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TerryM

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3350 on: March 26, 2018, 08:17:39 AM »

Again, WHY do you and others on this thread keep on repeating Russian propaganda ?
Have you even considered the possibility that you are repeating Anti-Russian propaganda?
Terry

Rob Dekker

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3351 on: March 26, 2018, 08:24:11 AM »
It's cherry-picking and ignoring the 17 years of context Rob.

I call BS on that.
In 2002, when the US bailed out of the ABM Treaty, and Russia and the US agreed on SORT, Putin said :

Quote
"Therefore I fully believe that the decision taken by the president of the United States does not pose a threat to the national security of the Russian Federation."

And now he blames the US for starting an "arms race" (which I'm not sure actually exists) back then because of that decision ? Trump has been caught flip-flopping, but Putin is in a league all by himself.

Get real, Thomas. This is just all "Putin talk".
And we know very well now that we should ignore what Putin says, and instead pay attention to what Putin DOES.

Ask the survivors of the Putin-promised Ilovaisk "human corridor" massacre, about how much Putin's word is worth.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2018, 08:37:45 AM by Rob Dekker »
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oren

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3352 on: March 26, 2018, 08:37:25 AM »
Gents, this thread is already 3370 posts, mostly by the same ~10 posters. Don't you think the chance of the other posters here suddenly seeing the error of their ways and agreeing with you is exactly zero? Remember, insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different outcome.
I know I shouldn't stick my nose, but I am quite tired of always seeing this thread on the top of the recent unread threads. I mean, seriously, enough, why bother?
My opinion of the posters in these thread used to be very high, thanks to long-time important and interesting contributions to the ASIF, but as time goes by it goes down and down, not that my opinion is worth anything, but just letting you know. Your reputations are not improving with this slinging and slanging.

Rob Dekker

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3353 on: March 26, 2018, 08:47:17 AM »

Again, WHY do you and others on this thread keep on repeating Russian propaganda ?
Have you even considered the possibility that you are repeating Anti-Russian propaganda?
Terry

Yes I did. But every time when I check the facts, your and other pro-Russian opinions come up empty handed.

But when I point out the Russian propaganda on these threads, or do fact-checks, I get flak from all sides, including the voices of reason, like oren.

I kind of feel between a rock and a hard place right now.

Should I just withdraw and hand over the thread to pro-Putin Russian propaganda voices ?

[edit] You know what ? Oren is right. There is no need to argue.
I give up. And pro-Putin voices can have the thread.
I withdraw, just how I withdrew from the "Kick Democrats Out" thread.
I hope that others (like AbruptSLR and Steve) have more patience than me.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2018, 09:08:34 AM by Rob Dekker »
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Neven

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3354 on: March 26, 2018, 09:42:53 AM »
It doesn't matter what Putin says. This is a fact. Therefore Putin and by extension the Russian people must be destroyed, if they do not allow us to bring them freedom and democracy. Either you're with us or you're with the terrorists. And Bush and McCain are good people. We need to put more missiles on Russia's border.

There is no anti-Russia propaganda. This is a fact.
The enemy is within
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E. Smith

TerryM

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3355 on: March 26, 2018, 11:46:26 AM »
oren
I'm as guilty as anyone for posting provocative messages on the "rest" threads, and I'm sorry it bothers you.
I've long been an advocate for keeping these political discussions separated from the more scientifically oriented threads that are what drew us all to this site. The possibility of a global war breaking out, my sense of collegiality with the posters here, and a horror that this could happen without me ever having tried in any way to cheer on those opposed, this is what compels me to post.


It's trite to ask you to ignore the thread if it bothers you, and I'd much prefer that you'd read my words of wisdom.  ::)  That said, it is below the line & there are a few threads that over the years I've given up on, either because they didn't interest me or because I didn't see the value of being up to date on the information provided.
It leaves an open folder on the page, but nothing too difficult to live with.


Many threads deal with the best ways to cope with what we fear lies ahead. My contention is that we'll all sink unless the major nations find a way to pool their knowledge, their resources, and cooperate to ease what will surely be a rough path forward.


It's probably a quixotic quest, but the alternative is almost too terrible to contemplate.
Terry
P.S.
It just dawned on my sleep deprived brain that it might be our arguments re. American domestic policy that has raised your ire.  :-[


Domestically Trump is as bad as any we've had for a while. I believe the way to fight him is to go after his policies, rather than questioning the validity of the election.
We got rid of Flynn, which brought in Bolton. If Trump quits or somehow is impeached we will have President Pence to deal with. I don't believe that Bolton was an improvement over Flynn, & I don't believe Pence will be better for the world than Trump.
Again I feel compelled to post what I believe are valid arguments. I couldn't live with myself if I stayed out of the mess and the worst of my fears were realized.

AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3356 on: March 26, 2018, 04:20:11 PM »
I assume that the UK must have presented convincing evidence to Team Trump that Russia is behind the Skripal poisoning:
 
Title: "Trump Expels 60 Russian Diplomats for U.K. Attack"

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-03-26/trump-is-said-to-expel-60-russian-diplomats-for-u-k-attack

Extract: "“Today President Donald J. Trump ordered the expulsion of dozens of Russian intelligence officers from the United States and the closure of the Russian consulate in Seattle due to its proximity to one of our submarine bases and Boeing,” White House press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders said in a statement. “The United States takes this action in conjunction with our NATO allies and partners around the world in response to Russia’s use of a military-grade chemical weapon on the soil of the United Kingdom, the latest in its ongoing pattern of destabilizing activities around the world.”"
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AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3357 on: March 26, 2018, 04:42:28 PM »
As Cohen's payment for Stormy Daniels' NDA was actually a donation to Trump's 2016 campaign, Mueller should investigate Daniels' claim that Trump hired a thug to physically threaten her.

