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Messages - NevB

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1
Greenland and Arctic Circle / Re: The Nares Strait thread
« on: July 01, 2020, 03:46:30 PM »
June 29 and June 30 from Worldview

Spectacular change for just one day.

3
Not sure where this fits but it definitely belongs somewhere on the ASIF

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/06/underlying-conditions/610261/

Quote
We Are Living in a Failed State
The coronavirus didn’t break America. It revealed what was already broken.

Quote
The crisis demanded a response that was swift, rational, and collective. The United States reacted instead like Pakistan or Belarus

4
Consequences / Re: COVID-19
« on: April 04, 2020, 03:02:38 PM »
Those following the BCG debate may be interested in this Australian Trial:

https://www.sciencealert.com/australia-is-trialling-a-tb-vaccine-for-coronavirus-and-health-workers-get-it-first

"Australia's Trialing a TB Vaccine Against COVID-19, And Health Workers Get It First

Australian researchers are fast-tracking large-scale human testing to see if a vaccine used for decades to prevent tuberculosis can protect health workers from COVID-19, they announced Friday."

5
Consequences / Re: Global recession
« on: March 23, 2020, 11:54:45 AM »
Can I please be given a rigorous definition of “depression” as opposed to “recession”?

Recession is when many people loose their jobs, depression is when I loose my job.

Edit Not rigorous but it was what my economics teacher would say many many years ago.

6
Consequences / Re: Global recession
« on: March 16, 2020, 01:07:52 PM »
Found a better one and changed the image, Bluice.

Looks like this is unprecedented.

Do you have a source?
 
I would like to share this with a friend and it would be better if it was sourced.

7
Consequences / Re: COVID-19
« on: March 15, 2020, 10:27:22 AM »
Our government has released a very helpful video



Warning don't watch this if you don't like bad language.

8
Policy and solutions / Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« on: February 24, 2020, 05:23:16 AM »
Malena Ernman on daughter Greta Thunberg: ‘She was slowly disappearing into some kind of darkness’

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/feb/23/great-thunberg-malena-ernman-our-house-is-on-fire-memoir-extract
  by Malena Ernman

That's a most extraordinary story, well worth the time to read.

9
The forum / Re: Suggestions
« on: February 21, 2020, 01:42:57 PM »
Neven Whatever you did to remove the corona virus thread from the recent posts was a good idea.

This is a good, informative and useful thread but I agree shouldn't be a highlight of the forum.
Your exceptional judgement in these areas is what makes this place so successful.

I just thought some positive feedback would be helpful.

10
Consequences / Re: Chinese coronavirus
« on: February 21, 2020, 01:03:42 PM »

This is precisely the problem. We do not know what we do not know.

Sam

Thanks Sam Your reasoning and logic on this topic sounds like it comes from a long forgotten era

11
Consequences / Re: Wildfires
« on: January 02, 2020, 02:10:26 PM »
Anything is possible in the next two days

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2020/jan/02/australia-bushfires-tens-of-thousands-stranded-while-attempting-to-flee

<Edit> Tens of </Edit>Thousands are trying to leave and the situation is chaotic, power and phones are down. Fuel is hard to get and the petrol stations can't take EFTPOS. The disorganisation is looking dangerous.

Quote
We have no capacity to contain these fires … the fires are going to do what they are going to do, and people have to get out of that area,” NSW Rural Fire Service deputy commissioner Rob Rogers said.

This isn't really a surprise but still shocking seeing it happen.

<Edit>More details here:
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2020/jan/02/australia-bushfires-tens-of-thousands-stranded-while-attempting-to-flee</Edit>


12
Consequences / Re: Wildfires
« on: December 12, 2019, 03:23:22 AM »
Our Prime Minister is still running with the words, " Thoughts and prayers...." and "dont mention climate change"

In the mean time.......

https://7news.com.au/news/bushfires/sydney-told-to-brace-for-huge-fire-losses-c-599520

My family live in surbuban Wollongong an hour south of Sydney.
Everything is bone dry, drier than any time in living memory. Though in a residential area they have made plans to evacuate if any fire comes down the mountain range as it's plainly obvious that on a hot windy day stopping it just won't be possible.

My brother in law and nephew work in a coal mine, yesterday production was stopped because the volume of smoke being sucked into the mine was causing the fire systems to trip and continuing without them was unsafe. Visibility at times has been as low as a few hundred metres it looks apocalyptic.
This years camping trip has been relocated because of the fires. The lawns that are always green are brown and dying along with my mother's garden. All this and they either refuse to believe or just don't want to know about climate change. I used to think something like this would wake people up but no sign at all so far. Perhaps after this summer when the drought, fires and smoke are so visible but from their response so far I doubt it.

