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Messages - johnm33

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1
Arctic sea ice / Re: HYCOM
« on: July 05, 2020, 11:36:08 AM »
"Any idea what would cause those?" I think massive movements of of water caused by mslp highs/lows passing from land to sea, or vice versa,  or passing over Lomonosov and some by tidal surges in concert with those movements. The movements set up internal waves in deeper layers, these either cancel out or reinforce each other if the second then events like this occur and they're not uncommon in the Canada basin, looking at amsr2 on polarview you can see signs of these events and similar signs elsewhere but without Hycoms model.
https://www7320.nrlssc.navy.mil/GLBhycomcice1-12/beaufort.html
Amsr2 data browser
 The ice strength gif of Beaufort shows the ice will not hold a crack, suggesting to me it's very weak.

2
Arctic sea ice / Re: Tides
« on: July 03, 2020, 11:55:09 PM »
The present and forecast mslp promises an increased inflow of Atl. waters, so both St. Anna and Franz Victoria troughs will see some action possibly as soon as 04:07 [07:04US] increased turbulence and forcing both along the Barents shelf and towards the pole, so maybe a [near] pole hole tues 07:07. Nares won't last that long, may have gone already, big tides will dislodge fast coastal ice and even if the wind changes the high slp should force enough water through to almost clear it next week.
I'm trying to make the case that the recent internal wave action in Beaufort was the resonant remains of the last full moons tides, if there's anything to that then we should see a repeat sometime around 23-25:07 trashing a much weaker Beaufort.

3
Arctic sea ice / Re: HYCOM
« on: July 03, 2020, 10:13:29 AM »
The two images show what appears to me to be a massive 'spouting out' incident occuring in the depths of Beaufort, I wouldn't fancy being in a sub caught anywhere in that turmoil.


4
Walking the walk / Re: Gardening
« on: July 02, 2020, 10:48:12 PM »
I've been learning from everyone here so the veggie patch. Still a work in progress.

On the left runner beans mixed in with sunflowers and some volunteer nasturtiums,  beside them some rasberries and spuds and further, netted, blackcurrents. Beyong those broad beans obscured by celery run to seed and 'spud' behind the bin peas and to the right more broad beans and in the foreground among the canes more peas. The teasels are trying to take over so I'm culling them before they run to seed, some laid at the foot of the sunflowers nettles too so that's a bag of them beside the bin. At the bottom beyond the goji berries/hazel and bamboo are the composters and a compost heap. And finally the chicken run beyond which is the polytunnel.
 

5
Thanks Espen. The water out in Disko has been around 5/6C for days so with any tidal exchange plenty of melt opportunities. You wait for days then 3 polarveiw images at once[ish], the latest shows calving continues and the overturning wave to the north side of the south branch appears to be collapsing. Looking south some of the ice streams are becoming more defined, and upstream the 'circular feature' is more manifestly terraced suggesting to me that it sits in water and some deep  bass notes are permeating the ice. The link is to the variable image from earlier today.

