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Cato

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #600 on: November 09, 2017, 02:07:31 PM »
Surprise is a personal thing, just like confirmation bias.




gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #601 on: November 09, 2017, 03:12:52 PM »
JAXA DATA
Extent gain slows down, speeds up, but overall remains close to the 10 year average.
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Daniel B.

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #602 on: November 09, 2017, 03:55:18 PM »
Surprise is a personal thing, just like confirmation bias.

Sometimes that latter must be overcome in order to accept the former.

Cato

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #603 on: November 09, 2017, 04:03:54 PM »
Surprise is a personal thing, just like confirmation bias.

Sometimes that latter must be overcome in order to accept the former.

Amen

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #604 on: November 09, 2017, 04:36:23 PM »

Personally, my subjective expectation was for milder temperatures, because I thought the low September ice concentration would enhance heat flux. That effect slowly died off from mid October, so I'm surprised.


Very large positive temperature anomalies continue to stubbornly refuse to 'slowly die off'. We are looking at anomalies that are 15C to 20C warmer than average across large portions of the basin.

Seven day forecast shows the large positive anomalies weakening over Pacific side of the basin the next few days only to be re-enforced by a burst of warm Pacific air and strengthening again.

http://cci-reanalyzer.org/wx/fcst/#GFS-025deg.ARC-LEA.T2_anom

Pavel

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #605 on: November 09, 2017, 08:16:03 PM »
Up to 20 degrees anomaly looks impressive. North of 80 latitude temperatures are relatively cold but the ice is already thick there to cause rapid bottom growth. Also this ice is prone to leave the basin due to the increased Fram export. Anyway what we'll get finally we'll see in the PIOMAS and Cryosat data

Brigantine

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #606 on: November 09, 2017, 09:22:46 PM »
Very large positive temperature anomalies continue to stubbornly refuse to 'slowly die off'.

Right. It would be better described by "retreat beyond 80N". North of 80N is not a particularly large area, but one forgets that easily following the DMI graph.

gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #607 on: November 10, 2017, 01:10:26 PM »

Very large positive temperature anomalies continue to stubbornly refuse to 'slowly die off'. We are looking at anomalies that are 15C to 20C warmer than average across large portions of the basin.

Seven day forecast shows the large positive anomalies weakening over Pacific side of the basin the next few days only to be re-enforced by a burst of warm Pacific air and strengthening again.

http://cci-reanalyzer.org/wx/fcst/#GFS-025deg.ARC-LEA.T2_anom

The very high positive temperature anomalies on the Atlantic and Pacific ends of the Arctic Ocean continue, BUT the extent gain per day has averaged 125k km2 over the last 5 days, well above average for the time of year. Perhaps I need an A-team to tell me what's going on. Extent gain heading south from the CAA ?
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Wipneus

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #608 on: November 10, 2017, 02:03:31 PM »
... what's going on. Extent gain heading south from the CAA ?

Here is a 7-day delta map, NSIDC NT sea ice concentration. Lots of (dark) blue shows where the extent gains are. Interesting there are also some small regions with reds both on the Atlantic and the Pacific side.

Dharma Rupa

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #609 on: November 10, 2017, 02:08:00 PM »
...Lots of (dark) blue shows where the extent gains are. Interesting there are also some small regions with reds both on the Atlantic and the Pacific side.

Looking more and more like WOCC (Warm Ocean Cold Continents) all the time.

gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #610 on: November 10, 2017, 03:19:15 PM »

Here is a 7-day delta map, NSIDC NT sea ice concentration. Lots of (dark) blue shows where the extent gains are. Interesting there are also some small regions with reds both on the Atlantic and the Pacific side.
Those red bits suggest that those high +ve temp anomalies are having some effect especially on the Pacific side in slowing / reducing the frrrreeeze.
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Feeltheburn

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #611 on: November 11, 2017, 06:22:23 AM »
If the Pacific side will remain warm SIE could get to the second place in November. The first place is also possible espessially if the big peripheral seas such as SoO and Hudson bay will delay freeze.