PS The're now planning next year's O/S holidays.

Dog help us all.

13
Consequences / Re: Drought 2019
« on: September 15, 2019, 03:08:06 PM »
Australia

‘Critical’: parts of regional NSW set to run out of water by November
Quote
WaterNSW warns without significant rain, Macquarie River will run dry, wiping out supply to Dubbo, Cobar, Nyngan and Narromine

Parts of regional New South Wales could run out of water as early as November with data showing the worst-case scenario for the state if there’s no rain or government intervention.

........

I don't know what government intervention is planed as both the governments at both state and federal are in denial, trucking vast quantities of water is probably the only option. For some background Dubbo is the largest town with around 40k population.

Forecasts aren't showing any signs of significant rain which will make this summer challenging.
The next strong El-Nino, which brings hotter and drier conditions, could well depopulate these towns as they primarily exist to support farming which will collapse if the drought continues into an El-Nino season.

We live in interesting times.




14
Consequences / Re: Weird Weather and anecdotal stories about climate change
« on: September 14, 2019, 02:17:27 PM »
After deleting my snide comments about my fellow Australians here's the story:

Max temps to be 4–10 °C above September average over most fire affected areas this weekend.
No significant rain is expected for the next seven days.
A southeasterly wind change over the Qld southeast coast district will bring increased fire danger today.

https://twitter.com/BOM_au/status/1172376415020314630

15
Policy and solutions / Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« on: September 13, 2019, 11:56:44 AM »
Just a great photo



Looks like the "Lady" that studied and lived with the Gorillas in the mist ;)

I think her name was Jane Goodall but I may err.


You are correct, that is Jane Goodall, she is also an absolutely wonderful person.

16
Policy and solutions / Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« on: September 12, 2019, 05:18:03 PM »
I agree.  Great photo from Davos global-elite-fest last January.

Here's another.  Off-the-charts cringe.  She knows.

Thank you for posting what happens to Greta in the US. The media here don't say much about Greta in the USA.

Who ist that lady next to Greta?


Congrats you will be the first person ever on my ignore list since sometime around 2007.

i think you have nothing to offer here other than promoting the hate that divides us.

That by the way is a compliment to Neven who's super power has made this place the most trusted of all.

17
Policy and solutions / Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« on: September 12, 2019, 05:02:44 PM »
Who ist that lady next to Greta?

Thank you for posting what happens to Greta in the US. The media here don't say much about Greta in the USA.

That's Jane Goodall, google everything you can find about her, adding her to your life can only make you much more optimistic about humanity.

18
Policy and solutions / Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« on: September 12, 2019, 02:14:01 PM »
Just a great photo


19
Consequences / Re: Prepping for Collapse
« on: September 10, 2019, 03:50:24 PM »
votes for children concentration camp emergency funding after a tea-session with Nancy Pelosi sharing her investment portfolio tips about the companies that profit of it.

I don't think these sort of comments ......
Sometimes I get lost in trying to imagine the real world behind those political words. There's no reason to expect news will cover the majority of the horrific side of the establishment so I feel like I try to make sense in the best way I can. Don't get me started on Betsy deVos.

They cannot vote for such funding under the motto of providing better care. The taxpayer pays over $700 per night per child. https://www.gq.com/story/trump-detention-camps-cost
Trump hotels don't even charge that much.
Nancy does hold a lot investments. In companies linked to these firms, and that's what we know. https://gizmodo.com/turns-out-all-kinds-of-tech-companies-are-working-with-1827006046
A little far fetched maybe but in the end is all about creating demand for the companies you can pick.

AOC recently got rid of her good leftist political advisors and has since voted yes on a recent emergency funding addition of a few hundred million I cannot find back.. I looked at the house voting records. I can only imagine what happened and apologize for stating my conjecture as fact.

Thanks, that's I very decent of you.

20
Policy and solutions / Re: Nuclear Power
« on: September 10, 2019, 03:46:39 PM »
Fukushima: Japan Will have to Dump Radioactive Water Into Pacific, Minister Says

This was inevitable and is only the beginning as they simply don't have any other choice. because 500T day of water comes in from the hills and 100 tons passes the ice wall gets contaminated and has to be stored. The decontamination technology for this that was promised was just never going to work. This just won't stop for decades or probably hundreds or even thousands of years.

The ice wall needs power to stay frozen, last report I could find was a few years after the disaster and their were still > 5000 people onsite each day while they were churning over so many workers (exceeded their exposure limits) that they couldn't keep up.

Their are so many questions I haven't seen answered , how much does this cost, who pays, how could any reactor possibly anywhere cover the insurance for an event like this, how much power is required to maintain the frozen wall?