Title: "Stormy Daniels: I was threatened in 2011 over telling my Trump story"

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/stormy-daniels-i-was-threatened-2011-over-telling-my-trump-n859911

Extract: "The adult film star said that the threat left her "rattled" but that she didn't go to the police because she was scared."

Attached is most of a letter that Cohen's lawyer sent to Stormy Daniels last night.  This letter indicates that Cohen was not involved with anyone physically threatening Daniels, and that he does not believe that such a person exists.  Now as a lawyer, why would Cohen think that such a person does not exist if he had no involvement in (& thus no knowledge of) such an incident?
“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
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Neven

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3358 on: March 26, 2018, 05:33:40 PM »
I assume that the UK must have presented convincing evidence to Team Trump that Russia is behind the Skripal poisoning:

I assume you must love Trump now.  ;)
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E. Smith

gerontocrat

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3359 on: March 26, 2018, 08:45:27 PM »
Sometimes something happens that is worth posting on this thread.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-03-26/trump-is-said-to-expel-60-russian-diplomats-for-u-k-attack

U.S., Allies Expel More Than 100 Russian Envoys for U.K. Attack
Quote
“Today President Donald J. Trump ordered the expulsion of dozens of Russian intelligence officers from the United States and the closure of the Russian consulate in Seattle due to its proximity to one of our submarine bases and Boeing,” White House press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders said in a statement. “The United States takes this action in conjunction with our NATO allies and partners around the world in response to Russia’s use of a military-grade chemical weapon on the soil of the United Kingdom, the latest in its ongoing pattern of destabilizing activities around the world.”

European Expulsions
European Council President Donald Tusk said that 14 EU countries would expel Russia diplomats, and those announcements came in rapid succession, from France and Germany to Latvia and Estonia.

Note that the US Statement includes "the latest in its ongoing pattern of destabilizing activities around the world".

Sort of an admission that the Russkies are up to naughty stuff (but nowt to do with the President?). Trump has stiffed another friend?
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AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3360 on: March 26, 2018, 11:15:38 PM »
I imagine that Mueller is busy linking Cambridge Analytica to Russia:

Title: "Despite Denials, Links Between Cambridge Analytica and Russia Emerge"

https://www.polygraph.info/a/cambridge-analytica-links-russia-/29120279.html

Extract: "Alexander Yakovenko, Russian Ambassador to the United Kingdom:

“We had no links with the analytical organization Cambridge Analytica, which received access to the data of Facebook users during the election campaign in the United States.”
Source: RIA-Novosti, March 22, 2018

Likewise, Cambridge Analytica denies any ties with Russia. The firm’s CEO Alexander Nix, who is now suspended, told the British investigators, "We've never worked with a Russian organization in Russia or any other country, and we don't have any relationship with Russia or Russian individuals."

However, between 2014 and 2016, Cambridge Analytica repeatedly communicated and held at least three business meetings with representatives of the Russian oil giant Lukoil. The Russians specifically requested and received from Cambridge Analytica information regarding the use of social media and data to target American voters.

While the SCL Group, a British political and defense contractor, and its affiliate Cambridge Analytica denied the talks were political in nature, a company founder told the New York Times, Lukoil was interested in “data to tailor messaging to American voters.”"
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AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3361 on: March 26, 2018, 11:24:26 PM »
I assume that the UK must have presented convincing evidence to Team Trump that Russia is behind the Skripal poisoning:

I assume you must love Trump now.  ;)

Don't worry, Donald still wants to play 'pat and tickle' with Vlad:

Title: "Trump Admin's Raj Shah: "We Still Want To Work With Russia," "The Ball Is In Their Court""

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2018/03/26/white_houses_raj_shah_we_want_to_work_with_russia_the_ball_is_in_their_court.html

“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
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AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3362 on: March 26, 2018, 11:33:14 PM »
There are a lot of leads for Mueller to chase down w.r.t Russigate:

Title: "How A Putin Ally Met Key Trump Officials And Worried European Intelligence"

https://www.buzzfeed.com/mitchprothero/how-a-putin-ally-met-key-trump-officials-and-worried?utm_term=.keagMMX3vn#.mb4Rbb1mrL

Extract: "When Trump campaign aide George Papadopoulos pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI, attention fell on his meetings with a mysterious Maltese professor named Joseph Mifsud, who, according to court documents, told Papadopoulos that the Russians had thousands of Hillary Clinton emails — nearly two months before the Democrats themselves knew that their computers had been hacked.

But European security officials say another set of meetings Papadopoulos held in Europe in the months before and after the 2016 election should alarm US investigators. That’s because the person with whom he met, Greek Defense Minister Panos Kammenos, is known to be close to Russian President Vladimir Putin — a relationship that goes beyond Greece’s traditional ties to Russia through the Eastern Orthodox Church and a growing relationship brought on by Greece’s economic collapse."
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AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3363 on: March 26, 2018, 11:48:17 PM »
It looks like Cambridge Analytica, Steve Bannon and Rebekah Mercer were breaking U.S. election regulations as early as 2014:

Title: "Former Cambridge Analytica workers say firm sent foreigners to advise U.S. campaigns"

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/former-cambridge-analytica-workers-say-firm-sent-foreigners-to-advise-us-campaigns/2018/03/25/6a0d7d90-2fa2-11e8-911f-ca7f68bff0fc_story.html?utm_term=.58f40bcd95bf

Extract: "Cambridge Analytica assigned dozens of non-U.S. citizens to provide campaign strategy and messaging advice to Republican candidates in 2014, according to three former workers for the data firm, even as an attorney warned executives to abide by U.S. laws limiting foreign involvement in elections.

U.S. election regulations say foreign nationals must not “directly or indirectly participate in the decision-making process” of a political campaign, although they can play lesser roles.

