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Messages - nanning

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The rest / Re: The off topic off topic thread
« on: February 11, 2021, 06:43:35 AM »
A taste of humour from Friesland (Fryslân).

The rest / Re: Good music
« on: January 07, 2021, 10:06:13 AM »
In memoriam:

Gerry Rafferty - Baker Street (1978)

The rest / Re: Good music
« on: January 07, 2021, 10:03:26 AM »
For wili (a really nice and good guy)
pity about the bad sync but funny video (good spliffs?))

Gerrit Dekzeil - Ik Ben Gerrit (nl) (1973)

This is also one of my current favourites:

Ricky Nelson - Poor Little Fool (1958)

The rest / Re: Good music
« on: January 07, 2021, 09:54:09 AM »
Posting a couple of songs I really like but your mileage may vary ;)

The Cats - Marian (1969)

This is one of my current favourites:

Don Gibson - Oh Lonesome Me (1958)

The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: January 07, 2021, 09:09:28 AM »
oren, blumenkraft wants you to know that he appreciates it and wishes you a great and happy 2021.

The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: January 01, 2021, 04:21:50 PM »
kassy, you may not understand this but blumenkraft is a friend of mine. Yes, abstract as all of you are. Still, I will act on my well-developed-but-not-perfect senses and do the right thing. Hell, what is this about kassy? I repeat my question; Do you have a heart?

edit: typo

The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: January 01, 2021, 04:18:22 PM »
greylib, as many good posts though you've made, this one is not a good one. You've completely missed the human side and are not helping in any way. I'm having thoughts that this particular post could very well be seen as harassment of blumenkraft. Why? Do you have no heart?

The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: January 01, 2021, 09:34:38 AM »
Thank you for your concerns gentle men and gentle ladies.
Below is the text he wrote to me last Sunday. This is all I know. I have never been on reddit.

Dear blumenkraft, I have not asked your permission for quoting this but I presume that you don't have a problem with it.
I have sent you above post of mine and the responses yesterday evening but have not had an email by you, and I think that this is important. I am concerned about your health and what's happening to you now is completely unacceptable. My wish is that some asif members have a better way of finding out who those people might be. If you have more information, please share with me and I'll post it here.

PS: Ah, BTW, i'm getting harassed and bullied on Reddit by ASIF members. Telling me
the ASIF is better off without me, that i'm a commie cunt and stuff like that.  It's
multiple accounts. It could be one person with multiple accounts, but given the
writing style it's at least two people for what i can tell. Happens quite regularly
recently. I always block the account when it happens, but they keep popping up.
Was there any discussion about me recently?

The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: December 31, 2020, 10:47:21 AM »
I am here to report some worrying news from blumenkraft.
He writes that he is being harassed on reddit by asif members. He has closed accounts multiple times to get rid of the harassing.

My friend blumenkraft is already wrestling with depression since recent brain surgery and the passing away of his beloved cat.
What some asif members are doing to blumenkraft is more than very nasty; it is detrimental to his health.

I don't know which members are doing this but will you pretty please stop with harassing blumenkraft. Please!

The rest / Re: The off topic off topic thread
« on: December 28, 2020, 06:23:07 AM »
I register all kinds of data. It's a daily routine.

About my personal consumption.
Meat and dairy totals for 2020:
Milk (L)10.000
Cow (Kg)8.548
Pig (Kg)9.271
Chicken (Kg)0.000
Cheese (Kg)18.062

All meat and dairy come from organic farms from animals that are treated and fed according to organic rules.

No soya; no pesticides; no anti-biotics; no growth hormones; no gen-tech; more outside and self-feeding/foraging; biodiverse; a little bit more expensive but even I can afford it. It is no more than a matter of priority and my conscience sets the priorities within my limits of expenditure. Organic meat too expensive or not for sale?-> no meat consumption for me.

Today I'm going to cook a cow's tongue from Herefort cattle at a nature reserve (

P.S. Thank you Bruce for your nice words. The techno crowd externalizes parts of the complete carbon footprint of their technology imo. Toys indeed.

Edit: added "parts of" in last sentence as correction

The rest / Re: The off topic off topic thread
« on: December 24, 2020, 04:27:57 PM »
Have a good Christmas time everybody! (apart from the trolls/disturbers) :)

The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: November 05, 2020, 06:00:39 AM »
Good morning.
Yesterday I wrote
 "If this still stands tomorrow, I'll make a stand and will peacefully protest by not participating for a while. If I can find the motivation again."  - referring to Alexander555's post in the COVID-19 thread.

I see that it still stands. This is no place for me any longer.