Then what's the future outlook, certainly low level contamination of the pacific for decades or more what else is likely?
What happens to the cores as their is no known technology to deal with these how long do they need to be contained?

I've looked for answers and haven't found anything, perhaps some one here could add something?

21
Policy and solutions / Re: Batteries: Today's Energy Solution
« on: September 10, 2019, 03:28:17 PM »


There is one way out though: Put a price on externalities and make it a market rule by using market tools (i.e. taxation).

There you have it. The problem is incentives not the system itself. Put a reasonable price on carbon AND all other pollutants, especially plastics and the market system will sort it out. You will have plenty of green energy, sustainable agriculture, etc. simply by changing the incentives (pricing externalities)

This is as clear an example as you will ever get of the effect of a carbon price.
While this was in effect the economy was also growing.



Not enough to avoid 2C but a step in the right direction.

The image is from here (I couldn't find a bigger pic)
http://econews.com.au/62140/australias-greenhouse-gas-emissions-continue-to-rise/

22
Consequences / Re: Prepping for Collapse
« on: September 10, 2019, 03:12:07 PM »
votes for children concentration camp emergency funding after a tea-session with Nancy Pelosi sharing her investment portfolio tips about the companies that profit of it.

I don't think these sort of comments are helpful or fair as there's no evidence for this, it's just conjecture that suits your bias. Wouldn't it be better to find what she actually said about the situation ?

As an outsider (Perth Australia) with no knowledge of the details I would imagine emergency funding would be kind of essential after locking the children up (which wasn't her doing) what's she supposed to do block funding and allow them to starve?

Is there any better reason with any evidence of why this happened ?

23
Policy and solutions / Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« on: August 30, 2019, 12:44:49 PM »
So I conclude, once again, that when she realizes she's being co-opted, she will refuse to play along and you won't see her anymore.

Exactly.

If apparently she is being used and one day will wake up and go away and not be heard again, then what's the point of any protest at all?

The implication is the only people who are heard are those useful for the so called "elites", therefore anyone who is getting publicity should just shut up because their being used.

This leaves no possible avenue for any protest to be legitimate (oh how convenient), this leaves me very suspicious of the motives of people who say this.

Also the crew of the boat are doing whatever their doing in any case Greta has zero affect on what they do or don't do. Tying her to their issues also raises my suspicion.

PS Thanks to Vaughan for the kind comments

24
Policy and solutions / Re: Greta Thunberg's Atlantic crossing
« on: August 17, 2019, 02:13:29 PM »
The people here speculating about Greta being manipulated are pathetic.

If you bothered to watch her interviews and have capacity to understand peoples motives then you would know she is doing this because she believes in what she is doing and rather than being manipulated she is influencing the people around her.

I call you all pathetic because this young girl is actually making a difference and your here wining that building the yacht that she's sailing on had some carbon emissions. Really, she made the best choice she could about how to travel to the US where she probably will make even more a of an impact and all you can do is whine about this.

This seems like the denialist bullshit that doesn't gets past Neven's moderation for very long. 

25
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2019 melting season
« on: July 31, 2019, 03:26:42 PM »
BTW, is old ice more resistant to melt than young ice, i assume yes but am not sure.

Yes it's less salty.

26
The rest / Re: Arctic Café
« on: July 17, 2019, 02:52:40 PM »
Quote
But the Greatest of These is Love

I love this beautiful, mysterious, complicated planet we get to call home. The planet who had the audacity to burst with life, from her boreal crown to her icy toes at the South Pole. I love her caves and her valleys and her rivers and her oceans. I love the majesty of larger-than-life elephants and whales and rhinos and lions. I love the elegance and enigma of all the different kinds of bats—even the ones that eat other bats! I love the unapologetic sass of butterflies and hummingbirds and coral reefs and the tear-jerking aroma of flowers that bloom below the equator.

https://medium.com/@maryheglar/but-the-greatest-of-these-is-love-4b7aad06e18c

This helps understand the where the anger at climate denial comes from.

Neven some time ago (perhaps even more than once) said he was angry, this made a lot of sense to me as I'm also angry at climate denial (except I'm completely ineffective). I also think it's only the anger of the youth that will make any difference (Greta is just the start, very awake but not yet angry).

I might be seeing more here than there is, but just now this helps explain where the anger comes from. 

27

Take heart NevB, at least the new South Australia Government is going for it - and its a Liberal Govt.

I didn't even think to add Liberal here in Australia are conservatives (ie just like the GOP), the "Liberals" here have hijacked the term and are conservatives.

But enough that's too much politics already, lets see many more links from RenewEconomy which is the best renewables site I know of.

28
Today Canada's House of Commons passed a motion to declare a national climate emergency.
The motion was put forward by Environment and Climate Change Minister Catherine McKenna, and it passed with 186 votes to 63.