Those restrictions were explained in a 10-page memo prepared in July 2014 by a New York attorney, Laurence Levy, for Cambridge Analytica’s leadership at the time, including President Rebekah Mercer, Vice President Stephen K. Bannon and chief executive Alexander Nix. The memo said that foreign nationals could serve in minor roles — for example as “functionaries” handling data — but could not involve themselves in significant campaign decisions or provide high-level analysis or strategy."
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Neven

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3364 on: March 27, 2018, 12:03:47 AM »
Don't worry, Donald still wants to play 'pat and tickle' with Vlad:

Title: "Trump Admin's Raj Shah: "We Still Want To Work With Russia," "The Ball Is In Their Court""

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2018/03/26/white_houses_raj_shah_we_want_to_work_with_russia_the_ball_is_in_their_court.html

I doubt even an all-out war with Russia can change this perception. Liberals aren't that easily swayed by talk of peace.  ;)

It looks like Cambridge Analytica, Steve Bannon and Rebekah Mercer were breaking U.S. election regulations as early as 2014:

Title: "Former Cambridge Analytica workers say firm sent foreigners to advise U.S. campaigns"

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/former-cambridge-analytica-workers-say-firm-sent-foreigners-to-advise-us-campaigns/2018/03/25/6a0d7d90-2fa2-11e8-911f-ca7f68bff0fc_story.html?utm_term=.58f40bcd95bf

Wow, a news article that doesn't contain the word 'Russia'. I'm impressed.  ;D
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ivica

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3365 on: March 27, 2018, 12:53:06 AM »
I imagine that Mueller is busy linking Cambridge Analytica to Russia:
...

Perhaps Mueller should contact UK colleagues for additional info ;)

https://www.thecanary.co/uk/analysis/2018/03/26/scl-and-cambridge-analyticas-links-with-defence-establishment-revealed-and-its-not-just-contracts/

"Overall, the services provided by SCL are not just about voter manipulation [pdf], but the management of populations’ political views, seemingly as part of defence strategy.

This could explain the delay in the ICO being granted a warrant to search CA’s London premises, though not the half-truths on the matter uttered by May."

Shhh, ("But there is one name associated with SCL Group that shows just how close the company is to the British establishment. Lord Ivar Mountbatten, a cousin of Queen Elizabeth II, is listed by Bloomberg as a SCL Group Advisory Board member. And another SCL director with Royal connections is Rear Admiral John Tolhurst, who is also an aide de camp to the Queen.")

AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3366 on: March 27, 2018, 03:45:43 PM »
It looks like Mueller probably gave immunity to George Nader, because Nader has dirt not only on Team Trump but also on other main GOP figures:

Title: "Mueller probe witness secretly backed UAE agenda in Congress"

https://www.apnews.com/e2a2ae7f178e4daf9202be7ef3232628

Extract: "A top fundraiser for President Donald Trump received millions of dollars from a political adviser to the United Arab Emirates last April, just weeks before he began handing out a series of large political donations to U.S. lawmakers considering legislation targeting Qatar, the UAE’s chief rival in the Persian Gulf, an Associated Press investigation has found.

George Nader, an adviser to the UAE who is now a witness in the U.S. special counsel investigation into foreign meddling in American politics, wired $2.5 million to the Trump fundraiser, Elliott Broidy, through a company in Canada, according to two people who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the matter. They said Nader paid the money to Broidy to bankroll an effort to persuade the U.S. to take a hard line against Qatar, a long-time American ally but now a bitter adversary of the UAE.

A month after he received the money, Broidy sponsored a conference on Qatar’s alleged ties to Islamic extremism. During the event, Republican Congressman Ed Royce of California, the chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, announced he was introducing legislation that would brand Qatar as a terrorist-supporting state.

In July 2017, two months after Royce introduced the bill, Broidy gave the California congressman $5,400 in campaign gifts — the maximum allowed by law. The donations were part of just under $600,000 that Broidy has given to GOP members of Congress and Republican political committees since he began the push for the legislation fingering Qatar, according to an AP analysis of campaign finance disclosure records."
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EgalSust

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3367 on: March 27, 2018, 03:58:51 PM »
I imagine that Mueller is busy linking Cambridge Analytica to Russia

SCL / Cambridge Analytica denies of having worked with Russian companies / individuals, but this turns out to be a lie. They worked with Russian oil giant Lukoil, which was interested 'in how data was used to target American voters' (NYT, 2018/03/17). Christopher Wylie, the Cambridge Analytica whistleblower, just stated to the UK Parliament Commons culture committee, that he 'has seen Cambridge Analytica pitch for business with companies close to the FSB, the Russian spying agency', citing Lukoil as an example (The Guardian, 27/3/2018). Lukoil's motives caused confusion in Wylie: "If this was a commercial deal, why were they so interested in our political targeting?" (NYT, 2018/03/17).

The professor at Cambridge University, Aleksandr Kogan, who mined the Facebook data that Cambridge Analytica / SCL used, worked simultaneously at St Petersburg State University, 'taking Russian government grants to fund other research into social media' (The Guardian, 2018/3/17). A Cambridge Analytica sales pitch e-mail says: "We may want to either loop in or find out a bit more about the interesting work Alex Kogan has been doing for the Russians and see how/if it applies" (The Guardian, 2018/3/17).

Kogan was rather secretive about the Russian contact. The Guardian (2018/3/17):

Quote
"Colleagues said they had not heard about the post in St Petersburg. “I am very surprised by that. No one knew,” one academic who asked not to be named told the Observer. Russia is not mentioned in a 10-page CV Kogan posted on a university website in 2015. The CV lists undergraduate prizes and grants of a few thousand dollars and links to dozens of media interviews."

AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3368 on: March 27, 2018, 04:11:50 PM »
It looks like Bolton is up to his knees in dirt from Cambridge Analytica.  Is that why Trump picked him to be the national security advisor?

Title: "Did Trump campaign and John Bolton PAC get help from overseas?"

https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/26/opinions/trump-bolton-cambridge-analytica-investigation-wertheimer-eisen/index.html

Extract: "Recent revelations about Cambridge Analytica raise serious questions about whether President Donald Trump's campaign received illegal support from a foreign national. These same questions also exist regarding John Bolton and his super PAC. These matters need to be investigated by the Department of Justice, including special counsel Robert Mueller, as well as by the Federal Election Commission.