Currently 2017 is in 3rd place, but the difference between 2017 and other years is small enough that it could climb to 2nd or 1st, or conceivable even drop back down to 5th or 6th in a few days. November 9 According to NSIDC:

2017 - 9.103
2016 - 8.386**
2015 - 9.543
2014 - 9.648
2013 - 9.340*
2012 - 8.758**
2011 - 9.206*
2010 - 9.300*
2009 - 9.187*
2008 - 10.089
2007 - 9.401
2006 - 9.421
2003 - 9.607
2002 - 9.743
1998 - 9.945
1996 - 9.978

« Last Edit: November 11, 2017, 06:54:38 AM by Feeltheburn »
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Wipneus

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #612 on: November 11, 2017, 05:30:26 PM »
Update of the NSIDC NT extent and area graphs. A week of higher than average extent increases, with area just joining the spurt in the last couple of days.

Niall Dollard

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #613 on: November 11, 2017, 06:08:51 PM »
Seems to have shaken off that period of sluggish growth and pulled well away from 2007 and 2016. Zoning in on 2009 now.

This year flatters to deceive when you compare it with the poor growth this time last year (2017 is now two weeks ahead of 2016 in terms of extent).

In reality we still have a long way to go to get into the middle of the pack. Chukchi is still very slow. On the other hand Hudson is starting to make good progress - provided the very cold persists.

Feeltheburn

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #614 on: November 12, 2017, 04:02:34 AM »

Currently 2017 is in 3rd place, but the difference between 2017 and other years is small enough that it could climb to 2nd or 1st, or conceivable even drop back down to 5th or 6th in a few days. November 9 According to NSIDC:

2017 - 9.103
2016 - 8.386**
2015 - 9.543
2014 - 9.648
2013 - 9.340
2012 - 8.758**
2011 - 9.206*
2010 - 9.300
2009 - 9.187*


November 10 update According to NSIDC. In one day dropped from 3rd to 5th, passing up 2011 and 2009. Anything can happen in this horse race but I'm rooting for this year's horse to do well. With El Nino in the Pacific over, perhaps the Bering sea will cool off and permit more ice formation later this season. Extreme cold is freezing Siberian coast and Hudson Bay more rapidly now.

2017 - 9.263
2016 - 8.403**
2015 - 9.644
2014 - 9.663
2013 - 9.493
2012 - 8.794**
2011 - 9.188**
2010 - 9.373
2009 - 9.249**
2008 - 10.122
2007 - 9.469
2006 - 9.533
2005 - 9.936
2004 -10.052
2003 - 9.685
2002 - 9.852
2001 - 10.336
2000 - 9.939
1998 - 10.035
1996 - 9.978
« Last Edit: November 12, 2017, 04:08:53 AM by Feeltheburn »
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Feeltheburn

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #615 on: November 12, 2017, 04:15:09 AM »
Up to 20 degrees anomaly looks impressive. North of 80 latitude temperatures are relatively cold but the ice is already thick there to cause rapid bottom growth. Also this ice is prone to leave the basin due to the increased Fram export. Anyway what we'll get finally we'll see in the PIOMAS and Cryosat data

During the freezing season does Fram export mean that much? Is it really "export" or just guided freezing pattern along east coast of Greenland?
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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #616 on: November 12, 2017, 10:41:46 AM »
During the freezing season does Fram export mean that much? Is it really "export" or just guided freezing pattern along east coast of Greenland?

It depends on how thick the ice is that gets exported (think volume distribution).
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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #617 on: November 12, 2017, 02:48:00 PM »
November 10 update According to NSIDC. In one day dropped from 3rd to 5th, passing up 2011 and 2009. Anything can happen in this horse race but I'm rooting for this year's horse to do well. With El Nino in the Pacific over, perhaps the Bering sea will cool off and permit more ice formation later this season.

And...right back into third place with a far-below-average daily increase of just 29k.