6
Policy and solutions / Re: If not Capitalism... then What? And, How?
« on: June 27, 2020, 11:16:06 AM »
Capitalism is when it's possible for individuals within a society to build their own little empires, competing with others doing the same by offering goods or services which people will pay for. This can only exist as a temporary phenomenon because unless a tyrant imposes the rules soon the rich will buy the politicians the legislature and the law, not to mention science, academia, religion and all media. Then they will pursue their monopolies until such time as the inherent stupidity of their cultural/societal choices ossify become brittle and shatter.
Looking back it's clear you cannot have any type of sophisticated society without a means of creating/distributing credit, in my opinion the closest any society came to establishing a fair system was, with all it's faults, the Incan empire.
Our present system where only a priviliged aristocratic elite can create credit has been tried many times and always failed. Often by imposing an ever growing burden of debt on the least priviliged, usually to the point where they have to sell first their daughters then their sons and finally themselves are taken into debt servitude/slavery. [An alternative was arbritary laws/taxes only enforced on the lowest tier with transgressions resulting in periods of 'penal' servitude, i believe it was possible for a London thief to be sentenced to up to twenty one years of indentured service in early plantation 'America' for the simple theft of a hanky and sold off to the highest bid on arrival. Debtors prisons were also used to coerce children into accepting a period of indentured service to free their otherwise 'lost' parent from indefinite detention.] Then the next tier cannot compete with the slaves and they succumb to debt in turn, eventually those societies have too few free men to resist predatory raiders demanding tribute or else, and perhaps look to mercenaries for protection only to find their problems have doubled.
I think the best way to create credit/money would be something like a universal basic income but based on universal equal access to 0% credit at a level similar to minimum wage. It would have to be repaid, so not a handout thus there'd be no restrictions on working or who could live with whom or household size. To pay down the debt a small transaction tax would be levied maybe 2.5% tax for every full year of debt owed, and perhaps a rollover fee [10%] when those thresholds are crossed, this on top of a simple 2.5% tax on all transactions of all economic actors. Maybe impose a negative interest rate [20%?] on mothers debts to recognise their necessary burden. To level the playing field somewhat a simple 2.5% tax on all assets of all economic entities above a certain threshold [house+pension?] for individuals no allowances for 'immortal' non corporeal entities. To prevent the rich buying the parties/legislature/executive/law have all political and legal decisions taken by randomly chosen jurists who are elected by a citizens vote/nominations process similar to elections, and ditch the civil service in favour of commisioned studies by senior student bodies.
So perhaps the first move would be to select and elect local 'jurists' to replace parachuted in politicians.

7
Arctic sea ice / Re: HYCOM vs ASMR2 Imagery
« on: June 27, 2020, 12:43:28 AM »
Hycom. Mostly the older model was preferred, when they ran side by side, myself i preferred the current one. Bear in mind that there's some very expensive kit under the ice and whilst whole areas may be designated a particular depth for safety reasons it may be that there's an anticipated max for keels thats indicated rather than actual thickness, thus wave action passing through may cause much of the thicker ridged ice to simply keel over into created 'voids' changing the safety code. Lets say perhaps 15% of 4m ice floes will have a 12m keel depth and as waves [swells] pass the thinnest ice clumps together in the troughs freeing space for the keels to flip, so no real change in volume but huge change in geometry.

8
Walking the walk / Re: Gardening
« on: June 26, 2020, 08:03:08 PM »
There're plenty of trees that'll cope with water, maybe a bat hotel for the insects?

9
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2020 melting season
« on: June 26, 2020, 07:56:30 PM »
'active garlic press' hycoms sss has been showing flow through for some time, increased salinity and above -1.8c suggests some bottom melt. Look also out in Beaufort where the salinity is falling, i'm reading that as Atl. waters penetrating-causing some melt- then flowing through the channels-all of them. Given weather patterns persisting we could see not just Nares opening up around 05:07 [07:05US] and then the ice free of the coast by August?

link to an earlier sss 06:05iirc

10
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2020 melting season
« on: June 25, 2020, 11:15:17 PM »
An A-Team treatment of uh amsr2, CAA looking very fragile.

11
The politics / Re: Economic Inequality
« on: June 23, 2020, 10:40:34 PM »
I guess everybody has to make sacrifices for the greater good, of the elite. https://www.oftwominds.com/blogjune20/sacrifice-everything6-20.html
" 1. Gee, wealth/income inequality isn't quite as bad as everyone claims. (Actually, it's worse, but never mind unwelcome reality. Let us prove yet again how statistics can always be gamed.)

2. Wealth/income inequality is bad, but it's not the Fed's or policymakers' faults; the causes are all beyond our control: globalization, winner-take-all disruptive technologies, etc. We're just little old innocent bystanders. It's like blaming us for gravity, for goodness sakes.

3. Gosh darn it, the Fed is just trying to help the little gal and guy by digitally printing $6.4 trillion and giving it to parasitic, predatory financiers, banks, corporations and speculators; we're mystified how giving trillions to the already-super-wealthy somehow made them richer.

