via nurture and culture.

When the fundamentals of the culture (civilisation) are in conflict with nature and high morality, it is impossible to ever get to a utopia, to an optimal human organisation. It means low morality is build-in. In the culture that programmes all young children.

A dystopia with advanced technology, which civilisation is, is always destructive and unsustainable. Without high morality there's nothing restraining humans. They even think they can techno-fix the destruction they have caused by further controlling living nature and further lowering morality. Supremacy -> insanity -> total destruction.

Quote
As a further clarification, I'd like to state that only individuals can have agency - groups cannot. So a species, or an ecosystem cannot have agency. It is therefore impossible to talk about moral species, or say that there can exist a code of conduct between species, since a species cannot have agency.
This code of conduct is not a choice as it is for us humans with advanced technology. We have choice because we are not constrained by living nature. Other species either live in the optimal zone or they perish. That is called natural selection and it means all life stays in optimal zones of behaviour. Living nature/ecosystems constraints and the natural selection system together perform the 'agency' you mean.

20
Consequences / Re: Wildfires
« on: September 03, 2019, 07:14:00 PM »
Another view from 'outside' on civilisation:

    We, the peoples of the Amazon, are full of fear. Soon you will be too
by Raoni Metuktire, tribe chief

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/sep/02/amazon-destruction-earth-brazilian-kayapo-people

Quotes:
What you are doing will change the whole world and will destroy our home – and it will destroy your home too.

And that common enemy is you, the non-indigenous peoples who have invaded our lands and are now burning even those small parts of the forests where we live that you have left for us.

When your money comes into our communities it often causes big problems, driving our people apart. And we can see that it does the same thing in your cities, where what you call rich people live isolated from everyone else, afraid that other people will come to take their piu caprim away from them. Meanwhile other people starve or live in misery because they don’t have enough money to get food for themselves and their children.

making sure that everyone else has enough to eat before they feed themselves, which is our way, the way of the Kayapó, the way of indigenous people.

You have to change the way you live because you are lost, you have lost your way. Where you are going is only the way of destruction and of death.


21
Consequences / Re: Hurricane Season 2019
« on: September 03, 2019, 06:47:28 PM »
<snip>
https://twitter.com/Alex_Verbeek/status/1168863576406331393/photo/1

Most of the Island is submerged :o. Where have all the people gone? Is there any contact?

22
Arctic sea ice / Re: Basic questions about melting physics
« on: September 01, 2019, 04:08:48 AM »
<snip>
Nobody else cares if somebody insults you.

Good post imo Glen but I disagree with this last bit because I do care.
If somebody uses nasty language, impolite insults, name calling etc. they don't get a like from me, even if I think the rest of the post is really good.
I don't think it has any influence but it is my way. In some cases I'll post a question about it.

OK back to topic, sorry.

23
Policy and solutions / Re: Green Capitalism: The God That Failed
« on: August 31, 2019, 07:40:42 AM »
   Shop less, live more – save the planet. It doesn’t sound that bad to me

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/aug/31/shop-less-green-future-sustainable-environment-retail
by Gaby Hinsliff

Some quotes with bolding by me:

Now the sheer scale of choice feels exhausting, while the business of piling up stuff at home for the sake of it – yet another cushion, dress or lipstick – increasingly borders on the obscene.

getting to zero emissions means not just consuming differently – switching to sustainable cotton T-shirts, say – but consuming far less

Too much advice about going green involves pushing slightly less toxic alternatives to things we don’t particularly need, to distract us from thinking about whether they were necessary in the first place.

In the end, a life is made up of the things we have done, not the things we have bought.

24
Sorry that this comment is off-topic.

From Microsoft: "an AI better than humans at everything"

Hahaha.
Better at 'eating' dwindling resources I'm sure!
On a serious note:
For a start, I don't think they will outdo humans in low morality. How to build a twisted screwed-up mind into AI? You need some special programming. Is it even possible to program individualism and egoism in a social artificial entity? Those things don't go together. And an AI that's not social will be stupid and ineffective. Working together = optimal, I think that is clear.