The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: November 04, 2020, 11:31:52 AM »
"For some reason no one just reported the post"

I did 'report to moderator'. A couple of minutes before my post above.
And I share with you the surprise that no one else reported it.

Enough is the moment when non-flaming non-moaning people feel 'uncomfortable' with the fighting and flaming and accusing and name-calling and nigh on constant moaning. Some 'pruning' needs to be done to put out the flames. There are always more trolls than one thinks. Because this is a high-level site about science and truth, the trolls are more sophisticated. I expect some of them to have an expert team in the background. Nobody can check if it is the forummember that posesses the knowledge.

Let run free, evil always wins. Lies are stronger than truth. It's so much easier to destroy than to construct. Be vigilant and strict.
You know this saying kassy "zachte heelmeesters maken stinkende wonden" ;).

The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: November 04, 2020, 10:12:33 AM »
Good morning.

This was posted by Alexander555 in the COVID-19 thread:
(bolding by me)
"We have a tread about a drug addicted violent homejacker like George Phloyed[sic]"

This was allowed to stand . . . . . . .
But I cannot stand it being allowed to stand as someone who has posted in the George Floyd thread and stands firmly with the oppressed. I'd thought that I was not alone.

If this still stands tomorrow, I'll make a stand and will peacefully protest by not participating for a while. If I can find the motivation again.

kassy I believe that you are the moderator of the COVID-19 thread. Your level of morality and justice shines through in your moderating acts. I find it shocking that you think that the quoted sentence is okay on this forum. In this way YOU select the forummembers. The moaners and flames stay and the silent good ones leave. This has nothing to do with my appreciation of the other efforts you put in as moderator and contributor. I don't think that you're bad as a person, nothing like that is intended.

See how a couple of emotionally- and personality-challenged members are taking up so much of your time (and ours) and effort and lower the general tone, readbility and quality of the forum by doing that. When someone is on a third try, I would be much harder on them and not allow any transgressions or it is into the corner again. Why not ask Neven for help with moderating issues? He's experienced here and you could learn from him.

Without naming them as trolls specifically (but I believe they are, difficult to explain here), their behaviour is very succesfull in destabilising the site and dragging the fiends-feelings down; invoking emotions and people taking sides and more.

I'm still disgusted by Alexander's post.

Science / Re: Carbon Cycle
« on: November 04, 2020, 08:54:33 AM »
Geoff, that twitter thread has made it to the Guardian:

Shell’s climate poll on Twitter backfires spectacularly

Oil giant accused of gaslighting after asking users: ‘What are you willing to change?’

Sorry for off-topic

Consequences / Re: COVID-19
« on: November 04, 2020, 08:41:37 AM »
<Off Topic. kassy>

Science / Re: Carbon Cycle
« on: November 03, 2020, 07:54:01 AM »
Geoff, in my opinion the 'budget' is already empty.
I refer to the many tipping points, but also to interglacial paleoclimate records that show ca. +3°C for 410ppm CO2 GHG and that's without CH4 & N20  (and ca.20m SLR).

All of this FF anthropogenic CO2 is of course from outside the long-term carbon cycle.

The rest / Re: Good music
« on: November 03, 2020, 06:54:29 AM »
Gary Numan - Cars (1979)


The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: November 03, 2020, 06:41:32 AM »
I'm with be cause on this.

COVID-19 thread

kassy, I don't understand why Archimids posts are deleted moderated and the racist abusive lying post by A555h*le Alexander555 stays, of which you yourself posted that it was hogwash and politics.

Can you please explain the discrimination?

Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2020/2021 freezing season
« on: November 03, 2020, 06:07:02 AM »
BornFromTheVoid, many thanks for your great graphs.
Information; axes; legend; readability; colourchoices; map inset; context; consequence.. my compliments. (I'm not an expert)
Uniquorn, the way you're going you'll be a master soon imo.
Postive retroaction, thanks, that list of extremes made me stop to think.

Science / Re: Carbon Cycle
« on: November 03, 2020, 05:24:59 AM »
How much extra global heating would that produce?
How much extra soil carbon would be emitted by that extra global heating?
Etcetera...   Oh hey hellooo, look who's here to help out... Lord Methane! And he's brought his little friend Rev. Albedo.

The rest / Re: The off topic off topic thread
« on: November 03, 2020, 05:11:38 AM »
A consequence of forementioned fundamental rule of living nature, regarding:



You may think that you are attacked, but in reality you aren't.

Being inconvenienced and/or irrationally fearful is not the same as being attacked. And your life is not in danger.

A wasp can't kill you and a wasp will never attack you if it's not attacked first.