It declares a national climate emergency, and supports the country’s commitment to meeting the emissions targets outlined in the Paris Agreement.

The motion described climate change as a “real and urgent crisis, driven by human activity, that impacts the environment, biodiversity, Canadians’ health, and the Canadian economy.”

The motion declares that “Canada is in a national climate emergency which requires, as a response, that Canada commit to meeting its national emission target under the Paris Agreement and to making deeper reductions in line with the agreement’s objective of holding global warming below two degrees Celsius and pursuing efforts to keep global warming below 1.5 degrees Celsius.”

All parties voted for the motion, except the two far right parties, which take their cues from America's Republicans.
https://globalnews.ca/news/5401586/canada-national-climate-emergency/

So sad that Australia was not so long ago ready to lead, we were once known as a great and generous nation. Where did we go so wrong.

29
The rest / Re: Arctic Café
« on: June 18, 2019, 01:18:12 PM »
Grid attached solar is designed to shut off when the power goes out so you don't back feed the grid and injure or maybe kill the electrical workers when they try to restore power. Equipment designed to be stand alone doesn't require the power to be on. But it is not designed to sync with the grid and so will burn up if you tie it to the grid.

I've thought of this often for my own situation.

What's needed is a change over switch and a unit designed to trick the inverter into thinking it is connected to the grid. Something like that potentially wouldn't be expensive as it wouldn't need to handle a large amount of power. This unit also wouldn't connect to the grid making approvals less of a problem.

There's an opportunity waiting there for someone with some good electronics skills.

30
Policy and solutions / Re: Renewable Energy
« on: June 17, 2019, 02:04:47 PM »
South Australia’s stunning aim to be “net” 100 per cent renewables by 2030

https://reneweconomy.com.au/south-australias-stunning-aim-to-be-net-100-per-cent-renewables-by-2030/

What's even more stunning is that this is the conservative SA government making this announcement.

These people were doing all they could to stop renewables not so long ago, however the people of SA have finally realised that renewables are cheaper for them. SA doesn't have much in the way of their own gas or coal and has to import. But they do have some of the best wind and sun resources in the world.





31
Consequences / Re: Climate change, the ocean, agriculture, and FOOD
« on: June 09, 2019, 11:20:09 AM »
Australia’s average wheat yields, which had more than tripled due to technological advances between 1900 and 1990, did not increase from 1990 to 2015.

https://www.csiro.au/en/News/News-releases/2017/Australias-wheat-yields-stalled

Quote
Recent research by CSIRO scientists, published in the journal Global Change Biology, found that Australia’s yield potential (determined by the climate and soil type, managed using best practice and current technology) declined by 27 per cent over the past quarter of a century.

CSIRO team leader Dr Zvi Hochman said the study found that Australia’s wheat-growing zone had experienced an average rainfall decline of 2.8 mm or 28 per cent per cropping season, and a maximum daily temperature increase of around 1℃ from 1990 to 2015.

These observations are consistent with the higher end of future climate change projections for the wheat zone over the coming 26 years.

32
Policy and solutions / Re: Australian politics and climate
« on: May 23, 2019, 04:31:18 PM »
Since this is about Australia here's two stories that unfortunately involve politics however politics is something we have to deal with if we are to make any progress in addressing AGW. I was really hoping I could ignore this for a long time but this election leaves no choice but to do what can be done.

1st Here's a politician from a major party that understands the issue and what has to be done and is trying to deal with the political reality of what is possible after spending more than a decade fighting (and losing) for what should be done.

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/may/23/tony-burke-floats-green-new-deal-style-approach-to-labors-climate-policy

Quote
The shadow environment minister, Tony Burke, has declared Labor can no longer pursue a climate policy based on a market mechanism to reduce emissions.

But he insists there can be no retreat from what the science says needs to happen to avoid dangerous warming.

In a significant piece of post-election positioning, Burke told Guardian Australia Labor needs to adopt new policies of regulation and spending – like the Green New Deal model pursued by some Democrats in the United States, or like the existing Australian Direct Action model – because that is the only way a majority of Australian voters will sign on to climate action.

Then there's ex PM Kevin Rudd, (too intellectual for the comfort of Australian voters) with a very lengthy analysis of the political landscape, based on the issues in Australia but also very relevant to many of the issues that have been discussed here.

http://kevinrudd.com/2019/02/04/the-complacent-country/


Quote
Planning for the Future – The Question of National Vision

Quote
Our Future National Challenges – The Dangers of The Great Disruption


Quote
Impact on the National Psychology

Quote
Murdoch and the Far Right

Quote
The Dilemma of the Reforming Centre

Quote
The most tragic, continuing example of this is climate change and the capture of the Australian conservatives by a legion of climate change deniers – repealing Labor’s carbon price, and repeatedly launching political assaults on our legislated mandatory renewable energy target.