We don't even understand 'intelligence' and can't define it in real world terms, with calibration in reality. So what do these people think they're doing? Playing with aquaduct designs while Rome burns.
Now Microsoft please get real. ::)

25
Policy and solutions / Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« on: August 30, 2019, 06:04:13 PM »
Thanks blumenkraft.
Children are born as real humans everywhere because they are still without cultural programming.

This is from my expertise and on topic because it's about youth:
Youth should stop forcing themselves to join grown-up culture, because it's these days a very destructive hierarchical accumulation fantasy culture with low morality. I am not a grown-up in the sense that I consciously don't join that bad and simple way of living your life. You don't need to join.

The grown-ups killed and are still further killing your future.
They (grown-up consumerists) are trying every which way to dodge any guilt, to find other interpretations of the situation, follow ELSD news, finding other people to point to.
Just to not have to change themselves and to not have to face the danger of losing their addiction to the hierarchical accumulation culture; losing all their precious 'stuff' and their fantasy 'status'. They are afraid the modern 'dream' of progression will end because they don't see any alternative and are deeply addicted.

But the 'dream' of progression, is, of course, not real. Look at the real consequences.

ELSD=Erring on the Least Side of Drama.

26
Arctic sea ice / Re: "Stupid" Questions :o
« on: August 30, 2019, 05:12:13 PM »
I just finished The Weather Machine by Andrew Blum.  In the opinion of the well-regarded author, the models, and in particular the Euro, have improved markedly over the years, and continue to improve.  With ever better collection of existing conditions and increasing computational power, he expects improvements to continue.

“[A] vivid account of the history and evolution of the modern daily forecast . . . [Blum] is a sharp analyst and engaging guide, adept at translating difficult concepts in meteorology and computer science for the uninitiated.” (The Economist)

Thanks for that info dnem :).

From me:
The observation of: The models not really grasping the acceleration of changing climate; surprises and effects happening a lot earlier than expected, make me think that most professional people have lost sight/understanding of reality. Models are important tools for information about what's happening.

But, don't 'we' know enough already? 'We''re not acting! That's far more important.

P.S. 'we'='We'=consumerists

27
The rest / Re: Good music
« on: August 29, 2019, 06:12:03 AM »
blumenkraft,
I love it! Delightfully absurd.  ;D ;D
Where can I buy this wonderful 'Holtz'?

(sorry sedziobs to unintentionally 'drown' your posts :P)

The Muppets - Mahna Mahna (1977)




28
The rest / Re: Good music
« on: August 28, 2019, 06:51:32 PM »
That Todd Terje song is really to my liking! Thanks bro. Bet won :)

@Gerontocrat, Thanks. I suspected such. Perhaps it has a special meaning? I don't think all potatoes are ugly sir!
@binntho, I've just read your post. Thanks for the inside info!
--

I have good memories from this song playing at evenings at home with friends (fellow physics students). Very nice period for me:

Laserkraft 3D - Nein mann (de) (2010)


29
The rest / Re: Are you hoping for a global civilisational collapse?
« on: August 28, 2019, 09:12:08 AM »
Sorry binntho, I disagree with your whole list 1)-4).

I strongly disagree with your 3).
Morality is general, but all other life has to live within living nature's contraints because they have to. This gives by definition a high morality. Good.
https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,2688.msg200350.html#msg200350
My research moved on a little. I can define good and bad from my definition of morality.

Civilisation (humans in a social hierarchy conquering and expanding with technology) is bad.
Value is a human fantasy concept. Morality is real.

30
The rest / Re: Systemic Isolation
« on: August 27, 2019, 07:27:02 AM »
Here you go  8)

31
The rest / Re: Good music
« on: August 27, 2019, 06:26:10 AM »
@bligh8, what a great video. Haven't seen that video one before. The song of course is a classic and one of my favourite Marvin Gaye songs :).

@blumenkraft,
Pharell Williams! ;D Happy happy happy. Recent but a classic already I think. A good example that good global popular music can still be made.
Enjoyed watching the clip again. I can do many of the moves in that clip. Healthy joyful liberating moves ;).
Dancing, I love it. People should dance a lot more. You can do it at home :). Oh, and laughing out loud too. Releasing the tensions. I withstand the temptation to post "Patti Labelle - Release" now.
This problem I have a lot of times, I think of too many nice or special songs to post and then have to choose aaarrrggh ;)

Tony Joe White - Rainy Night In Georgia (1981)


32
The rest / Re: Good music
« on: August 26, 2019, 07:25:36 PM »
Thanks :)

Do you like this?

