Support the Arctic Sea Ice Forum and Blog

Author Topic: Russiagate  (Read 51700 times)

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 580
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1250 on: September 28, 2017, 09:56:27 AM »
Facebook, Twitter and Google have been asked to testify before the US Senate Intelligence Committee on 1 November about the allegations of Russian interference.

Facebook and Google have confirmed they have received invitations to attend the committee hearing, but none of the social media giants have yet said they will be present.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41423082


Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 580
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1251 on: September 28, 2017, 09:57:09 AM »
Twitter has struggled for years to rein in the fake accounts overrunning its platform. Unlike Facebook, the service does not require its users to provide their real name (or at least a facsimile of one) and allows automated accounts — arguing that they are a useful tool for tasks such as customer service. Beyond those restrictions, there is also an online black market for services that can allow for the creation of large numbers of Twitter bots, which can be controlled by a single person while still being difficult to distinguish from real accounts.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/27/technology/twitter-russia-election.html

logicmanPatrick

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 244
    • View Profile
    • The Chatter Box
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1252 on: September 29, 2017, 01:20:42 AM »
The Trump zoo:

It's all yak, yak, rabbit, rabbit on twitter using weasel words as a means of saying 'look, a squirrel' so we don't notice DT screwing the pooch while at the same time jumping the shark and flipping the bird to the world because he has bats in the belfry.

I can't wait for him to go, just as soon as the Russian chickens come home to roost, and he can take his nest of vipers with him.
si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes

Buddy

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2083
  • Go DUCKS!!
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1253 on: September 29, 2017, 02:25:47 AM »
Sure glad that Donnie is draining the swamp.  It turns out Tom Prices air costs are now over $1 million bucks.  But Tom is apparently going to reimburse the government $52,000.

Of course I'm sure the FOX 🦊 network is on it like white on rice.  NO.

Tom Price is an embarrassment.  I would tell Tom to FUCK OFF.  What the FUCK were you thinking about.

INCREDIBLE.  ABSOLUTELY INCREDIBLE.

Dear BOB MUELLER.  Please hurry the hell up.

This country is going down the shitter QUICKLY.  And Donnie and Mikey need to get their white asses out of office and into prison ASAP.

INCREDIBLE.
FOX (TASS) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

Buddy

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2083
  • Go DUCKS!!
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1254 on: September 29, 2017, 12:58:01 PM »
For those of you thinking that RussiaGate is all but over....and all we have to do is wait till Bob Mueller finishes his investigation and ties everything together with a neat bow....I have some bad news for you:  It isn't over yet.....and like college football, there are NEVER any "sure things" in politics and government.

Donnie has WAY too much on the line to give up.  WAY too much.  He will continue to look for ways to distract....lie....evade....anything he can do to get out of the mess he is in.  And he has a 5 to 4 advantage in the Supreme Court which will likely come into play on one or more legal issues as RussiaGate continues to wind its way through time.

So don't EVER relax.....NEVER underestimate your foe.

FOX (TASS) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

Buddy

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2083
  • Go DUCKS!!
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1255 on: September 29, 2017, 06:24:56 PM »
There is a new movie coming out....in fact today may be its premier.  It stars Liam Neeson...and is titled "Mark Felt:  The Man Who Brought Down The White House."

It is about the famous FBI agent known as "deepthroat".  Should provide another interesting perspective.  Mark Felt "outed" himself just within the last year.  Before that...only the two journalists and their editor knew the identity of deepthroat all these years.
FOX (TASS) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

AbruptSLR

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12976
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1256 on: September 29, 2017, 11:51:45 PM »
Has Pence been cooperating with Mueller for some time now?

Title: "Pence sent lawyer to meet with Mueller over the summer"

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/28/mike-pence-robert-mueller-lawyer-meeting-russia-243275

Extract: "Vice President Mike Pence’s outside lawyer met privately with special counsel Robert Mueller at Pence’s request last summer, according to a person familiar with the meeting.

The meeting, which has not been previously reported, was held at Pence’s request to express his willingness to cooperate with Mueller’s investigation, the person said."
“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
― Leon C. Megginson

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 580
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1257 on: September 30, 2017, 09:08:18 AM »
Mike Pence Up To His Neck In Russia Scandal. The pieces just keep on falling :



Artful Dodger

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 439
  • The era of procrastination is coming to a close.
    • View Profile
Drumpfhouse
« Reply #1258 on: October 01, 2017, 12:42:23 PM »
Mark Felt "outed" himself just within the last year.  Before that...only the two journalists and their editor knew the identity of deepthroat all these years.
Hi Buddy, how are you?