Both the Trump campaign and the Bolton Super PAC retained the services of Cambridge Analytica, a data research firm headed by CEO Alexander Nix, a British citizen. The Trump campaign reportedly paid nearly $6 million to Cambridge Analytica over the course of the 2016 presidential campaign, and the Bolton Super PAC reportedly paid Cambridge Analytica $1.1 million since 2014."
“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
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AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3369 on: March 27, 2018, 05:10:25 PM »
The extent of Cambridge Analytica's shady activities are slowly coming to light:

Title: "Cambridge Analytica whistleblower reveals shocking claim his predecessor was poisoned"

http://www.businessinsider.com/cambridge-analytica-whistleblower-christopher-wylie-illegal-trump-brexit-2018-3?r=UK&IR=T

Extract: "The whistleblower at the center of the Cambridge Analytica scandal has revealed shocking claims that his predecessor was murdered in a hotel room in Kenya and that police were bribed not to investigate.

Christopher Wylie, whose allegations blew open the scandal involving Donald Trump's presidential campaign and the official Brexit campaign, painted a picture of a company involved in illegal activity around the globe as he addressed a British parliamentary committee on Tuesday.

•   Christopher Wylie says Cambridge Analytica "don't care whether or not it's legal as long as it gets the job done."

•   He paints a picture of a lawless organization seeking to disrupt elections around the world.

•   He says an offshoot of the company distributed videos of dismembered people in an attempt to intimidate Nigerian voters.

•   He claims his predecessor was poisoned and the police were bribed not to investigate, though he described those claims as speculation."
“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
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AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3370 on: March 27, 2018, 05:17:40 PM »
Peter Thiel is a champion of the alt-right, and it is not surprising that the company that he co-founded, Palantir, worked on the Facebook data that Cambridge Analytica illegally provided to them:

Title: "Palantir worked with Cambridge Analytica on the Facebook data it acquired, whistleblower alleges"

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/27/palantir-worked-with-cambridge-analytica-on-the-facebook-data-whistleblower.html

Extract: "Palantir, a secretive company co-founded by billionaire Peter Thiel, worked with Cambridge Analytica, the political analysis firm that harvested data from Facebook users, whistleblower Christopher Wylie told U.K. lawmakers Tuesday.

Wylie claimed that Cambridge Analytica CEO Alexander Nix was introduced to Palantir by Sophie Schmidt, the daughter of former Google CEO Eric Schmidt.

Thiel, who has not been accused of any wrongdoing, was not immediately available for comment when contacted by CNBC.

•   Palantir allegedly worked with Cambridge Analytica, the firm at the center of a controversy involving data harvested from Facebook users, according to whistleblower Christopher Wylie.

•   Palantir worked on the Facebook data that was acquired by Cambridge Analytica, Wylie claims.

•   But there was no official contract between the two firms.
 
•   Palantir was co-founded by billionaire Peter Thiel."
“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
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Martin Gisser

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3371 on: March 27, 2018, 05:34:13 PM »
It's proven beyond all doubt they keep on repeating the errors of the past ad nauseum.
No. Having survived a few rounds of Russian roulette proves nothing.

We have now reached the planetary moral limits of existentialist nausea. Nausea is cowardice now. We either evolve culturally and systemically (integrating e.g. the carbon cycle and hominin breeding dynamics) or Homo S Sapiens goes extinct as Nature's most ridiculous extinct creature, in a cataclysm equal to only a few major events in the history of Life on Earth. Never has revolution been so radically simple and evidence based: To not repeat the errors of the past, we simply couple the evolution of global civilization to biogeophysical reality (which has never been done in the past, not even locally (except e.g. Edo Japan)...). Then things may evolve quickly towards better trajectories.

Russiagate is part of the (abstract) systemic resistance to the reconfigurations from fossil carbon burning (and capital generation) to solar electric mobility etc. and ultimately to carbon negative capital from bio carbon growing. The Fossil Fools' Last Standing. Their battle seems already lost (forget General Tillerson), mostly due to market forces and some pioneering regulations and subventions (e.g. German Solar).

AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3372 on: March 27, 2018, 06:15:02 PM »
While it might take the FEC about a year to decide with Cohen's payment of $130,000 to Daniels constituted an unreported donation to the Trump campaign; Mueller could make that same determination well before the mid-term elections:

Title: "FEC could take a year to decide if Stormy Daniels payment was in-kind contribution to Trump: report"

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/380410-fec-may-need-a-year-to-decide-whether-stormy-daniels-payment-was-in-kind

Extract: "Current and former officials at the Federal Elections Commission (FEC) say it could take more than a year to determine whether a $130,000 payment made by President Trump's lawyer to adult film star Stormy Daniels constituted an unreported donation to the Trump campaign.

NBC News reports that the investigation into whether Trump's top lawyer violated campaign finance laws with the payment could last months due to understaffing at America's election watchdog agency."
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AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3373 on: March 27, 2018, 06:43:45 PM »
It looks like Mueller probably gave immunity to George Nader, because Nader has dirt not only on Team Trump but also on other main GOP figures:

Title: "Mueller probe witness secretly backed UAE agenda in Congress"

https://www.apnews.com/e2a2ae7f178e4daf9202be7ef3232628


Between Rick Gates' and George Nader's testimonies against Trump fundraiser Elliott Broidy, Mueller appears to now have a direct tie from foreign influence to both the Trump campaign and to top congressional GOP leadership (even if Paul Manafort never flips):

Title: "Trump fundraiser turned to Foreign Affairs chair for help winning work in Romania"

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/article206905994.html

Extract: "Top Donald Trump fundraiser Elliott Broidy sought help las summer from the chair of the House Foreign Affairs Committee and lobbyist Rick Gates, a key figure in the Russia influence probe, as a Broidy defense company was trying to win business in Romania."
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Buddy

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3374 on: March 27, 2018, 09:42:54 PM »
So what is Traitor Donnie going to do next as Robert Mueller closes in?