BTW This is the current PM that the Australian people just elected and Murdoch's media (who controls 70% in Aus) has delivered.


The point of all this is to illustrate that the mainstream "Left" here accept the science, totally understand the problem and have been trying to do what's needed for decades. However the conservatives and mining interests have successfully used their media power to turn the people against any change. They have also relentlessly been attacked from environmentalist's for not doing enough which has significantly undermined any chance they have of making any progress.
Some of this echo's the situation in the US.

PS This thread should be moved to "The Rest" if possible as it shouldn't be listed with the science pages. 
   


33
Policy and solutions / Re: Extinction Rebellion
« on: April 27, 2019, 11:00:34 AM »
Some XR anecdotes:

Quote
(Climate Rebel,) Freya Nolin, a 21 yr old from Fremantle WA was charged with a $10,000 fine this Tuedsay in the Bowen Magistrate’s court after blocking coal trains from entering Adani’s Abbot Point last month.The action took place as part of a week long event, ‘Shut Down Adani’, where Whitsunday locals and people from all over Australia came together to demand the Adani Carmichael mine be scrapped. [...]

Earlier this year Adani was fined $13,000 for releasing polluted water into the Cally Valley wetlands. in 2017 Adani was fined $12,000 for releasing polluted water into the ocean adjacent to Abbot Point.
https://ausrebellion.earth/media-release/21-yr-old-climate-activist-hit-with-highest-fines-in-australias-environmental-history/

Quote
Day four: Thursday (18 April) A peaceful demonstration in Brisbane, Queensland the same day was violently attacked by police. Six climate rebels were ambushed by the Queensland police services cyber crime and tactical response units moments before the action took place leading to all six being arrested (Some violently with heads being bashed, some having their legs kicked out from underneath them at the hands of police.) Two (rebels) were charged with offences and four (rebels) were released with no charge.”
https://ausrebellion.earth/updates/international-rebellion-first-week-in-australia/

Quote
Day one: Monday (15 April)  In Adelaide, South Australia, rebels entered Parliament house while sitting was in process and demanded the declaration of a climate emergency. They were forcibly removed by security. But the story made the evening TV news on two stations.

Sydney rebels staged a ‘die in’ dramatically dropping dead in the streets.
Protesters dropped “dead” in the middle of the busy streets of Sydney, Australia on Monday to highlight the emergency we are all facing due to catastrophic climate change.
https://ausrebellion.earth/updates/international-rebellion-first-week-in-australia/

The term is 'rebels' :)

No a word in the media here, not even the Guardian which is the only left leaning outlet in the country. Not even a mention on Twitter.

34
Walking the walk / Re: When was the last flight you took?
« on: April 18, 2019, 01:30:58 PM »
The last six years I've flown about 2000km each way once or twice a week for work.

The work is in the Pilbara, there is nothing there (2hr drive to the nearest small town) and it's inhospitable (most summer day temps around 40+ c) not many want to live there. Until mining companies are forced to change this, flying will be the only option for most.
One small piece of better news is that the company has a goal of achieving at least 22% indigenous workers in the next FY where last year they were around 18%. The reason for this is I believe is purely economic, cheaper workers with less travel. The result though is less flying.

BTW Just this one large size mine has 9 flights a week with 774-300's? or around 100 to 130 people each flight. Plus a few shorter flights.

Now I'm working in the city and commuting on the electric train, currently that's were the work is, when this job is over I'll probably again have the choice to fly or not work.

As for personal travel I've had just a single trip to the US in this time and two trips to Bali, each about six hours. These trips were not entirely my choice and I'm not planning any more. Bali (in Indonesia) is worth mentioning where I couldn't name anyone that I know here in Perth that hasn't been there and many make a few trips a year.
The cost of a Bali trip for three days with accommodation can be as little as $300, which is cheaper than a local holiday. Until the true environmental cost is included this won't change and any political party that where to even mentioned this wouldn't stand a chance of being elected.
 
Here in Australia everyone is travelling with constant trips to all places around the world. There is very little recognition of the impacts and little interest in knowing.

One thing I found particularly depressing was after the recent fires in Tasmania that burn't bushland that hadn't been burnt in a thousand years due to the heat and drought. There were a few articles in the media, the depressing part were the comments from people who were so concerned about expressing their grief over this that they were organising flights for people to go see the unburnt forests before they are gone. Not one sign from anyone of just how totally ignorant this was. 

35
The politics / Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« on: April 18, 2019, 03:17:39 AM »

I don't exactly know .......