Mark Felt actually died back in 2008. After decades of speculation, Vanity Fair published an article in 2015 naming Felt as the source of the Watergate leaks. Indeed, the editor of WaPo from the Watergate era confirmed the VF story shortly thereafter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Felt#Deep_Throat_revealed

I see an interesting modern parallel in the Drumpfhouse. So many leaks, and so timely. The source must be a highly placed individual, but who is left that has not lost their own head?  ???

Cheers,
Lodger
Cheers!
Lodger

Buddy

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2083
  • Go DUCKS!!
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1259 on: October 01, 2017, 02:38:52 PM »
Hi AD:

Thanks for the corrections.  My bad.

I think the one parallel to know isn't that there is a leaker...it's that someone stepped up from the FBI to enforce justice.  In Watergate it was done by Felt leaking.  In RussiaGate...it was done by Comey going after Donnie by the more conventional means.

The leaking now....from  whatever source it is...seems to serve the same function that it likely served from Felts leaking  in Watergate:  To push the US public opinion against the president.

The interesting parallel to me is the human psychology involved:

1). Nixon lied from the very beginning without hesitation, and felt like everyone should also lie to protect him

2). The administration did indeed lie for Nixon willingly....although there were 3 exceptions:  John Dean, Alexander Butterfield, and one other who's name I don't recall (from the CNN special).  Who is going to step forward with the truth this time?

3). Nixon didn't pardon anyone.  Donnie has already sent a clear message(s) that's he will pardon EVERYONE.  There are still 2 problems:  Donnie doesn't keep his word...so if he is caught up in state charges from New York AG Schneiderman....Donnie may lose his willingness to pardon others, AND...others may also be tied up in charges by Schneiderman, which can't be pardoned by Donnie.

But getting back to the subject at hand re Felt....the biggest parallel is the FBI stepping up to enforce justice on an administration far too willing to do wrong. 

« Last Edit: October 03, 2017, 01:37:00 PM by Buddy »
FOX (TASS) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

Martin Gisser

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 393
  • alias Mars Joh. P. Florifulgurator
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1260 on: October 01, 2017, 09:00:09 PM »
"But hey, I guess it could be just a fat guy on his bed."

Bill Maher tells the Kremlin Konnection:

(Warning: Contains Maher language)
"The universe is irrelevant for all practical purpose." --Florifulgurator

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1261 on: October 01, 2017, 09:44:56 PM »
Apparently the Boston Antifa accounts, touted to be Russian, is a pair of hucksters from oregon.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/taibbi-latest-fake-news-panic-appears-to-be-fake-news-w506396

sidd


Neven

  • Administrator
  • ASIF Governor
  • *****
  • Posts: 4068
    • View Profile
    • Arctic Sea Ice Blog
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1263 on: October 01, 2017, 11:07:49 PM »
Apparently the Boston Antifa accounts, touted to be Russian, is a pair of hucksters from oregon.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/taibbi-latest-fake-news-panic-appears-to-be-fake-news-w506396

sidd

The Post cited Oklahoma Senator James Lankford, a toothy, humorless, young Republican who looks like an escapee from a teen zombie movie. Lankford shocked the world this week by revealing that "Russian Internet trolls" were stoking the NFL kneeling debate.

Lankford made the revelation, the paper wrote, in a "hearing with the heads of the FBI, Department of Homeland Security and the National Counterterrorism Center."

This was the rare sort of story that garnered enthusiastic coverage from both houses of our increasingly bicameral system of media.

Conservative outlets like Breitbart and Newsmax and Fox played up the "Russians stoked the kneeling controversy" angle because it was in their interest to suggest that domestic support for kneeling protests is less than what it appears.

Meanwhile, outlets like the Post, CBS, Salon, and TPM bit on the story among other things because it furthered a longstanding narrative about Russian interference.

They all liked the story so much, it seemed, that nobody bothered to check it.

Jesus, what a mess this is becoming. In Austria there's a huge political scandal (parliamentary elections coming up) where the socialist party SPÖ hired some Israeli campaign guru who went on to set up fake Facebook accounts smearing the SPÖ itself as well the ÖVP and suggesting this was coming from the far-right FPÖ, thus killing two birds with one stone.

If you then think of all the stuff intelligence agencies are capable of, without leaving traces, no oversight, etc. How can you ever know if something is true or not, manipulated or not?  :-\

What a mess... Maybe it's time to let Internet anonymity go. But that's probably for another thread.
Il faut cultiver notre jardin

Martin Gisser

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 393
  • alias Mars Joh. P. Florifulgurator
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1264 on: October 02, 2017, 01:02:37 AM »
Apparently the Boston Antifa accounts, touted to be Russian, is a pair of hucksters from oregon.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/taibbi-latest-fake-news-panic-appears-to-be-fake-news-w506396

sidd

The Post cited Oklahoma Senator James Lankford, ...
...