*  Trump refuses to make any tough remarks about Russia....even though the evidence in SEVERAL issues continues to pile up

*  He has now hired John Bolton as advisor.  Bolton is know to love all wars, and has already said the US should do a preemptive strike against North Korea.  That is one of Trump's "escape hatches" in case he needs to use it.  Same with Iran.

*  Donnie and his DOJ is making another move to tamp down voting by having a "citizenship" question on the next census

*  One of the Mercers government slaves..... Scott Walker of Wisconsin, is trying to IGNORE the special election he is SUPPOSED to schedule, and which the courts said he HAD to schedule

There are TWO areas to watch:  (1) one is short term moves like RussiaGate, and (2) the other moves are LONGER TERM things to watch like gerrymandering, special elections like those in Wisconsin that Scott Walker is trying to ignore, and the "citizenship question" on the upcoming census, and states trying to shorten voting times in order to tamp down voter turnout.

If Trump SOMEHOW avoids removal from office..... he wants an electorate that is MORE BIASED towards the Republicans.

Remember....Donnie is in this thing to the very end.  He will be destroyed financially IF the Mueller investigation goes through to completion.

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SteveMDFP

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3375 on: March 27, 2018, 10:03:15 PM »


*  Donnie and his DOJ is making another move to tamp down voting by having a "citizenship" question on the next census

It's an outrageous step.  Not that it will tamp down voting, but rather, alter seats in the House of Representatives.  The census is used to decide seats in the House, and it's supposed to count the number of humans in residence in an area, not the number of voters or citizens.  The question will make it more likely that non-citizens won't be counted.  Thus, areas with a lot of non-citizens will be deliberately under-counted, and thus under-represented in Congress.  This would mostly be urban, Democratic areas.

Personally, I plan to participate with the Census, but I'll be leaving that question blank.

California, I believe, is already challenging this change in the courts.  I hope California wins.

Steve

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3376 on: March 27, 2018, 10:29:59 PM »
I have extracted the portion of the linked article when Cohen tried (as Trump's attorney) to prevent Daniels from obtaining qualified legal representation.  At the minimum, it seems to me that this act should disbar Cohen, and more specifically, I think that when Mueller interviews Trump that Mueller should ask if Cohen was acting under his directions, in an attempt to silence her beyond the illegal 2016 NDA (which broke the campaign donation rules):

Title: "Stormy Daniels sues Trump lawyer, says he defamed her, broke campaign finance law"

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/stormy-daniels-lawyer-email-shows-cohen-tried-keep-me-case-n860156

Extract: "Both the White House and Trump have sought to distance the president from the 2016 agreement and subsequent attempts to enforce it.

But Clifford's lawyer, Michael Avenatti, says a recent email — which he obtained and provided to NBC News — holds proof that Trump was involved.

Cohen sent the Feb. 22 email to Keith Davidson, the lawyer who represented Clifford when she signed the hush agreement.

"It is my understanding that Ms. Clifford has or is seeking the advice of additional counsel regarding the above matter," Cohen wrote.

The "above matter" was outlined in the subject line: "PP -vs- DD NDA" — shorthand for the agreement between "Peggy Peterson" and "David Dennison," which Avenatti says are aliases for Clifford and Trump.

The email went on to say that an exhibit to the agreement that discloses their identities "is deemed Attorneys Eyes Only; specifically naming only you and I."

"Under no circumstances should you forward this document or the exhibits to anyone without my express written consent," Cohen added.

He signed the email: "Michael D. Cohen, Esq., Personal Attorney to President Donald J. Trump."

Avenatti said the email also shows that "as late as one month ago, Cohen was continuing to take steps to prevent my client from getting a new attorney to help her exercise her rights."

And, he added, "Cohen was acting as counsel to Mr. Trump when he was attempting to silence her.""
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3377 on: March 27, 2018, 11:16:10 PM »
I think that both Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan should formally endorse this proposed bipartisan legislation to protect Mueller:

Title: "Bipartisan Senate duo calls on Trump to back off Mueller"

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/03/27/trump-mueller-russia-tillis-coons-bipartisan-senate-488468

Extract: "A Republican senator behind a bill to protect Special Counsel Robert Mueller's job joined his Democratic co-author on Tuesday in a bipartisan call for President Donald Trump to let Mueller's investigation proceed "without impediment."

Sen. Thom Tillis (R-N.C.) aligned with Sen. Chris Coons (D-Del.) after weeks of downplaying the need for quick passage of their legislation designed to shield Mueller from being fired by Trump, who has repeatedly expressed frustration with the ongoing probe of Russian interference in the 2016 election."
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3378 on: March 28, 2018, 12:25:18 AM »
Tools like Cambridge Analytica work well with kleptocrats (like Putin), and kleptocrat-wannabes (like Trump), as they both want to undermine democracy:

Title: " 'They Don't Care': Whistleblower Says Cambridge Analytica Aims To Undermine Democracy"

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/03/27/597279596/they-don-t-care-whistleblower-says-cambridge-analytica-seeks-to-undermine-democr

Extract: "Christopher Wylie, who worked at Cambridge Analytica and has brought forward accusations about how the company allegedly misused data from as many as 50 million Facebook users, told a committee in the U.K. Parliament that a Canadian firm allegedly linked to Cambridge Analytica developed the software that the Trump campaign used to target voters in the 2016 U.S. presidential race.

Wylie also alleges Aggregate IQ broke U.K. laws on spending limits to sway the country's 2016 referendum that set Brexit, the United Kingdom's withdrawal from the European Union, into motion.

Wylie portrayed Cambridge Analytica and its parent company, Strategic Communication Laboratories, as totally without qualms about breaking laws and undermining democracies around the world.