We've got hundreds of PhD economists working on some arcane mathematical models to help us understand the mystery of why giving trillions to the already-super-wealthy somehow made them richer. It's a real puzzle, but we have our best people on it-- yes siree, our best people. "
Working towards a sunlit hell.

12
The rest / Re: Archaeology/Paleontology news
« on: June 23, 2020, 09:59:42 PM »
Stonehenge/Durrington walls henge. Looking at their animation and reading that there were local flintmines i suspect the southern holes may have been moved out of the circle by water introduced by the excavations into old workings causing a collapse and slump southwards. A simple core should show a discontinuity or not.

13
Arctic sea ice / Re: Tides
« on: June 20, 2020, 12:11:26 PM »
Parallel waves showed up on the 19:06 amsr2 just north of FJ suggesting the surge was on a much broader front than the above post implies, and todays sees that quashed possibly by outflow between FJ and SvBd, with the ice either side smashed by interacting waves. So tying that to the [uniquorns] bathymetry

If i find time i'll try to improve the gif.

14
Arctic sea ice / Re: Tides
« on: June 18, 2020, 01:05:46 PM »
This animation runs from  11:06 til' 17:06 it looks to me that another spouting out event happened in the deeper layers, so somewhat subdued compared to a surface event, but then the waves spread and have now subsided. Just in time for the build up of the next tidal acceleration of currents, that is if there's any 'reality' to my hypothesis.

There's a possibility that the wave action had some impact on the thinning showing up on Hycoms thickness

if that's the case then the ice will be slaughtered by the next event, if indeed there is one, so perhaps around  25:06 we see a 'peak' of losses on the eurasian side.

15
Arctic sea ice / Re: "Stupid" Questions :o
« on: June 18, 2020, 12:15:49 PM »
'Effects' do your search - visualisation -then 4 icons appear on the right of the dataset line zoom-pin-hide-effects.

16
Quite a flood considering we're so far from peak tides. polarview
+24hrs

17
Policy and solutions / Re: If not Capitalism... then What? And, How?
« on: June 16, 2020, 02:43:49 PM »
The neccesity for perpetual growth comes down to the way we choose to create 'money'. It's created when some entity enters into a contract to borrow/repay a sum, whether this is an individual, company or a nation/gov. . This is the way all bank deposits originate, you borrow 250k buy the asset you indicated then hand over 'ownership' of the asset to the bank until the 'debt' is cleared, meanwhile the 'money' sits somewhere in a bank account or is spent and moves to another bank account, rinse repeat; but that money now 'lives' for perpetuity in the banking system. If no interest charges were applied then there'd be no need for growth, but since there are and no 'money' is created to fill this void growth must continue to create more 'money' to balnce the books. It can't go on forever and we may be at peak usury, in the US and UK upstream interest charges of @40% apply to almost all purchases, naturally this imposes costs on consumers that price them out of all but menial jobs that can't be exported, or those jobs which are essential to maintaining the staus quo. Simply put the bankers brought nothing to the banquet, except some basic bookeeping skills, and yet end up owning everything.
Perhaps a better approach would be to give everyone equal access to government created credit/money, and see how society evolves from there.

18
The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: June 16, 2020, 12:22:06 PM »
I agree with Neven, at least about it being nothing much to do with individuals. If you abandon morality and follow 'market rules' it is no different to abdicating responsibility for how society is set up. Society will inevitably follow the same 'game' plan which led to the structure the social insects have evolved, to whit a singular selfish center surrounded first by servants, then an uncompromising security service to defend against internal and external threats, and finally a disposable workforce pheremoned/hypnotised/terrorised/entranced into ignoring their own interests in favour of the center, a little like the USAs compliant client states.
Maybe honey ant colonies make a good analogy.
Since Kassy struck this through without comment or communication insights into the apparent offense would be welcome.