Month-to-date, 2017 NSIDC SIE has grown by just 1.06M km2, hundreds of thousands less than 2016's MTD increase of 1.44M. Now that's a race...

Extreme cold is freezing Siberian coast and Hudson Bay more rapidly now.

One would think, right? After all, with fewer than 40 days to go until days starting getting longer again, even places as far south as just inside the Arctic Circle are seeing only a few hours of very slanted, very weak sunlight a day.

arctic-watcher

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #618 on: November 13, 2017, 07:36:37 AM »
Did JAXA extent just drop about 3,000 km2 or did I misread the chart ??   

gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #619 on: November 13, 2017, 12:02:21 PM »
Did JAXA extent just drop about 3,000 km2 or did I misread the chart ??
You did not misread the chart. "What a difference a day makes" 


JAXA DATA

Nov 12th extent is 9,000,108 km2, a drop of 2,771 km2. But as the graph below shows extent gain has been up and down like a yo-yo. Perhaps it is due to the persistent high +ve temp anomalies on the Atlantic and Pacific ends of the Arctic, in contrast with the temperatures at 80+ degrees north which are much lower than last year, though still slightly above average. This pattern seems as if it will persist for a few days.

With just under half of average extent gain already occurred, this person is not making any predictions.
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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #620 on: November 13, 2017, 01:03:53 PM »
I looked for several runs with cfs meteo and even of course it is way to long it seems to be in every run, that in a few wekks the hole arctic has really low temperatures and if you compare this whis the last years, maybe the pattern like mentioned.
Here is one example.




ATM we have this and we are allready below the average winter temperature the last year, way below, it seems like it get a bit warmer the next week, but like i said i dont  look for one run, i detected this cold pattern  in nearly every run, first it gets a bit warmer but then often times long periods of time with the darkes  coller.




The latest picture is really cold.




The european side seems to have bigger chances to see high temperatures, like here not so far.
Look at germany, this is a seldom cold weather in gerneral but even more true for Dezember.

« Last Edit: November 13, 2017, 01:18:33 PM by 2phil4u »

gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #621 on: November 16, 2017, 11:41:49 AM »
JAXA DATA

Herewith a graph on Jaxa extent from the JAXA site. Note how as December progresses the lines come together, simply reflecting that while September sea ice extent is declining at around 12.5% per decade, March sea ice extent is declining at merely 2.5% per decade.

The record low extent (and volume) this March made one think perhaps that winter sea ice loss just might be beginning to accelerate. No such indication this freezing season so far.
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Jim Pettit

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #622 on: November 16, 2017, 01:29:41 PM »
And a closer view of the same data:

JAXA Sea Ice Extent (Note: click on the image for the most recent version):



Still in third, anyway...

Hyperion

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #623 on: November 16, 2017, 08:29:04 PM »
But converging on 2012 at a rate that could see us in second in a week.
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Daniel B.

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #624 on: November 17, 2017, 04:39:15 PM »
But converging on 2012 at a rate that could see us in second in a week.

But third behind 2006.

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #625 on: November 17, 2017, 11:03:46 PM »
The years pinch together in Dec because after it's all frozen over, it's frozen all over. It's good to keep in mind what geographic region 'extent' refers to. Nothing wrong with using the whole Northern Hemisphere (or NH minus Great Lakes) but any definition beyond the Arctic Ocean proper swamps out what is going on there. Which is unfortunate since most of the knock-on effects (eg low albedo during insolation season) initiate there.

The boundaries taken below exclude the Bering Sea, CAA, the Fram and Nares Strait exports, and the Barents south of Novaya Zemlya's tip. It's more accurate to use open water in the much higher resolution UH AMSR2 sea ice concentration than some of the extent sources.  In the region shown, open water has been on a slight increase (suggesting AO extent is slightly decreasing). That's not attributable to melt or bulk ice pack motion but to compaction and export.