"They don't care whether or not what they do is legal as long as it gets the job done," he said. "Broadly, this is a company that goes around the world and undermines civil institutions of countries that are struggling to develop those institutions. ... They are an example of what modern-day colonialism looks like.""
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3379 on: March 28, 2018, 04:50:31 PM »
In court documents, Mueller revealed that Gates was in communication with a Russian intelligence officer for months prior to the 2016, regarding topics pertinent to Russiagate:

Title: "Mueller team reveals Manafort business associate’s connection to Russian intel service"

http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/380606-mueller-team-reveals-manafort-business-associates-connection-to

Extract: "The FBI believes a business associate of former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort had ties to Russian intelligence, including during the 2016 presidential race, prosecutors said in court documents filed Tuesday.

The documents, filed by special counsel Robert Mueller's team, allege that Richard Gates, a longtime business partner of Manafort and President Trump's former deputy campaign manager, was aware that an unidentified associate "was a former Russian Intelligence Officer."

The documents also allege that Gates and the individual continued to communicate with one another in the months before the 2016 presidential election. Such communication "was pertinent to the investigation," prosecutors said."

Edit, see also:

https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/mbxgda/mueller-court-filing-rick-gates-trump-russia
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 05:02:55 PM by AbruptSLR »
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3380 on: March 28, 2018, 05:13:12 PM »
The fact that neither McConnell nor Ryan are stepping up to say that Team Trump (including Fox) smear campaign against Mueller is unacceptable makes me wonder whether they might be subject to investigation by Mueller for illegally influencing the 2016 elections:

Title: "Trump attack unleashes oppo against Mueller"

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/03/28/trump-mueller-russia-probe-488695

Extract: "'It looks like the beginnings of a campaign,' said a source familiar with Trump's legal strategy
...
“If Trump is trying to determine how far Congress will let him go, the silence becomes very important,” said Charlie Sykes, the frequent Trump critic and former conservative radio host from Wisconsin. “They could have shut this down almost immediately by saying this would be absolutely intolerable, this would cross a bright red line.”

“The fact neither McConnell or Ryan is not drawing a red line,” he added, “is potentially signaling a green light to Trump.”"
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Tor Bejnar

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3381 on: March 28, 2018, 06:36:50 PM »
Quote
“The fact neither McConnell or Ryan is not drawing a red line,” he added, “is potentially signaling a green light to Trump.”"
Which leads me to wonder if the two (with others in Congress) are complicit with (for example, knew about and didn't report to anybody) foreign funded (this illegal) politicking.
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3382 on: March 28, 2018, 07:43:41 PM »
Putin just hacked the Chinese space lab, it's coming down.

Tor Bejnar

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3383 on: March 28, 2018, 07:54:40 PM »
Well actually:
https://www.ksl.com/?sid=46289151&nid=1012&title=chinese-space-lab-to-fall-to-earth-within-days-in-fiery-demise
Quote
The China Manned Space Engineering Office said it expects the lab to reenter the atmosphere between March 31 and April 4, burning up in the process.

While posing minimal risk to humans, the uncontrolled re-entry of the space lab is a blot on China's ambitious space program. The 8.5 ton Tiangong-1 "ceased functioning" on March 16, 2016, China told the United Nations in May 2017, without specifying why.
If Putin "just" now hacked it, maybe he can save it from this untimely re-entry!
[
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3384 on: March 28, 2018, 09:31:26 PM »
Trump’s indicted campaign manager seems to think he’ll get a pardon

https://shareblue.com/paul-manafort-trump-pardon/

Something tells me that New York AG, Eric Schneiderman, may be making his appearance onto the stage within the next several months.   ;)
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3385 on: March 28, 2018, 09:38:45 PM »
Trump’s indicted campaign manager seems to think he’ll get a pardon

https://shareblue.com/paul-manafort-trump-pardon/

Something tells me that New York AG, Eric Schneiderman, may be making his appearance onto the stage within the next several months.   ;)

This first linked article indicates that Trump's legal team has previously discussed the idea of pardoning Flynn and/or Manafort; while the second linked article discusses reasons why such pardons may not be a good idea (unless Trump cuts a deal to resign if Pence pardons him once Pence is president):

Title: "Trump's lawyer discussed idea of him pardoning Flynn, Manafort: report"

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/380665-trumps-lawyer-discussed-idea-of-trump-pardoning-flynn-manafort-report

Extract: "A lawyer for President Trump reportedly discussed the possibility last year of the president pardoning his former national security adviser Michael Flynn and former campaign chairman Paul Manafort.

The lawyer, John Dowd, who abruptly resigned from his role last week, broached the topic last year with lawyers for Flynn and Manafort, The New York Times reported Wednesday.

According to the Times, Dowd talked about the idea as special counsel Robert Mueller was building cases against Flynn and Manafort."

&

Title: "10 legal experts on why Trump can’t pardon his way out of the Russia investigation"

https://www.vox.com/2017/8/29/16211784/trump-pardon-manafort-flynn-mueller

Extract: "If someone like Flynn or Kushner were preemptively pardoned, he wouldn’t be able to plead the Fifth Amendment if he were called to testify against Trump. The Fifth Amendment protects citizens against self-incrimination. But if someone has been pardoned, they no longer face the threat of prosecution, and so they can’t use a desire to avoid incriminating themselves as an excuse not to answer a question.

So in addition to potentially obstructing justice, Trump would only leave himself — and his colleagues — more vulnerable if he decided to pardon anyone currently under investigation. Of course, that doesn’t mean he won’t pull the trigger anyway. But he might want to think long and hard about the implications before he does.