19
Policy and solutions / Re: If not Capitalism... then What? And, How?
« on: June 14, 2020, 06:35:59 PM »
I agree with Neven, at least about it being nothing much to do with individuals. If you abandon morality and follow 'market rules' it is no different to abdicating responsibility for how society is set up. Society will inevitably follow the same 'game' plan which led to the structure the social insects have evolved, to whit a singular selfish center surrounded first by servants, then an uncompromising security service to defend against internal and external threats, and finally a disposable workforce pheremoned/hypnotised/terrorised/entranced into ignoring their own interests in favour of the center, a little like the USAs compliant client states.
Maybe honey ant colonies make a good analogy.

20
Arctic sea ice / Re: Tides
« on: June 14, 2020, 10:40:13 AM »

21
Arctic sea ice / Re: Tides
« on: June 14, 2020, 10:30:55 AM »
This is the same view as above but from amsr2 on polarview[010620], it's more subtle, hard to see the waves unless you know they're there.

with that in mind a gif that starts on the 5th pauses/repeats where i see wave forms with the last image from yesterday [13020]

What i suspect is happening is that the current dropping down St. Anna enhanced by tidal surges, and possibly river discharge, is causing resonant wave forms to set up in the depths of the Eurasian basin both across it and along it and at some point these 'spout out' ''  followed by a quieter period as that energy dissipates, probably starting tomorrow.

22
Arctic sea ice / Re: Arctic Ocean salinity, temperature and waves
« on: June 10, 2020, 05:37:16 PM »
Looks huge

my interpretation is eddies forced by the Atl. current accelerating down St. Anna, eddies and counter eddies caught up in the trough by Gakel so moving both east and west, both reaching the surface but eastbound with more energy. Not sure that waves reflected by Lomonosov have begun to interfere yet but Bremen amsr2 will lighten up when that happens. Surge of incoming water causing acceleration towards Fram of the layer @75m deep not steadied by contact with ice, stretching the layer above it and opening up the ice. This will also push tidal Atl. water towards CAA and act to force tidal surges in Greenland/Norwegian seas to either short circuit around Iceland or climb onto Barentz shelf to continue the assault.   
What are those two wave forms on the other side? no trace of them elsewhere.

23
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2020 melting season
« on: June 05, 2020, 08:56:06 AM »
Thick ice is rotating into Beaufort, so Amundsen may clear but my guess is the CAA coast needs to clear before Beaufort will. IF that means that Pacific waters are moving east into ESS then the ice there will weaken and cause losses as it moves north.

ice thickness and sssalinity courtesy of Hycom.

24
Arctic sea ice / Re: Arctic Ocean salinity, temperature and waves
« on: June 04, 2020, 09:44:30 PM »
"Current or eddies" Looks like both, not sure that would've been picked up elsewhere, maybe it's a new phenomenon, certainly seems to indicate a flood of Atl. water[based on it's inertia eastward] rushing down St. Anna, may be pushing it but perhaps the disturbance above above Amundsen towards Lomonosov, the recent surface melt, was caused by this. It appears to be recurring so maybe there'll be a repeat.

25
Arctic sea ice / Re: Tides
« on: June 02, 2020, 09:03:11 AM »
I've been looking at worldview, here and here to try to figure out tidal movements. What I think I'm seeing is that according to atmospherics, mslp gradients and winds, differing amounts of Atl. water pass through Iceland/Scotland gap, it's temp. varies, some is short circuited and rounds Iceland joining Irminger current and eventually flowing up the west coast of Greenland, some heads north. It's progress north is again affected by atmospherics so can be somewhat erratic but the tides and currents slowly deliver it to either Fram or Barents by N.Z. . The fraction delivered deeper into Barents also divides some going into Kara and some sinking into St. Anna trough this is delivered into Nansen and pushes onwards across Gakel into Amundsen basin. This delivery sets up deep disturbences, internal waves, eddies and pulsed currents. The waves wash against Lomonosov and their reflections rebound causing turbulence that reaches the surface weakening the ice. The eddies get caught up in the trough by Gakel and turn east towards Laptev. It looks like a recent pulse was exceptional and caused a large series of radiated waves from somewhere near the center of the Siberian side of Amundsen.
Bremen AMSR2

26
Arctic sea ice / Re: The caa-greenland mega crack
« on: May 31, 2020, 09:23:32 PM »
Atl. water penetration getting caught up in the submarine channel and flowing towards the coast? That would fit with what seems to be melt/reduced salinity west of CAA on Hycoms model.