2 things are remarkable:

- if someone does need "her" to finally understand the obvious

- the quoted part explains the rest

since this is not the place to explain un-welcome facts about how our society and it's individuals mostly function, i won't take this any further. sometimes i really ask myself whether "matrix" is really just a movie ;) ;) ;)

 8)

I think we may be talking past each other, I'm not the best communicator and what is taken from my comments is often based on the intent of my comment.

Again i'm not sure what your saying, I certainly don't need her to explain anything to me, her message seems to exactly align with what I have learnt on climate forums and especially here over the last decades.

What I do like is that I think her message is surprisingly powerful and I think this is the type of message needed to get people to understand these "un-welcome facts about how our society and it's individuals mostly function".   
 

36
The politics / Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« on: April 18, 2019, 01:06:18 AM »

Greta Thunberg is a powerful messenger ....

it's not her age, it's her handicap that makes the difference. just imagine if that girl would be a stunner, not only woulnd't she have taken on the same tasks but would be discarded, mostly due to envy and the limited mindset that pretty girls have to be "less smart"

it's not by accident that from all the millions of people who tell the same story, those are accepted who have one or several significant deficits. bist of course is once they are dead, or do you think it's by accident that the most honored people after who we name streets, .....

I don't exactly know what point you are trying to make but no matter Im glad Ifinally listened to her after initially assuming a sixteen year old wouldn't have much to say other than what she was being told by her parents etc.
Maybe in a way your right as if she was prettier I would have ignored her longer but then she's not ugly in any way and I can't see how discussing her appearance will add any value. As to her aspergers I had no idea untill after seeing this remarkable interview.





37
The politics / Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« on: April 17, 2019, 03:10:22 PM »
I didn't know where else this would fit but here

Greta Thunberg is a powerful messenger because her age makes the point even stronger, her facts seem to be solid and her delivery carries both emotion and a calm sense of panic. 

Greta Thunberg says she wants us to panic and much more.


This seems to align well with the message of this forum. I hope we hear a lot more of this girl in the media.



38
The politics / Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« on: April 15, 2019, 03:11:40 PM »
The message I have found here at ASIB is in this case at least almost reaching the MSM.
(I say almost only because the the Guardian is not read by fox viewers)

Quote
Our system – characterised by perpetual economic growth on a planet that is not growing – will inevitably implode. The only question is whether the transformation is planned or unplanned. Our task is to ensure it is planned, and fast. We need to conceive and build a new system based on the principle that every generation, everywhere has an equal right to enjoy natural wealth.

This is less daunting than we might imagine. As Erica Chenoweth’s historical research reveals, for a peaceful mass movement to succeed, a maximum of 3.5% of the population needs to mobilise.

by George Monbiot

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/apr/15/rebellion-prevent-ecological-apocalypse-civil-disobedience?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Tweet

If the majority of the media were to speak the truth like this, how much difference would it make would it make, would that be enough and if so how much culpability do the media have?



39
There have been 1878 posts in this thread.

Lots of accusations against "corporate" Democrats, named and unnamed.
No accusations against Republicans, but if you bring that up you're chased off the thread as being off topic.

So I was wondering.

Do we have a list of Democrats that are NOT considered "corporate" by the posters in this forum ?

They would be the one's no one has heard off because they don't have any money.

40
The politics / Re: Political theatre/wrestling
« on: December 04, 2018, 03:00:51 AM »
Just Theatre

Quote
President Donald Trump’s company planned to give a $50 million penthouse at Trump Tower Moscow to Russian President Vladimir Putin as the company negotiated the luxury real estate development during the 2016 campaign, according to four people, one of them the originator of the plan.

Two US law enforcement officials told BuzzFeed News that Michael Cohen, Trump’s personal lawyer at the time, discussed the idea with a representative of Dmitry Peskov, Putin’s press secretary.

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/anthonycormier/the-trump-organization-planned-to-give-vladimir-putin-the


Because representatives of press secretaries need to be kept in the loop. ::)
Terry

I let this pass at the time, now I have a moment to reply.

You point out that the Russian's they were negotiating with may not be directly connected to Putin, but this is irrelevant to whether Cohen's (and almost certainly Trump's) actions were illegal.

Quote
https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/12/02/trump-presidency-threatened-50-million-penthouse-gift-putin-column/2169500002/


I believe I was attempting to point out that covert operations are not usually handled so publicly.


AFAIK the latest is that Mueller's acceptance of parts of Cohen's testimony prove that the Orange One and President Putin are both in the clear.


I'll see if I can find the article if you'd be interested.
Terry

Thanks, drop a link if you come across it and I will read it.

We'll probably be quiet distracted by something else though by the time you find it.