Bon Appétit :)

P.S. This also goes for mosquitoes etc.

Permafrost / Re: Permafrost general science thread
« on: November 03, 2020, 04:57:01 AM »
The Observer / Archaeology
Secrets of the ice: unlocking a melting time capsule

This is Important imo.

In a year when the unthinkable has become the everyday, when profound changes to lifestyle, economy, travel, ambition and health have been forced upon billions of us by a tiny virus, at a time when science has trumped even the most bombastic rhetoric, it is surely important to stop and reflect on the environmental consequences of our prior economic model. We may soon look back on the Covid-19 pandemic as the good old days before climate change raced away from us.

Will we soon be swapping our smartphones for atlatl, those ingenious ancient spear-throwing devices? It’s too soon to say, but archaeologists have the luxury of a very long view.

“Technological advancement is not permanent. It can fluctuate back and forth,” says Jarman. “We’ve seen that happen throughout human history, and it would be hubris to think that it couldn’t happen again,” he says. “I hope that if it does, that is because we have intentionally managed a soft landing, choosing sustainable technology because we want to, and we know it’s the right thing to do, rather than being forced into it.”

Science / Re: 2020 Mauna Loa CO2 levels
« on: November 02, 2020, 12:32:00 PM »
Tom, in my opinion this is trolling behaviour by you.

The rest / Re: The off topic off topic thread
« on: November 02, 2020, 12:29:07 PM »
Interesting Ranman99.

  "Anyway. It's raining here ;-) Can't go out and play!"

Why not? What's wrong with rain? ;)

Could you please explain what you mean by "getting out of 'development'"?

And re: postulate how and in what order the mammals will (all) go extinct. That seems morbid and detached to me. Perhaps I misunderstood.

You could also start with postulating how and in what order all the poor humans will die from the rich countries' Climate Change and callous consumption. Perhaps enjoy yourselves with a nice poll. ;)

All the ice may melt but the hearts of rich people remain frozen.
They'd rather have poor people and non-iconic wildlife die than make deep personal sacrifices to their consumption.
(o no no no it's the governments that need to change first... Ah. Nice. Kicking the can down the road of personal responsibility.)
Am I coming through?... I seem to be having a bad connection. Any advise on that?

The rest / Re: Good music
« on: November 02, 2020, 09:39:10 AM »
Elvis Presley - That's All Right (1954)


The rest / Re: The off topic off topic thread
« on: November 02, 2020, 09:23:37 AM »
As a follow-up on my previous posts in this context.


All prey species behave as prey. Prey do not purposely kill 'their' predators.
A predator will not purposely kill another predator except perhaps for territorial disputes or if one is prey to the other.


Observation: Birds can have some inter species communication. That is really something totally unexpected and mind boggling.


If life form = Plantae

"Killing a life form on purpose and not eat it"-rule doesn't seem to hold for 'it' being plants, e.g. elephants pushing over living trees in Africa.

If someone has anything to add or comment, please do.

Consequences / Re: COVID-19
« on: November 02, 2020, 08:29:29 AM »
Glad you're out of hospital Jim. Advise: stay away from election news as it will be hard on your heart.

The Netherlands

You'd say that they learned their lesson from the first wave and would have immediately taken action at the end of September. I've been surprised for over a month by the lack of action. Now the 2nd wave is larger than the first. Perhaps they have adopted 'massaging the death numbers'? We have no independent institutes.

Arctic sea ice / Re: The 2020/2021 freezing season
« on: November 01, 2020, 06:54:55 AM »
I have been lurking and not contributing for a while, and not expert enough to contribute to the cryosphere threads, but I have with much interest followed the past weeks here and especially the posts by A-Team; Glen Koehler; FishOutofWater; aslan; BornFromTheVoid and others as well.
I much appreciate the high quality discussions and science! Many thanks.   Please don't trip over the trolls
Apologies for not 'giving anything back'.

Consequences / Re: COVID-19
« on: October 28, 2020, 09:52:04 AM »
Quote from: Shared Humanity
routinely connect with the homeless along the commercial district and direct them to emergency services. As a white man, I have lived a life of privilege, the kind of privilege that all white men benefit from in the U.S. I decided to use the last 15 years of my professional life giving back to the city that I love.

Dear Shared Humanity, you set a great example  :-*. I deeply respect your life decision. You must be a good human. And you likely get something in return as well, albeit not money but far more important 'things'.