27
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2020 melting season
« on: May 30, 2020, 05:19:30 PM »
"AMSR2" the hard edge, north of 85o, to the right of the area is almost directly above Gakkel ridge and looking close up on the 28th there are signs of vortices aligned with it towards Laptev. I suspect internal wave action is breaking through to the surface between Gakkel and Lomonosov supressed by the change of depth influx from St. Anna/Voronin troughs on the Nansen side.
 My take is that there are sufficient openings occuring to allow sublimation of sea spray freeing salt to first melt the ice then deep freeze it again, except that the process seems to be repeating it would rapidly vanish as usual.

28
The politics / Re: The problem of social media
« on: May 30, 2020, 09:29:57 AM »
I'm a great fan of Derren Brown for one of his shows he placed a one off small ad in Londons evening newspaper and, weeks later, demonstrated to the audience, who were obviously selected for their detailed reading of every line in that edition, the depth to which that reading had sunk into their consciousness. Scary.
Here CHS discusses the plantation of the mind and just like DB's audience we're generally subsumed into a small reality defined by the confines of the overton windows framing, each oblivious to their particular blindness, so bemused, defining everything in terms of the known. As planned.
"I've been discussing the neocolonial-plantation structure of the U.S. economy since 2008, and now this model has reached perfection in social media's Plantation of the Mind. Once you're firmly enmeshed in this social media Plantation, you lose sight of the fact that there's a larger world outside the plantation: social media platforms aren't exploitive plantations in the World Wide Web/Internet, they are the Internet as far as their users are concerned."

29
Policy and solutions / Re: Hemp and other planet-saving plants
« on: May 28, 2020, 06:25:24 PM »
Lime mortars/concretes can be made much stronger using pozzolans, docks built using hydraulic lime from the roman period still exist, not to forget the dome of the Pantheon.
https://www.aboutcivil.org/sources-of-pozzolanic-materials.html
https://www.mikewye.co.uk/ , builders supplies really but a mine of information on lime.
and a bit deeper https://www.geopolymer.org/applications/

30
Arctic sea ice / Re: 2020 Melting Season Predictions
« on: May 28, 2020, 11:16:37 AM »
^11 " the major consequence of increasing tidal action is greater recycling of Arctic waters south, if the flow of water south through Fram forces inflows from the Pacific then Beaufort will cycle anti[counter] clockwise and free up the channels of the CAA allowing the release of much of the freshwater lens. If the forcing is of Atlantic waters then these will cycle through to the ESS and a river of weak ice will move towards the pole from there, but this will induce more water from the Atlantic to flow south towards Banks is. again risking opening up the channels through the CAA."
^45 "the high has been pushing near surface waters through Fram fairly rapidly, the easiest route for flow is aligned with Amundsen basin and from the other side of Lomonosv between 140E-180 so a remote possibility of a +[near] pole hole. Come tuesday we should see Amundsen gulf begin to clear and that forcing in turn push the ice towards Chukchi, then any thick ice along the CAA sucked into Beaufort over the following days.
ATM the incoming AW looks like it'll head towards both Kara and Ellesmere"
The flow through CAA has begun.

In Baffin and Foxe basin the less saline result comes out at near -1.8c. once a flow is established it tends to persist, as Bruce pointed out the bouys in Beaufort indicate warming implying imo increased inflow from the Atlantic side.
So with cold water flowing into Baffin>Hudson expect a prolonged cold spell which'll probably extend down the east coast over time. With more 'high' tidal forcing onto/into Barents the 'low' tidal forcing has to draw more Arctic waters south this in turn must be replenished by the next high so unless some atmospheric forcing brings a halt to the process, the Atlantic penetration towards Banks will accelerate and with it the flow through to Baffin/Foxe. Implicit in this process is the loss of any thick ice 'resident' or arriving on/in the CAA coastchannels and an increasingly free c/wise rotation of the ice.
The Atlantic water flowing through Barents and onwards towards Chukchi finally slows and settles mainly in Makorov basin but Chukchi abyssal plain too, and from here a return flow moves in the direction of Fram, i think this flow caused the thinning near the pole around the 22nd and a similar but more pronounced thinning will occur around the 5th and subsequent thinning will occur on the 'Fram' side of the pole.
The smoothness of some of the coastlines of the channels through CAA suggest deep permafrost which will also suffer from erosion as the passing currents rises above 0c.