These latter considerations complicate monitoring of the freezing season progress per se. In terms of developing anomalies, it's probably better to follow ice thickness growth at RASM-ESRL or Piomas, in addition to snow thickness, snow/ice surface temperature, and open sea water temperatures in the Chukchi and north Svalbard areas (which show no sign of closing over). These could get tossed in with Arctic Amplification but that is usually taken as the overlying atmospheric anomaly relative to global mean temperature.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-13821-2 long history to intermediate water warming.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2017, 02:29:14 PM by A-Team »

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #626 on: November 18, 2017, 02:15:50 PM »
Thank you for this work, A-Team. So in the Arctic Ocean proper, there is a distinct probability of a repeat of last year lack of winter power, or something similar, that's interesting. A (slightly) positive anomaly of NH snow seems to be accompanying again, but how that snow retreats in spring, that is really unpredictable.

gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #627 on: November 19, 2017, 12:01:41 PM »
Jaxa off-line for three days. Problem??
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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #628 on: November 19, 2017, 02:48:50 PM »
These offline periods make me nervous that the asshats of Trumpistan govt are messing with truths they can't accept again. Probably not a problem, though. Maybe they're jusröt rightfully blocking idiots.

gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #629 on: November 19, 2017, 03:03:05 PM »
These offline periods make me nervous that the asshats of Trumpistan govt are messing with truths they can't accept again. Probably not a problem, though. Maybe they're jusröt rightfully blocking idiots.

JAXA is a Japanese operation. Trumpistan has not taken over -  yet.
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ael

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #630 on: November 19, 2017, 03:29:36 PM »
Jim,  I really like your graph.  However, the 2000's average is getting a little long in the tooth as a "current" baseline.  It would be nice to have a more recent aggregated average to compare against.

While you can't do a 2010's average yet, maybe you can add in a dashed line for the previous 10 years average.

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #631 on: November 19, 2017, 04:04:33 PM »
Quote
really like your graph.  However, the 2000's average is getting a little long in the tooth as a "current" baseline.  It would be nice to have a more recent aggregated average  can't do a 2010's average yet, maybe you can add in a dashed line for the previous 10 years average.
Or simply do all possible rolling 30 (or 20) year baselines, each as a frame of an animation, to show the sensitivity/robustness to choice of baseline. (This sounds like a lot of work but actually it isn't.)

The first animation below shows the average number of days of open water (based on UH AMSR2 6.25 km) from the September minimum until 18 Nov 17. There is a surprisingly large area that has never had open water during this time frame (gold) as well as substantial areas that never have had ice (blue). The contoured frames have 18 levels. The second animation shows open water vs ice (of any non-zero concentration) over this same time frame.

'Seasonally open' is too often left vague but often seems to refers to summer (or perhaps better, to 91 days of peak insolation centered on the June solstice) when reflection of sunlight becomes oceanic absorption of its heat.

However 'seasonally open' is perhaps more important in the fall because it can modulate radiative heat loss from the ocean and delay formation of a thermal blanket of snow, thus affecting thickening of ice and pre-conditioning of the following melt season. Because Arctic Amplification is primarily a fall and winter phenomenon, observed melt season trends are downstream (and even noisier because of highly variable spring and summer weather).
« Last Edit: November 19, 2017, 04:50:29 PM by A-Team »

oren

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #632 on: November 19, 2017, 10:55:38 PM »
Jim,  I really like your graph.  However, the 2000's average is getting a little long in the tooth as a "current" baseline.  It would be nice to have a more recent aggregated average to compare against.

While you can't do a 2010's average yet, maybe you can add in a dashed line for the previous 10 years average.
I would simply add a 2010-2016 average, I think it could be informative despite the sub-decadal data set.

Shared Humanity

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #633 on: November 19, 2017, 11:18:51 PM »
Jim,  I really like your graph.  However, the 2000's average is getting a little long in the tooth as a "current" baseline.  It would be nice to have a more recent aggregated average to compare against.

While you can't do a 2010's average yet, maybe you can add in a dashed line for the previous 10 years average.

It is a mistake to call the 2000's average a 'baseline' regardless of whether you attach the modifier 'current'.