The rest / Re: Good music
« on: October 27, 2020, 06:22:54 AM »

To Terry and Blumenkraft

The Three Degrees - When Will I See You Again (1978)


The Three Degrees - Take Good Care Of Yourself (1975)

The rest / Re: Systemic Isolation
« on: October 26, 2020, 12:30:16 PM »
Without providing proof: We are not living in a 'simulation'.
I am certain of it (having analysed this before) but don't know yet how to put it in words.

(hmm.. Heisenberg's uncertainty principle & necessary information for simulation. (geological) history. living nature outside the 'simulation'. motivation. civilisation behaviour. energy use of simulation. incompatibilities of individual brains. infants. impossible technology level (by whom and from where?). and more)

It's almost as if they're looking for a new modern type of 'God' in stead of reality.
Hey Elon Musk, you should stop reading science fiction books and stop watching science fiction movies. They're fiction and so are your dreams ;)

Consequences / Re: Places becoming less livable
« on: October 26, 2020, 12:03:35 PM »
From article above: "Geology’s human footprint is enough to spur rage"   (my bolding)

Correction: Geology’s civlisation-human footprint is enough to spur rage

Sorry to keep repeating this, but it is an important distinction!

The rest / Re: Good music
« on: October 26, 2020, 11:20:03 AM »
Thanks wili. I guess I'm not 'everybody' :)

This is imo a beautiful version with a nice beat.

The Beat - Can't Get Used To Losing You (1983)


The rest / Re: The off topic off topic thread
« on: October 25, 2020, 08:29:39 AM »
Thanks PragmaticAntithesis :). Very good to read that he's had fun times.

The forum / Re: Forum Decorum
« on: October 24, 2020, 09:07:21 AM »
Thanks FishOutofWater for picking that up.
Just to be clear to some readers, you were sarcasticly joking in your first paragraph.

The rest / Re: Good music
« on: October 23, 2020, 07:11:20 AM »
Another one from Australia and an instrumental from Boralia.

John Farnham - Age Of Reason (1988)



Roger Williams - Autumn Leaves (i) (1955)


The rest / Re: The off topic off topic thread
« on: October 23, 2020, 06:51:47 AM »
It is not my "view of nature". It is how living nature operates.
Your idea of what the "real world" is, is incorrect. The 'harsh reality' for living nature is civilisation's total destruction.

The 'world context' is the context of living nature, not the context of humans. Civilisation humans exhibit absolute supremacy, domination and control over all other life...    even over their own females

"in the name of ecology"
yes of course, the ecology of how humans want living nature to be. Killing other lifeforms not for food but to 'correct' errors humans made, having degraded it themselves by bringing the invasive species in the first place. And still new invasive species are brought in. You call that sanity?

A conseqence of forementioned rule and of concern to humans is:

  Omnivore prey animals don't purposely kill a predator that's larger than them

So to e.g. kill a bear for its skin is not living nature behaviour, i.e. not sane.
We should have gone south when it got cold.

I have to be careful to differentiate between humans and civilisation humans. Together they are humanity

Consequences / Re: Places becoming more livable
« on: October 22, 2020, 10:50:13 AM »
In the analyses above I miss some important factors (some are mentioned):
    Accelerating biosphere/ecosystems collapse; mass extinctions, insectageddon, habitat loss, pollution etc.

It is not just us that wants to move to a safer livable place. All of living nature that can't move fast enough will vanish.
Microplastics will have large negative consequences on all kinds of animals, from small to large.
Continued use of biocides is not helping either.
The oceanic/inland seas' 'dead zones' are fast increasing.
Corals are dying/going extinct with ever increasing ocean temps.

What kind of 'ecosystem services' will remain functional?
It is an immense interconnected system of mutual dependencies. Ecosystem collapse will beyond some point become an avalance, one after the other will disappear once the core interconnected structure is gone (redundancy gone).

Weather extremes are increasing fast it seems, going by the past 5 years. No stable climate anymore.

Then of course there need to be houses and infrastructure and (poor) people to do the menial tasks in the favored new place.  Is the country perhaps a target for war? And the destination country needs to welcome you and not send you back/enprison you!

So I guess that it also largely depends on your 'net worth'.

I think that all the proposed 'solutions' are only for the same happy few richest percents that are mainly responsible for the destruction throughout history and today.
I search in vain for some responsibility, guilt (conscience) and empathy by rich people (let's say income >$50000).

I am poor on purpose and stand with the unheeded vulnerable majority.
Those who are about to die, greet you ;)

The rest / Re: The off topic off topic thread
« on: October 22, 2020, 09:37:42 AM »
I amended the fundamental rule. Thank you for your posts. They extended my analysis and understanding.

  If you kill a lifeform on purpose, you or your tribe have to eat at least part of it.
  i.e. Killing on purpose is for food only.