31
Arctic sea ice / Re: Tides
« on: May 28, 2020, 12:07:42 AM »
Figured out how to expand the hycomsss without ruining all detail. This could go in 'waves' too but I'm looking at the tidal 'effects' here the interference waves generated by deep water movements washing up against Lomonosov [imho]

 short read for anyone interested https://syrte.obspm.fr/jsr/journees2014/pdf/Sidorenkov.pdf

32
Arctic sea ice / Re: Arctic Ocean salinity, temperature and waves
« on: May 19, 2020, 11:18:02 AM »
itp94 gives some indication that there may be a [+/- 3 day resonance] standing wave in the depths of Amundsen, it shows more strongly in the occasional alternative T+S contours image 
I'm guessing that these waves, if that's what we're seeing, would bounce back off the shelves giving us cross waves and 'point' surface melt where they cross close to 900.
 These are from the far end of the basin and it may be that the waves are moving in opposite directions through one another?

33
Cloud free from EO

34
Arctic sea ice / Re: 2020 Melting Season Predictions
« on: May 16, 2020, 01:49:57 PM »
Further to ^11, the high has been pushing near surface waters through Fram fairly rapidly, the easiest route for flow is aligned with Amundsen basin and from the other side of Lomonosv between 140E-180 so a remote possibility of a +[near] pole hole. Come tuesday we should see Amundsen gulf begin to clear and that forcing in turn push the ice towards Chukchi, then any thick ice along the CAA sucked into Beaufort over the following days.
ATM the incoming AW looks like it'll head towards both Kara and Ellesmere

35
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2020 melting season
« on: May 15, 2020, 11:46:10 AM »
It can't be because of the current, can it? That would be a strong current... So could it be "suction" from a retreating Ice pack? I can't figure it out...
My take is that the dipole, high mslp over practically the whole basins area has persisted for long enough to force water out of Fram. The easiest fraction to move is the layer beneath that held still by the ice keels but that upper layer with the ice also seems to be moving generally towards Fram. The losses will be exaggerated by tidal forcings meaning that excess has to be replaced from somewhere so Atlantic waters deep through Fram and via Barents into St.Anna>Laptev and Pacific waters via Bering.
Some of the papers/presentations recently linked by Nukefix are relevant to this well worth the time.

36
The politics / Re: Economic Inequality
« on: May 12, 2020, 12:12:12 AM »

37
Full flood, some retreat east on the north front and a large calving on the glacier proper, nothing left of the blockages so the summer season begins.

from polarview
+ previous image From EO [5th i think]

38
The politics / Re: Economic Inequality
« on: May 09, 2020, 10:19:47 PM »
"Neofeudalism is also a steady-state economy—one in which growth is essentially nil or close to it—but characterized not by some harmonious socially sustaining socioeconomic life ... a handful of distinct—if almost certainly overlapping—surplus populations: First, a massive number of socioeconomically expendable people (no longer needed for the basic stable reproduction of the sated and well-off) who face direct, permanent ecological adversity ... second, an over-large body—also facing severe economic and ecological constriction—of what one might term “neoserfs”: people who work in basic production and extraction, maintenance, and non-essential service functions. In between these groups and a ruling class would be a third mass: loyal retainers, if you will. Those who perform high level services, especially governance and security."
A great fear I do have is that we shall slip unaware into the same amoral society that the social insects have gamed themselves into and it will be the end of all hope for what may have been an enlightened future. The above describes it to perfection.