They all liked the story so much, it seemed, that nobody bothered to check it.

Jesus, what a mess this is becoming. In Austria there's a huge political scandal (parliamentary elections coming up) where the socialist party SPÖ hired some Israeli campaign guru who went on to set up fake Facebook accounts smearing the SPÖ itself as well the ÖVP and suggesting this was coming from the far-right FPÖ, thus killing two birds with one stone.

If you then think of all the stuff intelligence agencies are capable of, without leaving traces, no oversight, etc. How can you ever know if something is true or not, manipulated or not?  :-\

What a mess... Maybe it's time to let Internet anonymity go. But that's probably for another thread.
One day I find the Fakebook Komplex scary,
another day methinks it's always been so
(remembering pre Internets cold war and them Russians then and their fertile soil).
Today, while seemingly in a tsunami of Fake (compared to back then),
also things are easier: One could simply check the stuff by googleling.

It may help "knowing" (being aware of) the mind mechanisms that help spread and amplify Fake. Looks like quite a task for psychology researchers and sociologists and educators etc. Or maybe it's much simpler: Why not just not care about not verified stories?

And then there is the question of shame: Fakers not feeling (getting felt) the shame of their business.

Anyhow this Komplex looks like a touchstone in current cultural evolution. Homo Sapiens Fakiens or Homo Sapiens Erectus? That is the question...
"The universe is irrelevant for all practical purpose." --Florifulgurator

Jim Pettit

  • Global Moderator
  • ASIF Upper Class
  • *****
  • Posts: 1060
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1265 on: October 03, 2017, 02:30:32 PM »
In news all but guaranteed to offend Russian apologists and adherents to bothsiderism everywhere, the Washington Post is out with an article detailing how Putin's taskmasters helped elect the Tangerine Toddler:

Russians took a page from corporate America by using Facebook tool to ID and influence voters:

"Russian operatives set up an array of misleading Web sites and social media pages to identify American voters susceptible to propaganda, then used a powerful Facebook tool to repeatedly send them messages designed to influence their political behavior, say people familiar with the investigation into foreign meddling in the U.S. election.

"The tactic resembles what American businesses and political campaigns have been doing in recent years to deliver messages to potentially interested people online. The Russians exploited this system by creating English-language sites and Facebook pages that closely mimicked those created by U.S. political activists.

"The Web sites and Facebook pages displayed ads or other messages focused on such hot-button issues as illegal immigration, African American political activism and the rising prominence of Muslims in the United States. The Russian operatives then used a Facebook “retargeting” tool, called Custom Audiences, to send specific ads and messages to voters who had visited those sites, say people familiar with the investigation who spoke on the condition of anonymity to share details from an ongoing investigation."

I know, I know: this doesn't fit into the "but everyone does it so no one has any right to complain about it ever" narrative, but, well, there you are.

AbruptSLR

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12976
    • View Profile
“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
― Leon C. Megginson

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1267 on: October 05, 2017, 08:18:25 PM »
Burr on senate russiagate enquiry:

1) exonerates Sessions in Mayflower meeting
2) claims that GOP platforms was not changed to favor Russia
3) warns that Steele dossier credibility is harmed absent interviews and answers from to Steele

https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/10/05/richard-burrs-tacit-warning-to-christopher-steele/

sidd

AbruptSLR

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12976
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1268 on: October 05, 2017, 10:58:58 PM »
Burr on senate russiagate enquiry:

1) exonerates Sessions in Mayflower meeting
2) claims that GOP platforms was not changed to favor Russia
3) warns that Steele dossier credibility is harmed absent interviews and answers from to Steele

https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/10/05/richard-burrs-tacit-warning-to-christopher-steele/

sidd

I think that Mueller has a much better shot at verifying the allegations of the dossier than does Burr.

Title: "'Trump dossier' on Russia links now part of special counsel's probe: sources"

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-russia-dossier/trump-dossier-on-russia-links-now-part-of-special-counsels-probe-sources-idUSKBN1C92WN

Extract: "The special counsel investigating whether Russia tried to sway the 2016 U.S. election has taken over FBI inquiries into a former British spy’s dossier of allegations of Russian financial and personal links to President Donald Trump’s campaign and associates, sources familiar with the inquiry told Reuters."
“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”
― Leon C. Megginson

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1269 on: October 06, 2017, 01:47:15 AM »
Burr/Warner  transcript:

http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1710/04/ip.02.html

"We can certifiably say that no vote totals were affected."