Matt Bianco - Whose Side Are You On (1985)


33
Science / Re: A list of missing feedbacks
« on: August 26, 2019, 06:57:35 AM »
Quote
The optimal ambient operating temperature for a human body in a low activity state is about 20C-24C. Hotter than that, the body has to redirect resources to cool the body, impairing higher cognitive functions.

I'm thinking about our African origins and don't understand the above stated optimal temperature range.

34
The rest / Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« on: August 25, 2019, 07:44:17 AM »
Words have meaning ;)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philanthropy
Quote
philanthropy attempts to address the root cause of the problem

So that means a philantrophist is someone against capitalism, against colonialism, against neo-liberalism and against the poor/rich, the man/woman and the white/brown/red/green/blue/yellow skincolour divides.

Those are the root causes of the problems of and from civilisation. Of course you may disagree. It is not important anymore. And off-topic.

(I went further back to before civilisation to the real roots of the problems in the "Is man the unnatural animal?" thread.
To add: I'm certain now that the root cause of living nature's problem of having humans was our ability to create fire.)


edit: added blue colour to not upset the Smurfs

35
Policy and solutions / Re: Extinction Rebellion
« on: August 22, 2019, 08:40:45 AM »
First Dog On The Moon on Civil Disobedience


36
Consequences / Re: Effects of Climate Change on the biosphere
« on: August 19, 2019, 06:44:33 AM »
<snip>
Well, at least the extinction might result in less tropical foods being flown to northern cities.

Sorry to shoehorn this here to focus attention on personal carbon footprint and awareness of where your food comes from.

Stop those planes flying!  8)

By not buying anything from far away, preferably nothing from outside my country, the Netherlands, these planes don't have to transport my food all the way across the world.
I have not eaten a banana in years and I love eating them. They were my favourite fruit. You really get used to it and will adapt.
Same with apples and pears in june. Don't buy them if you're living in the NH.

@kassy
Thanks for mentioning your Sri Lanka experiences.
I guess what the article in SteveMDFP's post means is those varieties are not yet eligible for monoculture because they probably die when showered with the current biocides.
What do you think the reason is?

37
Consequences / Re: The Holocene Extinction
« on: August 18, 2019, 07:22:59 AM »
" the little critters seem to have vanished."

This is my observation as well, together with a general observation of disappearing microorganisms. Extremely worrisome. Stuff doesn't seem to rot like it did. Doesn't get 'cleaned up'.

How many of those critters did surreptitiously go extinct?

Crows are having a difficult time in the rural place where I live now (northern Netherlands, Fryslân). In the big city they were/are numerous and I noticed they behave a bit different there. Will those crows be able to adapt once human activity stops in the cities?

As a child I spend many days outside in the fields with my polsstok, leaping over the ditches around the fields and loved the songs and calls of birds, frogs and life in the ditches, the smells, the buzzing of insects, the beautiful well-formed clouds, the quiet of low windvelocity, no ICE noise, flowers in the fields, airplane-free skies. There were also many features in the landscape that have gone. Little ponds and islands and trees. Lot's of small pieces of uncultivated 'wild' land.
40 years later, those fields are now forbidden to enter and many (most) are monoculture ryegrass. All have been sprayed with toxins year-in year-out. All the ditches are routinely dug out and all life and habitat removed, the whole biotope gone! (many flying insects have their larval stage in water) Everywhere! Because most ditches and waterways are connected, the toxins run-off from the fields get everywhere. I can only speculate about what happened to the life in the poisoned soils.

For children today it is Impossible to experience the wondrous healthy outside childhood I've had. They'll think this is normal.
The cattle are inside under fluorescent lamplight, on concrete slabs between thick metal bars, non-grazing. They'll think this is normal.

38
Policy and solutions / Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« on: August 16, 2019, 07:35:21 PM »
I think Greta is a great leader. A beautiful human. I wish her a safe and unbothered crossing.