39
Consequences / Re: COVID-19
« on: May 09, 2020, 10:02:41 PM »
Being ignorant of IT I have no means to judge the veracity of this, https://lockdownsceptics.org/code-review-of-fergusons-model/

and it's conclusion "Conclusions. All papers based on this code should be retracted immediately. Imperial’s modelling efforts should be reset with a new team that isn’t under Professor Ferguson, and which has a commitment to replicable results with published code from day one. "

<removed FB spy tag. kassy>

40
Consequences / Re: COVID-19
« on: May 06, 2020, 01:11:35 PM »

41
The politics / Re: The American Progressive Movement
« on: May 05, 2020, 11:42:31 AM »
I guess this is as good as anywhere to post this, Ventura for president? https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2020/05/jesse-ventura-could-pose-a-greater-threat-than-biden-or-the-democrats-believe.html
"OK, I've decided I'm going to test the waters. IF I were going to run for president, the GREEN party would be my first choice. I've endorsed the party and I'm testing the waters." 

42


Trailer/clips for "We need to talk about AI" out soon.

43
Arctic sea ice / Re: "Stupid" Questions :o
« on: May 02, 2020, 11:18:00 PM »
Twice I've asked a stupid question about salt and ice, well here are two answers
"Although the hydration process gives off heat, this is more than compensated for by the heat absorbed during the initial decomposition of the salt into ions. In other words, the total process of dissolution--decomposition into ions plus hydration--absorbs heat. This can easily be demonstrated: pour some water into a glass and test its temperature with your finger. Add some salt, stir, and test it again. The temperature will have decreased.

The actual reason that the application of salt causes ice to melt is that a solution of water and dissolved salt has a lower freezing point than pure water. When added to ice, salt first dissolves in the film of liquid water that is always present on the surface, thereby lowering its freezing point below the ices temperature. Ice in contact with salty water therefore melts, creating more liquid water, which dissolves more salt, thereby causing more ice to melt, and so on. The higher the concentration of dissolved salt, the lower its overall freezing point. There is a limit, however, to the amount of salt that can be dissolved in water. Water containing a maximum amount of dissolved salt has a freezing point of about zero degrees Fahrenheit. Therefore, the application of salt will not melt the ice on a sidewalk if the temperature is below zero degrees F.

To understand why water containing dissolved salt has a lower freezing point than pure water, consider that when ice and water are in contact there is a dynamic exchange at the interface of the two phase states. Because of thermal vibrations in the ice, a large number of molecules per second become detached from its surface and enter into the water. During the same period of time, a large number of water molecules attach themselves to the surface of the ice and become part of the solid phase. At higher temperatures, the former rate is faster than the latter and the ice melts. At lower temperatures the reverse is true. At the freezing point the two rates are equal. If salt is dissolved in the water, the rate of detachment of the ice molecules is unaffected but the rate at which water molecules attach to the ice surface is decreased, mainly because the concentration of water molecules in the liquid (molecules per cubic centimeter) is lower. Hence, the melting point is lower.

John Margrave, a chemistry professor at Rice University, explains.

All icy surfaces in fact contain small puddles of water. Because salt is soluble in water, salt applied to such surfaces dissolves. Liquid water has what is known as a high dielectric constant, which allows the ions in the salt (positively charged sodium and negatively charged chlorine) to separate. These ions, in turn, react with water molecules and hydrate that is, form hydrated ions (charged ions joined to water molecules). This process gives off heat, because hydrates are more stable than the individual ions. That energy then melts microscopic parts of the ice surface. Thus a substantial amount of salt spread over a large surface can actually thaw the ice. In addition, if you drive over the ice in your automobile, the pressure helps force the salt into the ice and more of this hydration occurs." from https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-do-we-put-salt-on-icy/
Also found out that 00F is the coldest you can make water by adding salt.
So I'm assuming that airborne salt from waves splashing seawater into the air as leads open and close will be carried some small distance before settling on ice, that ice then has an enhanced 'wet' signature until the cold dry arctic ice reduces its temperature by evaporation to somewhat below 255K [00F] 235K? https://go.nasa.gov/3bYLMsX