" The ICA looked at Russian -- let me, let me finish. Russian involvement in the election process. We're in agreement with that. We have not come to any determination on collusion or Russia's preferences. If we used solely the social media that we have (ph) seen, there's no way that you can look at that and say that that was to help the Right side of the ideological chart and -- and -- and not the Left. Or vice versa. They were indiscriminate. "

No evidence was proferred, nor did i expect any. So these are Burr and Warner telling us what they believe based on what they have seen.

Agreed on Mueller's superior resources. He can wiretap anyone, for one thing, and access NSA taps. But what he will tell us  is another story. I seem to recall a special prosecutor called John Durham under Attorney General Holder in the Obama years. Much was expected of them too. That pair did nothing, they were cool with torture.

sidd



Martin Gisser

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 393
  • alias Mars Joh. P. Florifulgurator
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1270 on: October 06, 2017, 02:05:08 AM »
Meanwhile:
Exclusive: Mueller's team met with Russia dossier author
October 5, 2017
Washington (CNN)  Special Counsel Robert Mueller's investigators met this past summer with the former British spy whose dossier [...] , according to two people familiar with the matter.
http://edition.cnn.com/2017/10/05/politics/special-counsel-russia-dossier-christopher-steele/index.html

It is totally unsurprising that Steele preferred to cooperate with Mueller, and not with Burr et al.
"The universe is irrelevant for all practical purpose." --Florifulgurator

Buddy

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2083
  • Go DUCKS!!
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1271 on: October 06, 2017, 02:12:35 AM »
Mueller is the only one he could trust....

Tick.....tick......tick Moron Don..😳
FOX (TASS) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

Martin Gisser

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 393
  • alias Mars Joh. P. Florifulgurator
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1272 on: October 06, 2017, 02:26:28 AM »
An estimate of the effect of Russian Fakebook trolling:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-switch/wp/2017/10/05/russian-propaganda-may-have-been-shared-hundreds-of-millions-of-times-new-research-says/
Russian propaganda may have been shared hundreds of millions of times, new research says
[...]
For six of the sites that have been made public — Blacktivists, United Muslims of America, Being Patriotic, Heart of Texas, Secured Borders and LGBT United — Albright found that the content had been “shared” 340 million times. That’s from a tiny sliver of the 470 accounts that have been made public. Even if those sites were unusually effective compared to the 464 others, Albright’s findings still suggest a total reach well into the billions of “shares” on Facebook.

The terminology is important here. For the purposes of these metrics, a “share” is essentially how often a post may have made its way into somebody’s Facebook “news feed” — without determining whether any of these users actually read the post. Another metric, called “interactions,” counts something narrower but more important -- the number of times individual users acted on what they had read by sharing a post with their Facebook “friends,” hitting the "like" button, making a comment or posting an emoji symbol.

That measurement for those six accounts, Albright's research showed, was 19.1 million. That means that more people had direct “interactions” with regular posts from just six accounts than saw the ads from all 470 pages and accounts that Facebook has identified as controlled by the Russian troll farm in St. Petersburg, called the Internet Research Agency.

[...]

From my Fakebook experience last year (and acquaintance with the wonders of the exponential function), I'm unsurprised.

-----------

The whole mess, of course has several factors. (Multiplicativity is what feeds the exponential...)
Here's the second big factor: Bannon's shit cannon.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/josephbernstein/heres-how-breitbart-and-milo-smuggled-white-nationalism
Here's How Breitbart And Milo Smuggled Nazi and White Nationalist Ideas Into The Mainstream
October 5, 2017

[...]
It’s a relationship illustrated most starkly by a previously unreleased April 2016 video in which Yiannopoulos sings “America the Beautiful” in a Dallas karaoke bar as admirers, including the white nationalist Richard Spencer, raise their arms in Nazi salutes.

These documents chart the Breitbart alt-right universe. They reveal how the website — and, in particular, Yiannopoulos — links the Mercer family, the billionaires who fund Breitbart, to underpaid trolls who fill it with provocative content, and to extremists striving to create a white ethnostate.

They capture what Bannon calls his “killing machine” in action, as it dredges up the resentments of people around the world, sifts through these grievances for ideas and content, and propels them from the unsavory parts of the internet up to TrumpWorld, collecting advertisers’ checks all along the way.

And the cache of emails — some of the most newsworthy of which BuzzFeed News is now making public — expose the extent to which this machine depended on Yiannopoulos, who channeled voices both inside and outside the establishment into a clear narrative about the threat liberal discourse posed to America.

[...]
(my italics)

And like a few kids in the hills of Macedonia have demonstrated, it doesn't take many heads to spread fake stuff widely via Fakebook and copy-paste websites for uncle and aunty Wingnut - and earn serious Google Ad money!
"The universe is irrelevant for all practical purpose." --Florifulgurator

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1273 on: October 06, 2017, 08:15:14 AM »
Upon rereading my last comment i think i should amend it. I stated:

"So these are Burr and Warner telling us what they believe based on what they have seen."