39
Arctic sea ice / Re: Sea Ice Melting Affected by Microplastics?
« on: August 15, 2019, 04:53:12 AM »
A bit off-topic but I like to make the connection between microplastic pollution and people driving their cars around. Your car has more emissions than the nasty toxic gasses and greenhouse gasses.

from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microplastics#Car_and_truck_tires

Quote:
Car and truck tires

Wear and tear from tires significantly contributes to the flow of (micro-)plastics into the environment. Estimates of emissions of microplastics to the environment in Denmark are between 5,500 and 14,000 tonnes (6,100 and 15,400 tons) per year. Secondary microplastics (e.g. from car and truck tires or footwear) are more important than primary microplastics by two orders of magnitude. The formation of microplastics from the degradation of larger plastics in the environment is not accounted for in the study.[29]

The estimated per capita emission ranges from 0.23 to 4.7 kg/year, with a global average of 0.81 kg/year. The emissions from car tires (100%) are substantially higher than those of other sources of microplastics, e.g., airplane tires (2%), artificial turf (12–50%), brake wear (8%), and road markings (5%). Emissions and pathways depend on local factors like road type or sewage systems. The relative contribution of tire wear and tear to the total global amount of plastics ending up in our oceans is estimated to be 5–10%. In air, 3–7% of the particulate matter (PM2.5) is estimated to consist of tire wear and tear, indicating that it may contribute to the global health burden of air pollution which has been projected by the World Health Organization (WHO) at 3 million deaths in 2012. The wear and tear also enter our food chain, but further research is needed to assess human health risks.[30]

40
The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: August 14, 2019, 12:06:44 PM »
Rich, I don't think it is about "a position of 'power'". That interpretation and why you feel the need to "treat him / her in the manner they've treated me" are wrong. This is a sure recipe for battles and fighting. Some people are over-sensitive, have low self-esteem and are bellicose.
This is what we on this forum must try to change.
To all culprits: Try to be a better human, to have emotional control (be rational and reasonable) and think about respecting the other and not using language that may infuriate others or use personal attacks/denigration.
If there is a smothering potential fire, don't add oil to the fire!
Practice empathy, open welcoming communication and respect, awareness of different interpretations, self-reflection and the will to improve. Be kind and nice.
Theses idea about 'power', 'status', fighting and battles are damaging to yourself and others.

If b.c. thinks you are a troll, ... wait for it ....  LET HIM BE, WHAT DO YOU CARE. you can ask for arguments, preferably via PM, but if there's no agreement, leave it that.

This is not all meant just for you Rich. More of a general, well-meant explanation of how I see it.

41
Consequences / Re: Places becoming less livable
« on: August 13, 2019, 05:59:44 PM »
Archimid, I wish for you that this year will be a miss. i.e. Not a hit by another one. Another year will make the island better prepared I think.
I followed your experiences in 2017 as a lurker. Very informative and sympathy inducing :).

42
The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: August 13, 2019, 08:15:22 AM »
My interpretation:
Sterks shouldn't have posted his personal fight with Neven here for all to see. I think that's disrespectful and unconsidering (We know Neven is in a difficult and stressful period because of family reasons).
Yes, Sterks had good contributions so that's too bad.
Warning: stay away from political discussions!  ;D ::)

43
Thank you for the updates ASLR.

Keeling curve, Paleo, ECS 5.3, add some of the many positive feedbacks and perhaps a hyperthermal is on the horizon. All ice will be gone.
Peter Wadhams was likely right: Farewell to ice. (He didn't write 'arctic sea-ice' but 'ice')

44
Consequences / Re: Forests: An Endangered Resource
« on: August 11, 2019, 07:15:32 AM »

Is this a "NO"?
<snip>
I'm sorry, great ideas but yes.

I have another idea:

You could paint pellets, bullets and bombs green and start a green war. Terry's certified green pellets. "Shoot, kill and save the planet".
Wars make a lot of money I've heard.
Throw in some gimmicks for PR/marketing. A flamethrower with green flames? Radiumbombs?
There's more money to be made.

You'll get a statue I'm sure.

Best of luck with your endeavours Terry and sorry you have to go it alone. I'm very bad at lying :P

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Killian, it is not OK because he is doing it too. I think you know that is not an excuse. Be above it.