41
The politics / Re: Political theatre/wrestling
« on: December 04, 2018, 01:37:38 AM »
Just Theatre

Quote
President Donald Trump’s company planned to give a $50 million penthouse at Trump Tower Moscow to Russian President Vladimir Putin as the company negotiated the luxury real estate development during the 2016 campaign, according to four people, one of them the originator of the plan.

Two US law enforcement officials told BuzzFeed News that Michael Cohen, Trump’s personal lawyer at the time, discussed the idea with a representative of Dmitry Peskov, Putin’s press secretary.

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/anthonycormier/the-trump-organization-planned-to-give-vladimir-putin-the


Because representatives of press secretaries need to be kept in the loop. ::)
Terry

I let this pass at the time, now I have a moment to reply.

You point out that the Russian's they were negotiating with may not be directly connected to Putin, but this is irrelevant to whether Cohen's (and almost certainly Trump's) actions were illegal.

Quote
https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/12/02/trump-presidency-threatened-50-million-penthouse-gift-putin-column/2169500002/

42
The politics / Re: Empire - America and the future
« on: December 02, 2018, 11:30:58 AM »
Bush senior passed away today. Age 94.

See here the response from Obama.
Dignified and honorable, even though they disagreed on many issues :



It's a big club...

Doesn't this stuff make you nauseous, Rob? I mean, Obama doesn't necessarily have to dump on the guy because he was a war criminal and a thief, but this borders on necrophilia.

Anyway, you posted it in the right thread. Thanks for that.

I read that as an attempt to build a bridge to the not so extreme republicans, nauseating yes but if this helps to gather a few more votes to help with the 2020 campaign what's the real harm vs gain ?

 

43
The politics / Re: Political theatre/wrestling
« on: November 30, 2018, 12:13:49 AM »
Just Theatre

Quote
President Donald Trump’s company planned to give a $50 million penthouse at Trump Tower Moscow to Russian President Vladimir Putin as the company negotiated the luxury real estate development during the 2016 campaign, according to four people, one of them the originator of the plan.

Two US law enforcement officials told BuzzFeed News that Michael Cohen, Trump’s personal lawyer at the time, discussed the idea with a representative of Dmitry Peskov, Putin’s press secretary.


https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/anthonycormier/the-trump-organization-planned-to-give-vladimir-putin-the

44
Policy and solutions / Re: Nuclear Power
« on: November 13, 2018, 12:16:48 PM »
America’s nuclear waste failure:

Quote
But the San Onofre nuclear power plant will loom for a long time as a landmark, its 1,800 tons of lethal radioactive waste stored on the edge of the Pacific and within sight of the busy 5 Freeway.

Across the site, deep pools of water and massive concrete casks confine high-power gamma radiation and other forms of radioactivity emitted by 890,000 spent fuel rods that nobody wants there.

And like the other 79,000 tons of spent fuel spread across the nation, San Onofre’s nuclear waste has nowhere to go.

http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-stranded-nuclear-waste-20170702-htmlstory.html

Quote
Edison is building a massive concrete monolith for more storage, using a Holtec design called Hi-Storm UMAX. It will hold about two-thirds of the plant’s spent fuel in 73 stainless-steel canisters about 125 feet from the ocean. The 25-foot structure is about half-buried with the underground foundation just above the mean high-tide line. Tall cranes and swarms of hard hats are moving construction ahead.

Let's hope they are not seriously relying on the mean high tide line not increasing over the next 20 or so years.


45
The politics / Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« on: November 12, 2018, 02:32:14 PM »
I wasn't intending to post anything else here, as I don't have the time or inclination for replies.

But then this tempted me: 

https://thinkprogress.org/kellyanne-video-acosta-sports-replay-fe6ad3211268/?utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_content=5be96b5c04d3016e1ca77980&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter

Quote
“Oh, well that’s not altered, that’s sped up,” said Conway of the altered video, somehow managing to keep a straight face. The dictionary definition of the word “altered” is to be “made different in some way.”

Quote
“They do it all the time in sports to see if there’s actually a first down or a touchdown,” she told Wallace. “I have to disagree with the overwrought description of this video being doctored as if we put somebody else’s arm in there.”

Obviously the "bad" journalism was created by the administration but it's their use of this "bad" journalism and the attacks on "good" journalism (especially the incitement of violence and the outright support of the politician that assaulted a journalist) that I see as a gravely dangerous.

IMHO: If this is to continue and Trump managers another term (which is not at all impossible) then there is a decent chance that the media will no longer be free to criticise the administration and the incitement to violence along with more violent acts will begin to have the desired effect.
Then without any kind of restraint this could become a permanent situation.


Also as a final note:

The two paragraphs above are just my observation and the quote below was I guess just bait for Russian apologists while although true doesn't help this discussion proceed. This comes from deep frustration with the way Russia's behaviour is dismissed, denied, excused or even held as equivalent to US actions here and the what I see as a need to warn of the consequences.