That should read:

"So these are Burr and Warner saying what they think will please their donors."

sidd

Buddy

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2083
  • Go DUCKS!!
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1274 on: October 06, 2017, 10:27:13 PM »
Zembla is a Dutch documentary program.  They have a series on Donald Trump...and many of you may have already viewed the series.  If this is a repeat of something I have already noted...I apologize.

Their THIRD and most recent video is especially illuminating of the money laundering that Trump is partaking in.  After viewing it....you will understand why it is going to take a while to unwind the convoluted trail of money laundering.

Google Zembla Trump video....and it will lead you to the videos.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2017, 05:22:06 PM by Buddy »
FOX (TASS) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 580
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1275 on: October 07, 2017, 04:16:10 AM »
Meanwhile:
Exclusive: Mueller's team met with Russia dossier author
October 5, 2017
Washington (CNN)  Special Counsel Robert Mueller's investigators met this past summer with the former British spy whose dossier [...] , according to two people familiar with the matter.
http://edition.cnn.com/2017/10/05/politics/special-counsel-russia-dossier-christopher-steele/index.html

It is totally unsurprising that Steele preferred to cooperate with Mueller, and not with Burr et al.

Interesting is that despite the claims made by Burr et al, apparently Steele has indicated that he "would be happy" to meet with Burr. See this starting at about 12:00 :


Not sure what's going on here, but there seem to be no obstacles for Burr and Steele to meet.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2017, 04:30:52 AM by Rob Dekker »

Martin Gisser

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 393
  • alias Mars Joh. P. Florifulgurator
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1276 on: October 07, 2017, 04:39:10 PM »
Google Zembla Trump video....and it will lead you to the videos.
Wow! Excellent work.
Didn't know about this documentary on Trump's connections to the Putin mafia.
Should be widely known. This is what makes the Trump complex so scary. Senator Sheldon Whitehouse gives a great quick explanation at 35min here:
"The universe is irrelevant for all practical purpose." --Florifulgurator

logicmanPatrick

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 244
    • View Profile
    • The Chatter Box
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1277 on: October 10, 2017, 12:41:11 AM »
Re: Trump's connections to the Putin mafia.

There are some very interesting links to names of people and firms which keep cropping up in connection with Trump.  If I can stumble across so many links while looking for some unrelated legal info, then I expect the professional investigators must by now have reams of documents sufficient to impeach Trump. But -
But there is a huge difference between the resources and experience that people such as Krasner and Machitsky have at their disposal and those available at most information services.

https://www.riseproject.ro/operatiunea-vostok-spionaj-industrial/


Russian mobsters have bought up, not only the aluminium industry of many former soviet bloc countries, but electricity companies as well.  These same people have invested or created shell companies in many countries.  They have also long since turned to property investments.  Now, who do we know in the USA who brags a lot about his property investments?  ;)

Links (some duplication between sites):
https://www.occrp.org/en/component/content/article?id=26:lawsuit-gives-insight-into-power-industry
https://www.reportingproject.net/powerbrokers/sub_country02.html

The next site has English options, but this article is in Romanian.  Google translate is reasonably accurate for this page.
https://www.riseproject.ro/operatiunea-vostok-spionaj-industrial/
si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes

logicmanPatrick

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 244
    • View Profile
    • The Chatter Box
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1278 on: October 10, 2017, 04:21:18 AM »
Botnews.

NYT - How Russia Harvested American Rage to Reshape U.S. Politics

Rather than construct fake grass-roots support behind their ideas — the public relations strategy known as “Astroturfing” — the Russians sought to cultivate and influence real political movements, Mr. Kelly said.

“It isn’t Astroturfing — they’re throwing seeds and fertilizer onto social media,” said Mr. Kelly. “You want to grow it, and infiltrate it so you can shape it a little bit.”

Oxford Releases Shocking Findings on 2016 Election & Twitter Bots

While it has become quite apparent that Russia had influenced the 2016 presidential election to some extent, the President of the United States, Donald Trump, still seems to be in denial over any such influence, especially when it’s suggested that such actions helped him win the election. With that said, Oxford University has just released their findings regarding the 2016 election and the Twitter bots which clearly had an impact on the results.

...

Clearly these Russian Twitter bots targeted those who could influence the election results the most, showing that a clear strategy was in play when these bot accounts set out to begin influencing the American electorate. The entire report from Oxford University can be viewed here.