There is, however, one scenario in which Trump could save himself and others from potential prosecution. It’s what Susan Bloch, a law professor at Georgetown, calls the Nixon scenario: “Trump pardons them [Flynn, Kushner, Manafort, and Donald Trump Jr.] as he is exiting the White House and Trump exits early, allowing Pence to become president, and Pence then pardons Trump. Trump will then have successfully shielded himself and his colleagues from criminal liability.”"
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3386 on: March 28, 2018, 09:52:23 PM »
Quote
There is, however, one scenario in which Trump could save himself and others from potential prosecution. It’s what Susan Bloch, a law professor at Georgetown, calls the Nixon scenario: “Trump pardons them [Flynn, Kushner, Manafort, and Donald Trump Jr.] as he is exiting the White House and Trump exits early, allowing Pence to become president, and Pence then pardons Trump. Trump will then have successfully shielded himself and his colleagues from criminal liability.”"

This brings us back to the whole issue of "timing".  Who.......When......and who is in control of the House?  Not to mention the issue of potential state charges (New York, Virginia, New Jersey, and Florida).  All except Florida have Democrat's as Governors AND Attorney Generals.....and the Florida Governor and AG slots are contested this November (not that anything illegal has been happening at Mar a Lago....).

Interesting times.....

There are a LOT of scenarios that can play out....
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litesong

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3387 on: March 29, 2018, 01:15:55 AM »
.... (not that anything illegal has been happening at Mar a Lago....).
& re-pubic-lick-uns ain't backin' up "don'T rump" such that they deserve to go extinct.....NOT!!!

TerryM

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3388 on: March 29, 2018, 03:09:53 AM »
Trump’s indicted campaign manager seems to think he’ll get a pardon

https://shareblue.com/paul-manafort-trump-pardon/

Something tells me that New York AG, Eric Schneiderman, may be making his appearance onto the stage within the next several months.   ;)

This first linked article indicates that Trump's legal team has previously discussed the idea of pardoning Flynn and/or Manafort; while the second linked article discusses reasons why such pardons may not be a good idea (unless Trump cuts a deal to resign if Pence pardons him once Pence is president):

Title: "Trump's lawyer discussed idea of him pardoning Flynn, Manafort: report"

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/380665-trumps-lawyer-discussed-idea-of-trump-pardoning-flynn-manafort-report

Extract: "A lawyer for President Trump reportedly discussed the possibility last year of the president pardoning his former national security adviser Michael Flynn and former campaign chairman Paul Manafort.

The lawyer, John Dowd, who abruptly resigned from his role last week, broached the topic last year with lawyers for Flynn and Manafort, The New York Times reported Wednesday.

According to the Times, Dowd talked about the idea as special counsel Robert Mueller was building cases against Flynn and Manafort."

&

Title: "10 legal experts on why Trump can’t pardon his way out of the Russia investigation"

https://www.vox.com/2017/8/29/16211784/trump-pardon-manafort-flynn-mueller

Extract: "If someone like Flynn or Kushner were preemptively pardoned, he wouldn’t be able to plead the Fifth Amendment if he were called to testify against Trump. The Fifth Amendment protects citizens against self-incrimination. But if someone has been pardoned, they no longer face the threat of prosecution, and so they can’t use a desire to avoid incriminating themselves as an excuse not to answer a question.

So in addition to potentially obstructing justice, Trump would only leave himself — and his colleagues — more vulnerable if he decided to pardon anyone currently under investigation. Of course, that doesn’t mean he won’t pull the trigger anyway. But he might want to think long and hard about the implications before he does.

There is, however, one scenario in which Trump could save himself and others from potential prosecution. It’s what Susan Bloch, a law professor at Georgetown, calls the Nixon scenario: “Trump pardons them [Flynn, Kushner, Manafort, and Donald Trump Jr.] as he is exiting the White House and Trump exits early, allowing Pence to become president, and Pence then pardons Trump. Trump will then have successfully shielded himself and his colleagues from criminal liability.”"


So those who once speculated that Trump would do this or that, are now speculating that their prior speculations were entirely wrong, and then go on to speculate that Trump could however possibly do so and so.
Of course this is all the very latest, up to date, speculation.


Thanks so much for Bolton, he's so much better than Flynn. [/sarc]
Terry


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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3389 on: March 29, 2018, 08:48:24 AM »

Thomas
I'm not sure that it matters now.


We've learned that 25 nations have traded in the rule of law, for the rule of might makes right.


Economic might, military might, perhaps only perceived might. Does it matter?
Once the law of the jungle is seen as the highest law, with the acquiescence of the proles, the media and all of the fearless leaders, a cord has been broken.


This isn't the first, the second or the hundredth time this has occurred. It is just the most recent, one of the more egregious, and one of the easiest to see through violations of international law.


My support of the Federal Liberal Party is ended. We've a few Russian posters here who can hold their heads high, and Neven must be proud as hell of his adopted country.
Terry
« Last Edit: March 29, 2018, 08:55:03 AM by TerryM »

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3390 on: March 29, 2018, 09:02:13 AM »
I know I should not feed the trolls, but this one is just too egregious :

Quote
Presidential address quotes March 1, 2018, nearly 3 weeks after the Feb 10 incident and 3 days before the Skripal incident in the UK.

I should note that our military doctrine says Russia reserves the right to use nuclear weapons solely in response to a nuclear attack, or an attack with other weapons of mass destruction against the country or its allies, or an act of aggression against us with the use of conventional weapons that threaten the very existence of the state. This all is very clear and specific.

Yet three days later, Russia launches an attack using a weapon of mass destruction (Novichok) on UK soil.

Putin's hypocrisy is mind boggling.

And I'm glad the UK doesn't think like Putin.
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3391 on: March 29, 2018, 09:21:24 AM »
Quote
a nuclear, biological, or chemical weapon able to cause widespread devastation and loss of life.