Baseline: n: a line that is a base for measurement

Using the term correctly, even the 1990's average is not properly a baseline and calling it such could serve to obscure how badly things are deteriorating. Simply call it what it is, an average for a decade.

I am OK calling the 1980's average a baseline for this chart so long as we acknowledge that this 'baseline' does not, in fact, capture extent decline that had occurred prior to that decade.

ael

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #634 on: November 20, 2017, 03:21:54 AM »
I grant you that there might be a better word.

However, I was using baseline in the context of reading the graph to determine  an informal sort of "anomaly" reference reading.  Basically to see what is the extent compared to the "current-ish" state.  I am told that since 2007, the arctic sea ice is in a different "state".

Therefore, the 2000s average line doesn't really tell me what today's extent is when compared to current conditions.

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #635 on: November 20, 2017, 09:13:53 AM »
JAXA has updated, 2017 now in second place:
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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #636 on: November 20, 2017, 01:49:36 PM »
This year ice has extented much more in the Kara and Barents seas than last year. Also the Baffin bay freezes quicklier. The Hudson bay experienced the cold anomalies due the Jet Stream motion. But all of these areas are mostly peripheral, and we can see there's less ice in the Chuckchi sea than last year

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #637 on: November 20, 2017, 01:56:05 PM »
To second Neven:

JAXA Sea Ice Extent (Note: click on the image for the most recent version):



On another note: I always spend a few days near the start of the new year (slow at work) tweaking all my graphs and charts. I've read the suggestions for changing the baselines and so on; any changes incorporating those suggestions will be made public in early January.

Thanks!

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #638 on: November 20, 2017, 03:06:08 PM »
JAXA DATA at 19th November 2017

On 9th October Jaxa extent was 1.4 million km2 GREATER than 2012 extent at that date. As at 19th November 2017 extent is now some 40k km2 LESS than in 2012.

Extent is still just over 1 million km2 greater than 2016. This is due to the 2017 minimum being some 0.4 million km2 greater than in 2016, and that extent gain to date was 0.6 million km2 less in 2016 than in the current year. However last year saw further extent gain some 0.8 million km2 greater than the 10 year average.

The freezing season is just over 50% done as far as average extent gain is concerned, who knows where we will end up.
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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #639 on: November 20, 2017, 04:51:19 PM »
Chukchi seen closing in somewhat over the next week by ESRL (AlaskaRegion5.gif) with considerable swings in temperature (inset, AlaskaRegion2.gif). It's hard to say though when the season will wind down here as the Bering Sea (south of the Strait) seems behind 2016. R.Thoman has the data:
« Last Edit: November 20, 2017, 10:18:37 PM by A-Team »

gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #640 on: November 23, 2017, 01:13:28 PM »
JAXA DATA Arctic Sea Ice Extent as at 22 Nov 2017

Extent at 9,479,156 km2 still in second place due to extent gain to date some 440,000 km2 below the 10 year average. Difference with 2016 reduced by about 300 k km2 over the last 3 days. However, extent could easily become third as 2006 extent loss was very low for a week or so before disappearing into the pack.

extent gain on average is 55 % complete by this date, and if average gain from now to end of season happens extent maximum would be very close to the 2016 record low.
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"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

Niall Dollard

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #641 on: November 24, 2017, 06:09:57 PM »
On the NSIDC charctic extent graph, 2006 has come to the rescue of 2017 and spared it  the "ignominy" of being second place to 2016, by a very small margin.

Meanwhile the record low 2012 extent line is now greater than (inside) the 2017 line for the first time since Day 182 (circa July 1st).

The NSIDC charctic extent figures in million km2, in lowest order, for day 327 (Nov 23rd this year) were:

2016   8.731
2006   9.816
2017   9.822
2012   9.855
2010   9.923

I suppose it highlights how freakish autumn 2016 was.




colchonero

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #642 on: November 25, 2017, 02:02:00 PM »
Hello everyone, I've been reading topics on this forum for quite some time, and few days ago, I've decided to sign up. There wasn't much to write about last couple of days, the increase was pretty slow, persistent anomalies etc. so I didn't write anything until today.  Anyway(s), this morning JAXA reported an increase from 9.55 to 9.76 million km2. That's I believe first double century of the season so far.