Map from Oxford pdf below :-
si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1279 on: October 10, 2017, 07:31:12 AM »
I looked at the pdf on the Oxford release. They distinguish between "professional" and "junk" news sources. But i did not see a list of "junk" news sources or the "professional" sources. Anyone got link to that data ? I did go thru a bunch of the references, but have not so far found those lists.

http://comprop.oii.ox.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/89/2017/09/Polarizing-Content-and-Swing-States.pdf

If the junk list is the same as as Washington Post/Prop or Not list for junk news, i already have a copy, thanks.

The best i found was

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C36&q=Howard%2C+P.+N.%2C+Bolsover%2C+G.%2C+Kollanyi%2C+B.%2C+Bradshaw%2C+S.+%26+Neudert%2C+L.-M.+Junk+News+and+Bots+during+the+U.S.+Election%3A+What+Were+Michigan+Voters+Sharing+Over+Twitter%3F+%282017%29&btnG=

which stated:

"Junk News. This content includes various forms of propaganda and ideologically extreme, hyper-partisan, or conspiratorial political news and information. Much of this content is deliberately produced false reporting. It seeks to persuade readers about the moral virtues or failings of organizations, causes or people and presents commentary as a news product. This content is produced by organizations that do not employ professional journalists, and the content uses attention grabbing techniques, lots of pictures, moving images, excessive capitalization, ad hominem attacks, emotionally charged words and pictures, unsafe generalizations and other logical fallacies."

O dear. Thats cnn, fox, msnbc and, in fact every mainstream news channel. But i suspect those are classified "professional."

As for WikiLeaks, the last reference "Tweets with these links usually offer unverified claims and the suggestion that WikiLeaks.org provides evidence."

Wikileaks has never been shown to lie. More than i can say about the "professional" news sources.

Absent detail data, i classify the Oxford report as "junk."

sidd
« Last Edit: October 10, 2017, 07:47:56 AM by sidd »

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 580
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1280 on: October 10, 2017, 10:44:53 AM »
"Junk News. This content includes various forms of propaganda and ideologically extreme, hyper-partisan, or conspiratorial political news and information. Much of this content is deliberately produced false reporting. It seeks to persuade readers about the moral virtues or failings of organizations, causes or people and presents commentary as a news product. This content is produced by organizations that do not employ professional journalists, and the content uses attention grabbing techniques, lots of pictures, moving images, excessive capitalization, ad hominem attacks, emotionally charged words and pictures, unsafe generalizations and other logical fallacies."

O dear. Thats cnn, fox, msnbc and, in fact every mainstream news channel. But i suspect those are classified "professional."

Interesting how you so easily claim that every news network in the Western hemisphere matches that description, and then oh so easily move on to claim that " i classify the Oxford report as "junk." ".
without providing ANY evidence whatsoever.

Your pro-Russian bias is blatantly obvious.

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 580
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1281 on: October 10, 2017, 10:54:35 AM »
Manafort is in trouble :

Handwritten ledgers show $12.7 million in undisclosed cash payments designated for Mr. Manafort from Mr. Yanukovych’s pro-Russian political party from 2007 to 2012, according to Ukraine’s newly formed National Anti-Corruption Bureau.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/15/us/politics/paul-manafort-ukraine-donald-trump.html

TerryM

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2053
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1282 on: October 10, 2017, 10:12:29 PM »
Manafort is in trouble :

Handwritten ledgers show $12.7 million in undisclosed cash payments designated for Mr. Manafort from Mr. Yanukovych’s pro-Russian political party from 2007 to 2012, according to Ukraine’s newly formed National Anti-Corruption Bureau.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/15/us/politics/paul-manafort-ukraine-donald-trump.html


I'm sure that you noted the date on the NYT article. This isn't news, it's history.
In 2012 the head of the National Anti-Corruption Bureau was headed by none other than Victor Yanukovych himself.


Do you remember back in 2014 when the newly appointed Commissioner quit less than 6 months into her term because she didn't perceive that there was any will to curb corruption in Poroshenko's Ukraine?


As I said, not news but history.
Terry

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1283 on: October 11, 2017, 01:36:13 AM »
Republicans on House intelligence committee issue Fusion GPS subpoenas overriding democrats.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/10/politics/fusion-gps-subpoenas-devin-nunes/index.html

sidd

Martin Gisser

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 393
  • alias Mars Joh. P. Florifulgurator
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1284 on: October 11, 2017, 06:35:19 AM »
Republicans on House intelligence committee issue Fusion GPS subpoenas overriding democrats.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/10/politics/fusion-gps-subpoenas-devin-nunes/index.html

sidd
Nunes is a wacko gone berserk. Nobody takes his subpoenas seriously.
"The universe is irrelevant for all practical purpose." --Florifulgurator

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 580
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1285 on: October 11, 2017, 10:05:47 AM »
Nunes subpoenas very much look like "if you don't like the message, attack the messenger".

Is there ANY item in the Steele 'dossier' that has been proven false yet ?