44
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2020 melting season
« on: May 02, 2020, 12:30:01 AM »
'stretched' I agree the low though not powerful was huge and slowed the movement of water towards Fram if it was far enough away. If the water flowed back we should see an opening forming in Laptev soon, otherwise the stretching should continue for a couple of days. 
Local buoy https://www.whoi.edu/page.do?pid=165636

45
Arctic sea ice / Re: Tides
« on: May 01, 2020, 11:28:18 AM »
A cut and slowed version of the current Hycom animation 0804-0705

I'm thinking the openings in the upper left quarter are caused by internal waves generated by tidally driven waters falling into Nansen from St. Anna. Some hint of them are present on the salinity gif but anything i try to enhance it destroys detail so best looked at as is, looking [zoomed in] at the 150E-pole line, and whilst it's open noting the increasing salinity across the CAAs Arctic coastline.
+
Plus a close up from 28:04

46
The politics / Re: Economic Inequality
« on: April 29, 2020, 12:28:45 PM »
Here's a meme to digest,
PROGRAMMED US ENSLAVEMENT IN THE LATE 1910’s
In a private meeting with Woodrow Wilson (US President 1913 – 1921), Colonel Edward Mandell House predicted the banksters’ plans to enslave the American people. He stated:

“Very soon, every American will be required to register their biological property in a national system
designed to keep track of the people and that will operate under the ancient system of pledging.
By such methodology, we can compel people to submit to our agenda, which will affect our security
as a charge back for our fiat paper currency.

Every American will be forced to register or suffer being able to work and earn a living.
They will be our chattels (property) and we will hold the security interest over them forever, by operation of the law merchant under the scheme of secured transactions. Americans, by unknowingly or unwittingly delivering the bills of lading (Birth Certificate) to us will be rendered bankrupt and insolvent, secured by their pledges.

They will be stripped of their rights and given a commercial value designed to make us a profit and
they will be none the wiser, for not one man in a million could ever figure our plans and, if by accident one or two should figure it out, we have in our arsenal plausible deniability.
After all, this is the only logical way to fund government, by floating liens and debts to the registrants in the form of benefits and privileges.

This will inevitably reap us huge profits beyond our wildest expectations and leave every American a
contributor to this fraud, which we will call “Social Insurance.” Without realizing it, every American will unknowingly be our servant, however begrudgingly. The people will become helpless and without any
hope for their redemption and we will employ the high office of our dummy corporation [ USA] to foment
this plot against America.”

http://abundanthope.net/pages/True_US_History_108/Colonel_Edward_Mandell_House_
Predicts_the_Creation_3153.shtml
and for those who missed Smedley Butlers 'war is a racket' memo
https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2020/04/max-blumenthal-and-ben-norton-with-michael-hudson-how-the-us-makes-countries-pay-for-its-wars-economics-of-american-imperialism.html

47
Arctic sea ice / Re: 2020 Melting Season Predictions
« on: April 29, 2020, 10:36:56 AM »
I'm thinking the major consequence of increasing tidal action is greater recycling of Arctic waters south, if the flow of water south through Fram forces inflows from the Pacific then Beaufort will cycle anti[counter] clockwise and free up the channels of the CAA allowing the release of much of the freshwater lens. If the forcing is of Atlantic waters then these will cycle through to the ESS and a river of weak ice will move towards the pole from there, but this will induce more water from the Atlantic to flow south towards Banks is. again risking opening up the channels through the CAA. I'm hoping that this will occur too late to be important.

48
Greenland and Arctic Circle / Re: Greenland 2020 Melting Season
« on: April 29, 2020, 10:18:03 AM »
Given that it's timed at noon why are the shaded areas showing more melt? Dry north wind? Sublimation?

49
Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2020 melting season
« on: April 26, 2020, 09:29:03 PM »
Beaufort ice is shattered, won't hold a crack just spreads out, which implies it's very fluid.

50
Arctic sea ice / Re: "Stupid" Questions :o
« on: April 24, 2020, 01:35:54 PM »
Sunshine? small amount of heating from current? small hollow caused by wind action on 'string'? water running down 'string?

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