Neven

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #643 on: November 25, 2017, 10:14:19 PM »
Indeed, and it seems also the first double century for November since 2005 (if I'm reading my spreadsheet correctly).

Quite the upswing:
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E. Smith

Feeltheburn

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #644 on: November 27, 2017, 02:12:26 AM »
On the NSIDC charctic extent graph, 2006 has come to the rescue of 2017 and spared it  the "ignominy" of being second place to 2016, by a very small margin.

Meanwhile the record low 2012 extent line is now greater than (inside) the 2017 line for the first time since Day 182 (circa July 1st).

The NSIDC charctic extent figures in million km2, in lowest order, for day 327 (Nov 23rd this year) were:

2016   8.731
2006   9.816
2017   9.822
2012   9.855
2010   9.923

I suppose it highlights how freakish autumn 2016 was.

It has certainly been a wild ride. Now 2010 has stepped to for a temporary respite, placing 2017 in 4th position for the time being.
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A-Team

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #645 on: November 27, 2017, 10:41:43 AM »
Here is the open water comparison for Nov 26th for the Arctic Ocean proper, with some Bering and Barents included and Fram excluded. For purposes of 'seasonally open', by the time the AO get there, southern regions will have melted out long ago. Thus at this time of year, trends in all NH ice obscures more critical trends in central basin ice.

Zach has posted an excellent graphic on satellite-era trends for the Chukchi (though it could use a small inset map showing its geographic definition).

Zach is also recommending a 2015 review (having 93 subsequent cites already!) of warm Arctic / cold continent (~ J Francis) by EA Barnes and JA Screen called "The impact of Arctic warming on the midlatitude jet-stream: Can it? Has it? Will it?" It's fair to say the scientific dust hasn't settled on the mid-latitude (that's you) consequences of Arctic Amplification and sea ice loss.

http://barnes.atmos.colostate.edu/FILES/MANUSCRIPTS/Barnes_Screen_2015_WIREsCC.pdf

NSIDC has a new web site called Satellite Observations of Arctic Change website at http://nsidc.org/soac. The graphical framework is unsatisfactory, animations are not supported, text overwrites map data, and almost all the products are years out of date, eg 2014 for sea ice age. Still, there's some useful information there in the bar graphs so it's worth a look.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2017, 09:37:04 PM by A-Team »

gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #646 on: December 02, 2017, 03:30:06 PM »
JAXA DATA
Jaxa having a day off, but herewith data as at 30 Nov 2017 as light relief from Russiagate and all things Trumpistan.

On average, extent gain is just over 60% done, well before the shortest day. As A-Team pointed out, 'tis because the CAB is just about filled in, and sea ice on land is not likely.

The graph and table below show that despite large daily variations one still looks at historical data pointing to a low maximum. But that is not a prediction.

I must admit that at the moment my eyes are more firmly glued to the Chukchi sea.
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"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #647 on: December 07, 2017, 02:48:11 PM »
JAXA DATA as at 6 Dec 2017

In just a few days extent up to 2nd from 4th lowest - see image.

On average extent gain is 66 % done.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

gerontocrat

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #648 on: December 14, 2017, 10:04:36 PM »
JAXA DATA as at 13 Dec 2017

Extent still 2nd just - see image to see how predicting outcome even to Dec 31 looks like a mugs game..

On average extent gain is now 71 % done.
"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump
"Damn, I wanted to see what happened next" (Epitaph)

Tor Bejnar

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Re: 2017 sea ice area and extent data
« Reply #649 on: December 15, 2017, 05:31:15 PM »
... Extent still 2nd just - see image to see how predicting outcome even to Dec 31 looks like a mugs game...
Yah:  somewhere between (or including) 1st and 10th place on Dec. 31 or Jan. 1, I'd say.  Poll anyone?
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