TerryM

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2053
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1286 on: October 11, 2017, 04:57:53 PM »
Nunes subpoenas very much look like "if you don't like the message, attack the messenger".

Is there ANY item in the Steele 'dossier' that has been proven false yet ?


I think so. Didn't Steele place one of Trump's lawyers in (Moscow?), when his passport showed him to be somewhere far from there?


Terry

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1287 on: October 12, 2017, 12:33:55 AM »
Looks like the Feds flipped Awan's wife. Separate lawyers, and she's filed for divorce.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/09/imran-awans-own-wife-accuses-him-of-fraud/

sidd

NevB

  • ASIF Lurker
  • Posts: 11
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1288 on: October 12, 2017, 03:08:53 AM »
The making of a Russian disinformation campaign: What it takes

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/10/11/opinions/the-making-of-a-russian-disinformation-campaign-opinion-weiss/index.html

What Alexander Herzen, the great 19th-century Russian liberal, said he feared most for the future was "Genghis Khan with the telegraph."

This doesn't contain any new evidence however I thought there is some relevance in the history, reasoning and mechanics of Russian disinformation campaigns.

Yes I know the US does the same in different ways. The difference though is that the media is and has been far more open and free in the west which makes these operations more effective for Russia.




sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1289 on: October 12, 2017, 03:21:01 AM »
"The difference though is that the media is and has been far more open and free in the west ..."

Agreed that the media is more free of overt control in the West. Covert control is a different matter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird

http://impiousdigest.com/cias-operation-mockingbird/

"...   in a discussion with Philip Graham, the editor of the The Washington Post, a CIA operative commented derisively on the availability and prices of journalists willing to peddle CIA propaganda and cover stories: “You could get a journalist cheaper than a good call girl, for a couple hundred dollars a month.”

sidd

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1290 on: October 12, 2017, 08:15:26 AM »
That Awan case might have legs. In addition to the  scams he was running in DC, the guy was bribing the Pakistani cops in land scams for his dad since 2009. In addition to some casual bigamy on the side, and some wife/girlfriend beating. No surprise that his wife flipped on him.

https://www.dawn.com/news/944935

http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/02/wasserman-schultz-it-aide-bragged-he-paid-pakistani-police-for-protection/

"I have these guys that work for the Faisalabad police department, and all we have to do is pay them $100 a month and they take them over to the police station, strip their clothes off, hang them upside down and beat them with a shoe. And that person will work hard and be loyal from then on."

Charming. And that guy had access to scores of congress reps credentials.

sidd
« Last Edit: October 12, 2017, 08:21:09 AM by sidd »

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 580
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1291 on: October 12, 2017, 09:36:45 AM »
Nunes subpoenas very much look like "if you don't like the message, attack the messenger".

Is there ANY item in the Steele 'dossier' that has been proven false yet ?


I think so. Didn't Steele place one of Trump's lawyers in (Moscow?), when his passport showed him to be somewhere far from there?


Terry

Refresh my memory, but exactly which lawyer are you talking about here ? And exactly where was he ? In short, a reference would be helpful.

Martin Gisser

  • ASIF Citizen
  • Posts: 393
  • alias Mars Joh. P. Florifulgurator
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1292 on: October 12, 2017, 09:45:40 AM »
Refresh my memory, but exactly which lawyer are you talking about here ? And exactly where was he ? In short, a reference would be helpful.
Michael Cohen.
He denies stuff. But that does not mean it is false. Nothing of the Dossier has yet been proven false. Some has not yet been verified, like this Cohen-in-Prague stuff and the pee-pee-tape. A lot however has turned out correct.

http://www.businessinsider.de/michael-cohen-pushes-back-on-steele-dossier-amid-russia-firestorm-2017-8
The dossier, compiled by ex-British spy Christopher Steele, paints Cohen as a central figure in the Trump-Russia controversy, alleging that he was a key player in "the ongoing secret liaison relationship between the New York tycoon's campaign and the Russian leadership." It also alleges that he secretly met with Kremlin officials in Prague last August, at the height of the presidential campaign.

"We have not uncovered a single document that would in any way corroborate the dossier’s allegations regarding Mr. Cohen, nor do we believe that any such document exists," said Cohen's letter to the House Intelligence Committee
"The universe is irrelevant for all practical purpose." --Florifulgurator

Jim Pettit

  • Global Moderator
  • ASIF Upper Class
  • *****
  • Posts: 1060
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1293 on: October 12, 2017, 12:48:36 PM »
Looks like the Feds flipped Awan's wife. Separate lawyers, and she's filed for divorce.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/09/imran-awans-own-wife-accuses-him-of-fraud/

sidd

Interesting. But out of curiosity, how does a breathless story on an extreme right opinion website* about a fired IT guy and his marital troubles in any way relate to Trump and the GOP enlisting Putin's help in getting elected?