However as I said above I don't have the time, attitude, firsthand knowledge or inclination to get involved in this debate as there are others far more capable. I don't intend to post any more here as this will only degenerate into useless distracting flame wars (which would suit anyone wanting to see this place disrupted).

Quote
Trump would like the US to become more like Putin's Russia where journalist who ask difficult questions are murdered.

(which BTW is not

Quote
President Trump would like journalists who ask difficult questions murdered.
)

Have at it, I'll will be watching silently.





46
The politics / Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« on: November 09, 2018, 03:40:08 PM »
Trump would like the US to become more like Putin's Russia where journalist who ask difficult questions are murdered.

Oh really?
President Trump would like journalists who ask difficult questions murdered.
How nice of you to say so.

I sure do hope the NSA has 'your number' and are keeping an eye on you ..... and I do hope Neven didn't 'cull' my little comment on Paranoia. Such basic education to raise awareness really is needed imo.

Noted: You can't quote me without subtly changing my words

Also noted is that a comparison of Trumps direction and Putin's reality is what lights your fire.

As for your subtle threat about the NSA I think I'm OK as long as I don't mention Bomb, President, IED, attack, plane, Jihad, Allah, Plutonium or detonator especially in one sentence and post that online. And as for paranoia I use my real name and my profile has my E-Mail address with my domain that is easily traceable. I have nothing to hide do you?   

What's your real name Lurk?, what are your hiding from from?

47
The politics / Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« on: November 09, 2018, 01:24:07 PM »

It's pretty clear the WH doctored the video.
One more time- it wasn't the WH. And Acosta was being an ass.

It wasn't the Whitehouse but they still haven't apologised for peddling a lie or admitted their mistake. Yet here you are defending them.

What you are defending is a would be tyrant who is trying to overpower one of the fundamental pillars of democracy. Until now the executive was answerable to the people in some way, Trump would like the US to become more like Putin's Russia where journalist who ask difficult questions are murdered. If people don't stand up to him this is what will happen and those that enable him in any way must be opposed.

PS Don't bother with a reply to me, I have had my say and just don't have time to waste on you.




48
The rest / Re: GOP Losing Ground for the 2018 Mid-Term Election
« on: November 08, 2018, 01:53:06 PM »
Nice graphic.



There is much more detail here:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/11/07/us/politics/how-democrats-took-the-house.html

and a summary:

Quote
So how big was the blue wave?
Over all, 2018’s shift to the left was smaller than the one in 2006, the last time the Democrats flipped the House. And it was half the size of the most recent Republican wave in 2010 when districts shifted more than 19 points to the right.

49
The politics / Re: The Media: Examples of Good AND Bad Journalism
« on: November 08, 2018, 01:25:41 PM »
Bad Journalism, does that include when the administration releases a doctored video ?

https://twitter.com/aymanndotcom/status/1060407290472398849

Quote
The intern's reach for the mic is slowed down, and the "chop" motion is accelerated. Here's an annotated side by side comparison:

Here's the video released by Sarah Sanders:
https://twitter.com/PressSec/status/1060374680991883265



50
The politics / Re: The Trump Presidency (was "Presidential Poll")
« on: October 29, 2018, 10:07:49 AM »
Turkey, Assad, and Russia would all bitterly oppose any kind of autonomy for the Kurds.  No guarantees short of autonomy would likely hold once the last US troops leave Syria.  I have trouble seeing how delaying the painful end would make it any less awful.

We might agree that there's no good solution here.  Just awful and less awful choices.

There is a good solution : All the parties in Syria could stop shooting and start talking.

Yes but not a realistic one, Robert McNamara although loathed by the left for his role in Vietnam was quiet right and I think misunderstood, often there are no good options only bad ones the only choice then is to choose the least worst, then I would add to pretend this isn't true is denial which is irresponsible.

http://handofreason.com/2011/media/the-fog-of-war-eleven-lessons-from-the-life-of-robert-s-mcnamara

ie
Quote
Lesson #11: You can’t change human nature.

McNamara explains that ‘the fog of war’ refers to how complex war is and the inability of the human mind to fully comprehend all of those complexities at one time. He believes that human nature will make it impossible to end war any time soon, and though we are rational creatures that rationality has limits.

Syria is exactly that, pretending there are good options is unrealistic and dishonest (and this is used endlessly by Russian, Syrian and Iranian supporters).

I've no idea what the least worst option is but we are likely to agree that Trump's regime is not at all likely to find this unless it happens to align with their corrupt and immoral agenda.

Pity the Kurds, I think they would have had a greater chance but no guarantee under a Clinton Presidency and this is the difference.





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