QED
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3392 on: March 29, 2018, 10:25:10 AM »
Former OPCW boss Dr Ralf Trapp says in a clarifying interview why OPCW never listed the Novichoks as a nerve poison. Summary:

 -   Nerve agent found in Salisbury does not conclusively prove Russian complicity
 -   Russia’s denial of a Novichok programme is true but misleading — a secret nerve agent programme to create Novichok-type agents was run under a different name
-    Western states have extensively researched and synthesized the Novichok class of agents
-    Novichok was most recently synthesized by Iran, details of which were provided to the OPCW
-    Russian Novichok stockpiles were destroyed in the 1990s, but it is theoretically possible that some capability still exists, though no evidence for this is available

The Skripal poisoning was done with a very small quantity of poison, probably smeared onto their front door handle. This quantity could easily have been produced in any chem lab dealing with organic chemistry, starting with pesticides/insecticides. As Dr. Trapp says, these poisons have been produced in labs in Western countries.

Again, ask cui bono? Did Russia gain anything from the Skripal poisoning? Did Russia lose? Who might have a motive to frame Russia? Which powers/forces are gaining from the Skripal poisoning?

https://medium.com/insurge-intelligence/former-opcw-official-no-conclusive-proof-of-russian-complicity-in-salisbury-attack-1ae3749ba38e

Neven

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3393 on: March 29, 2018, 10:54:18 AM »
Neven must be proud as hell of his adopted country.

Nope. I don't know whether they did it because the extreme right-wing FPÖ is in the government and they love Big Men, or whether it's about natural gas. Or maybe they're selling weapons to Russia, I don't know.

It's probably not because of some enlightened reasoning that it's unwise to escalate before an investigation is concluded. What I did find interesting, was that the left-wing SPÖ criticized the decision and pushed for further escalation, while a smaller left-wing party (which is really left-wing, not neoliberal) said it was a good decision because there is no conclusive evidence yet and Austria should try to remain neutral in this kind of international power game.

So, it was the front door handle, eh? Nice to hear after almost four weeks.  ::)
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3394 on: March 29, 2018, 05:42:21 PM »
It looks like Trump wants to string along Manafort as long as possible:

Title: "White House: No talk of pardons in Russia probe 'at this time'"

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/380686-white-house-no-talk-of-pardons-in-russia-probe-at-this-time

Extract: "The White House on Wednesday refused to rule out the possibility that President Trump would issue pardons to former senior aides facing charges from special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation."
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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3395 on: March 29, 2018, 06:04:45 PM »
If Assange is left without sufficient protection from Ecuador, he may become easy picking for an indictment from Mueller for his role in Russiagate:

Title: "Ecuador Disconnects Julian Assange From The Internet"

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/03/28/597695729/ecuador-disconnects-julian-assange-from-the-internet

Extract: "The source of Ecuador's recent concern appears to be a series of tweets in which Assange suggested that only "circumstantial" evidence suggests Russia is behind the nerve agent poisoning of a former Russian spy and his daughter in the U.K. earlier this month. That attack prompted the U.K., the U.S. and more than a dozen European nations to expel Russian officials from their countries.

It was clear that Assange's comments angered British Foreign Office Minister Alan Duncan, who described him as a "miserable little worm" during a debate in Parliament on Tuesday."
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TerryM

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3396 on: March 29, 2018, 09:31:24 PM »
Neven must be proud as hell of his adopted country.

Nope. I don't know whether they did it because the extreme right-wing FPÖ is in the government and they love Big Men, or whether it's about natural gas. Or maybe they're selling weapons to Russia, I don't know.

It's probably not because of some enlightened reasoning that it's unwise to escalate before an investigation is concluded. What I did find interesting, was that the left-wing SPÖ criticized the decision and pushed for further escalation, while a smaller left-wing party (which is really left-wing, not neoliberal) said it was a good decision because there is no conclusive evidence yet and Austria should try to remain neutral in this kind of international power game.

So, it was the front door handle, eh? Nice to hear after almost four weeks.  ::)
Can I guess where your sympathies are?


A front door handle seems anything but professional. More like the Halloween pranks the "bad kids" played, but of course more deadly - or at least more sickening.


How many use the front door to regularly enter and exit the house? I've always preferred a side door, or through the garage if it is attached.


Strange that both father and daughter use the door handle, then fall ill hours later, but the postman, delivery people and neighbors are apparently unscathed? Good that neither shook hands with any at the pub or the restaurant.
Terry

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3397 on: March 29, 2018, 10:01:52 PM »
'If Only Nixon had Twitter':
“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
― Leon C. Megginson

AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3398 on: March 30, 2018, 12:58:50 AM »
CNN reports that Gates' testimony will link the Trump campaign to Russia directly, implying that may be no need for Mueller to flip Manafort, in order to get to Trump:

Title: "Source: Mueller pushed for Gates' help on collusion"

https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/29/politics/mueller-gates-russia-investigation-contacts/index.html?sr=twCNN032918mueller-gates-russia-investigation-contacts0601PMVODtop

Extract: "Mueller's team alleges that Gates was in contact with a close colleague of Manafort's who worked for a Russian intelligence agency -- and that Gates knew of the spy service ties in September and October 2016, while he worked on the Trump campaign. Gates would have to talk about the communication with the man if prosecutors wanted, according to his plea deal.

That's in line with what prosecutors told Gates months ago during high-stakes negotiations, CNN has learned. They told him they didn't need his cooperation against Manafort, according to a person familiar with the investigation, and instead wanted to hear what he knew about contact between the Trump campaign and Russians."
“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
― Leon C. Megginson

AbruptSLR

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Re: Russiagate
« Reply #3399 on: March 30, 2018, 02:38:20 AM »
Mueller is now focusing his investigation on the Russian activities during the 2016 Republican National Convention:

Title: "Mueller probing Russia contacts at Republican convention: sources"

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-russia-convention/mueller-probing-russia-contacts-at-republican-convention-sources-idUSKBN1H52VT

Extract: "Investigators probing whether Donald Trump’s presidential campaign colluded with Russia have been questioning witnesses about events at the 2016 Republican National Convention, according to two sources familiar with Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s inquiries."
« Last Edit: March 30, 2018, 04:49:50 PM by AbruptSLR »
“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
― Leon C. Megginson