* - From MediaBiasFactCheck.org: "[M]oderately to strongly biased toward conservative causes through story selection and/or political affiliation. They may utilize strong loaded words (wording that attempts to influence an audience by using appeal to emotion or stereotypes), publish misleading reports and omit reporting of information that may damage conservative causes. Some sources in this category may be untrustworthy."

Buddy

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2083
  • Go DUCKS!!
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1294 on: October 12, 2017, 04:33:26 PM »
The continued discovery of how Facebook and Twitter were used so extensively by Russians during and AFTER the election will eventually leave Trump naked.  This will eventually lead back to the public conversation of TREASON by the Trump family and others.  Whether they will be found guilty of treason or not....is an open question.  But there does NOT have to be an "active physical war" ongoing to be found guilty of treason.

The next few months will take the conversation to a "new level" both in the public at large....and in Congress.  As the things that Russia did during and after the election......and what Trump has done over the past decade or more become public knowledge.....the outrage will grow against Trump and his family.  The extent of the money laundering.....the extent of his lying....and the extent of his continued ineptness in office, will drive his approval numbers lower.

He has NEVER been anything more than a con man.....and he will leave a black mark in US presidential history.

The good thing of course (assuming he doesn't start a nuclear war) is that the bigots, the liars, the fake Christians (hi Sean Hannity and Sarah Huckabee) will be left bare.  The FRAUDS at FOX News will also be left bare.

When the tide goes out.....like it is doing now.....people without a swimsuit are exposed.😳  Especially an authoritarian, bigoted, illiterate, ignorant moron like Trump.

Tick....tick.....tick....Donnie.  You're time is slowly running out.  And you can run, but you can not hide.
FOX (TASS) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1295 on: October 12, 2017, 08:09:11 PM »
Re: relevance of Awan case

Awan had access to many democratic congressional reps computers, network access, and credentials. The case may illuminate the leaks of DNC and other documents by guccifer and wikileaks. Especially the (lack of) security measures in those networks.

sidd
« Last Edit: October 12, 2017, 10:47:43 PM by sidd »

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1296 on: October 12, 2017, 10:47:29 PM »
Former Attorney General to meet with Senate and House intelligence committees:

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/355157-former-ag-lynch-to-meet-with-house-senate-russia-investigators

sidd

Buddy

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2083
  • Go DUCKS!!
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1297 on: October 13, 2017, 03:41:51 AM »
Interesting tidbit tonight from a segment on Rachel:

An attorney that used to work on some of Donald Trumps matters......is now representing one of the Russians that was meeting the infamous Trump Tower meeting.

Isn't THAT odd? 😱

Not only does he have bad execution of the decisions he makes.....he really makes bad decisions.

I really do want to see Donnie called to be questioned UNDER OATH.  Where his continual lying will carry a price.
FOX (TASS) News....."The Trump Channel.....where truth and journalism are dead."

TerryM

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 2053
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1298 on: October 13, 2017, 05:38:11 AM »

* - From MediaBiasFactCheck.org: "[M]oderately to strongly biased toward conservative causes through story selection and/or political affiliation. They may utilize strong loaded words (wording that attempts to influence an audience by using appeal to emotion or stereotypes), publish misleading reports and omit reporting of information that may damage conservative causes. Some sources in this category may be untrustworthy."


I'm sure that you're aware that MBFC is itself demonized as a biased site.


Rather than relying on anonymous fact checkers I'd advise everyone to do their own "fact checking". I've found both truth and lies in both left and right biased sites.


The Awan story may prove interesting. Those that believe there is nothing here should welcome this opportunity to put the rumors to rest.


As a Democratic party supporter of many decades I'm disappointed at learning how my donations were spent, or misspent. At one time I was in the position of being the only one with any computer literacy in a moderately sized office, the opportunities to do mischief were certainly there.


As I understand it it's still unclear as to whether he'll be questioned about the leaks.


Terry

sidd

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1521
    • View Profile
Re: Russiagate
« Reply #1299 on: October 13, 2017, 07:35:17 AM »
" ... it's still unclear as to whether he'll be questioned about the leaks."

Of course they are questioning him about everything.

What is publicly known is that Capitol police are investigating offsite data transfer and equipment fraud, FBI on him for fraudulent mortgage loans, Pakistani cops for land scams.

That guy is so screwed. They got him over a barrel. His wife is doing independent defense, probably has flipped.  From his history, sounds like he will fold and rat out everyone he knows.

The only question is if the feds will step in and assert state secrets like they do on most embarassments.

Of course, it  all leaks these days.

sidd