N.B.: Infants are not part of living nature yet. They are fed by others.
         Infanticide is part of evlution by natural selection.

Tom, you should read the book I mentioned and it will become clearer.
Remember that there were once lions in Europe. It was not climate change that did it.

Taking more than you need...
Commerce... Profit...
Complete supremacy and disregard for all other life...
People long ago wrote an important book that said that everything belongs to humans...  For the taking...

Very good El Cid :)

We have a Netherlandic saying that goes "dweilen met de kraan open", English translation: "mopping with the faucet open".

Consequences / Re: COVID-19
« on: October 21, 2020, 06:53:34 AM »
Dear gerontocrat, thank you for all the informative graphs. If you have the time would you be willing to create your graphs for The Netherlands?

The Netherlands has ca. 8500 new cases per day now which is sort of the same as Italy, but Italy has 3.5 times as many inhabitants (60m vs 17.5m).

Many are sacrificed on the altar of GDP growth.


Congratulations to those living in New Zealand with the re-election of the great Mrs. Jacinda Ardern! The world envies you.

Policy and solutions / Re: Becoming Vegan
« on: October 21, 2020, 06:18:45 AM »
I'm curious, do 'vegans' eat scallops and mussels? Squid? Insects?

Thanks gero.

I've just re-read the first chapter of "The Unnatural History of the Sea" by Callum Roberts and it sketches the living nature that Europeans found in North-America when they first got there.

The descriptions from sailors at that time show a living nature so mind-bogglingly rich as to be hardly believable. Those Europeans couldn't believe their eyes, literally. Already the native american 'indians' lived there for thousands of years of course and living nature was not in any way visibly disturbed.
The Europeans/Settlers destroyed all the riches in about 200 years by taking as much as they could, and then some.

The 'Garden of Eden'.

Gone. Everywhere. Even under water. Wetiko's total destruction.
Such an immense grief comes over me.

 :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

The rest / Re: Good music
« on: October 21, 2020, 05:53:07 AM »
Such a beautiful melody and lyrics. Dutch lyrics below the video.

Helga - Niemand Heeft Je Ooit Gezien (nl) (1972)

Niemand heeft je ooit gezien
Maar toch ben je van mij
Niemand heeft je ooit gezien
Maar toch ben je bij mij
Ik wist het allereerst van jouw bestaan
Je bent vlakbij maar ver nog hier vandaan
Niemand heeft je ooit gezien
Maar toch ben je bij mij
Hier onder mijn hart begint jouw leven
Hier onder mijn hart groeit het geluk
Jouw jonge leven en mijn geluk

Niemand heeft je ooit gezien
Nog niemand die je kent
Niemand weet of jij een jongen of een meisje bent
Al is je vader een knappe man
Hier weet hij toch het fijne nog niet van
Niemand heeft je ooit gezien
Nog niemand die je kent
Heel geduldig moet ik op je wachten
Maar ik tel de dagen met een lach
Ja ik zal wachten maar met een lach
Niemand heeft je stem gehoord
Maar ik heb je verstaan
Alles wat mij toebehoort
Dat is voor jouw bestaan

Je brengt me onrust en je brengt me vree
Maar wat je brengt daar heb ik vrede mee
Nu zing ik nog eenmaal en dan moet je slapen gaan

The rest / Re: Good music
« on: October 20, 2020, 08:12:29 AM »
Slim Dusty - A Pub With No Beer (1957)
"Dusty was considered an Australian National Treasure."


Consequences / Re: Places becoming more livable
« on: October 20, 2020, 07:23:35 AM »
I agree harpy, but I think it is not a "purely emotional impulse".
It is no more than what you're 'supposed' to do; what is 'normal'.
If you don't have children you are the odd one out.
Because it is step 4 of the short standard life-menu of civilisation culture, after step 1 "formal education and forced change into a grown-up"; step 2 "find job"; step 3 "find partner and engage in long-term bond".
Step 5 "material accumulation and career-ladder progress" (which has nothing to do with a real life); step 6 "Pension".
Most of these things are choices but not seen as such.

Apologies for off-topic.

Policy and solutions / Re: If not Capitalism... then What? And, How?
« on: October 20, 2020, 06:51:10 AM »
"are worth"...   this is the problem

One of those 50 rich people is thus 'worth' as much as 3300000 poor people. Do you think this is sanity?
(not addressing gerontocrat)

Policy and solutions / Re: Renewable Energy
« on: October 18, 2020, 10:02:31 AM »
The best renewable energy type is to use less energy.
Imagine if everybody did that in the rich countries. But I guess that you want even MORE  ::).

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