Covert agression.
Quote
You both have a weird sense of what is aggressive and rude
I'm not going to engage further, sorry to have disturbed the discussion, but these phrases are abrasive and covert agressive in my view:
"First, cherry picking is the domain of the intellectually dishonest"
"This should be obvious."
"Your problem is, rather than be curious, research, investigate,"
"If you are claiming any skill whatsoever in math, analysis, ASI, "
"you should seriously consider not spending any further time on the issue of ASI"

47
Consequences / Re: Prepping for Collapse
« on: August 08, 2019, 08:40:49 AM »
Thank you Human Habitat Index!
Alone but not lonely :). Here is an imaginary warm hug from me.


My 'preparation' for collapse story.

There was only one right thing I could do when learning about AGW and mass extinction and that is:

1. STOP PARTICIPATING.

During my hermitic research to find the foundations, the causes, I came to understand the madness of civilisation (see my posts in the "Is man the unnatural animal?"-thread).

2. MOVE OUT OF THE CULTURE OF CIVILISATION AS FAR AS POSSIBLE.

So I
 - Don't participate in the destruction, which means no affluence or ownership, be poor, don't take more than you need,  low CO2 etc.
 - Don't participate in the culture of low morality. I've raised my morality such as don't lie, show respect and be kind to everyone, don't call names or curse, other life is as imporant as my own, no group behaviour, no temptations etc. I think I've understood/defined general morality. Why it matters and what it means (see posts in mentioned thread).

By choosing to be affluence-poor and reach for high morality I paved the way for me to be sane, happy and complete.
My 4 years in hermitage have been an enormous personal transformation and eyeopener. My 'view' has changed almost completely.
I'd like to think I have become a very rich human.

----------------------
As a side note:
Interesting from wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lie#Consequences:
Quote
When a lie is discovered, the state of mind and behavior of the liar is no longer predictable.

Hannah Arendt spoke about extraordinary cases in which an entire society is being lied to consistently. She said that the consequences of such lying are "not that you believe the lies, but rather that nobody believes anything any longer.

48
Consequences / Re: Prepping for Collapse
« on: August 08, 2019, 05:04:57 AM »
SH, I understand your view as one from inside civilisation. A correct one in that context I think.
Bruce, thank you for the different and, I think, more realistic and emphatic view.

My main concern is with how much remaining biodiversity there will be after civilisation has collapsed. How much beautiful rich complex life will survive the anthropogene. In my view, mass extinction and los of ecosystems is the main catastrophy. Most people are extreme human-centric (egocentric) I think.

I recon that the earlier civilisation collapses, the more life will remain to start a new episode without human technology; when rebuild of new biodiversity has still a good chance (ie not having to wait for millions of years).

Every extra year is another year of accelerated destruction. I think we agree on that.

Nobody's steering our 'Titanic' and all life on Earth are caught up in human's metaphorical Titanic. I wish, and expect, this Titanic to go crashing down under the waves soon. I have my eye on all other life on Earth. Not just humans and especially not civilisation which is responsible for so much suffering and destruction.
I have understood the unnatural (against nature) foundations of civilisation and understand there will never be a non-destruction future, ever, with these unnatural foundations.
It is so crazy that people don't want to think or even hear about these foundations. I've got used to getting bashed. Also from friends and family. I am alone alas. It is what it is.

I think only Earth's nature constraints will stop this. Technology (magic) cannot save us. No free lunch. Affluence is unsustainable, even for just the minority of richer people. It's also the blind and evil externalisation of 'costs'. Keep the dream alive for the richer minority (= nightmare for the majority, including all other life!).
You cannot cure the insanity of the system, the culture. It's a stampede.

I feel that I haven't been able to find the precise wording to express my ideas about this. Sorry if I have failed to be clear.

49
The rest / Re: Good music
« on: August 05, 2019, 08:16:25 PM »
The Temptations - Papa Was A Rolling Stone (1972)

50
<snip>
Increasingly after my speaking events, I catch myself unexpectedly weeping in my hotel room or on flights home. Every now and then, the reality of what the science is saying manages to thaw the emotionally frozen part of myself I need to maintain to do my job.

Although the very foundation of human civilisation is at stake, the world is on track to seriously overshoot our UN targets. Worse still, global carbon emissions are still rising. In response, scientists are prioritising research on how the planet has responded during other warm periods in the Earth’s history."
I think this piece is important. Thanks ASLR.

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