Support the Arctic Sea Ice Forum and Blog

Author Topic: Solar Roadways  (Read 38560 times)

Tor Bejnar

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1975
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 53
  • Likes Given: 14
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #350 on: January 27, 2018, 05:04:30 PM »
Quote
Cutting down trees to provide direct sunlight onto panels is, environmentally, robbing Peter to pay Paul.  I say keep the trees.
(SteveMDFP)

I live in a forest and my roof gets only 2 or 3 hours of sunshine.  I'm envious of you folks who have hobby (or whatever) solar panels (like I did 20+ years ago).  I have permission to cut neighbor's trees to put in solar, but the trees (oaks, pine, magnolia, etc.) are precious, and they stay, at least last for now. (Someday a hurricane will topple one or more onto or into my home as 5 or 6 of my neighbors have experienced in the last two years.  Maybe solar gets installed after that!   :-\)
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 05:08:53 PM by Tor Bejnar »
Arctic ice is healthy for children and other living things.

gerontocrat

  • ASIF Governor
  • Posts: 2593
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 185
  • Likes Given: 3
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #351 on: January 27, 2018, 06:41:41 PM »
Quote
Cutting down trees to provide direct sunlight onto panels is, environmentally, robbing Peter to pay Paul.  I say keep the trees.
(SteveMDFP)

I live in a forest and my roof gets only 2 or 3 hours of sunshine.  I'm envious of you folks who have hobby (or whatever) solar panels (like I did 20+ years ago).  I have permission to cut neighbor's trees to put in solar, but the trees (oaks, pine, magnolia, etc.) are precious, and they stay, at last for now. (Someday a hurricane will topple one or more onto or into my home as 5 or 6 of my neighbors have experienced in the last two years.  Maybe solar gets installed after that!   :-\)
A little wind turbine - perhaps(as it seems you are in a windy location?)

Consumers guide (UK)
https://www.which.co.uk/reviews/wind-turbines/article/installing-a-wind-turbine/home-wind-turbines
Quote
Wind turbine price

As an indication, the Energy Saving Trust (EST) estimates that domestic wind turbines (including installation and VAT) cost:
Up to £3,000 for a roof-mounted 1kW micro wind turbine
Between £9,900 and £19,000 for a 2.5kW pole-mounted wind turbine
Between £21,000 and £30,000 for a 6kW pole-mounted wind turbine.

Although micro roof-mounted wind turbines are cheaper, they are also less efficient and produce a lot less electricity than pole-mounted ones.

PRACTICAL?
The Energy Saving Trust's wind turbine study in 2009 concluded that fewer sites than previously predicted were suitable for the technology, and homeowners should first install an anemometer (wind gauge) for at least three months to determine the average wind speed for the location before investing in a wind turbine.  Many wind turbine manufacturers, and the Energy Saving Trust, recommend installing at sites with a local average wind speed of 5m/s or more. The vast majority of UK households have an average wind speed of less than this.

"Para a Causa do Povo a Luta Continua!"
"And that's all I'm going to say about that". Forrest Gump

Tor Bejnar

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1975
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 53
  • Likes Given: 14
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #352 on: January 27, 2018, 07:38:35 PM »
Sorry for the OT, but in reply, gerontocrat, Florida is pretty lousy for wind, until you get to 140 meters.
Arctic ice is healthy for children and other living things.

Sigmetnow

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12028
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 88
  • Likes Given: 33
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #353 on: January 27, 2018, 08:16:13 PM »
You're welcome :)


I've really tried to work up some kind of enthusiasm, but the efficacy of the product escapes me. I presently have a section of heated pavement that keeps the entrance to the underground parking clear. Old tech that's been in place since 1997.
The problem is that it never receives direct sunlight.
My California house has a wide concrete drive, but the trees shade it except for a few winter months. If electricity was such a concern that I'd be willing to cut down the trees, I'd probably prefer a solar shade to solar paving. (especially after I'd done away with the shade trees.)
 
Terry

Passive systems such as mirrors that concentrate and deflect sunlight to the surfaces that need to melt might work.

At first glance, this seems like a great idea!  Are you aware of any places or products that have attempted it?
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Sigmetnow

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12028
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 88
  • Likes Given: 33
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #354 on: January 27, 2018, 08:21:20 PM »
Quote
Cutting down trees to provide direct sunlight onto panels is, environmentally, robbing Peter to pay Paul.  I say keep the trees.
(SteveMDFP)

I live in a forest and my roof gets only 2 or 3 hours of sunshine.  I'm envious of you folks who have hobby (or whatever) solar panels (like I did 20+ years ago).  I have permission to cut neighbor's trees to put in solar, but the trees (oaks, pine, magnolia, etc.) are precious, and they stay, at last for now. (Someday a hurricane will topple one or more onto or into my home as 5 or 6 of my neighbors have experienced in the last two years.  Maybe solar gets installed after that!   :-\)

Sounds like a job for: community solar!  :)

https://www.energysage.com/solar/community-solar/community-solar-power-explained/
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Sleepy

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 942
  • Every day you live, something else dies.
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 34
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #355 on: January 27, 2018, 08:40:24 PM »
In Sweden we are taxed for sharing any form of solar.
https://www.nyteknik.se/opinion/vi-maste-fa-dela-pa-de-soligaste-taken-6887094
Made a seriously OT comment here earlier today:
https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,861.msg140148.html#msg140148
The mills are still grinding here, we'll see what happens in October...

No wonder our residential installations is not picking up speed.
Omnia mirari, etiam tritissima.

SteveMDFP

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 858
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 37
  • Likes Given: 1
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #356 on: January 27, 2018, 08:50:26 PM »
Or another stupid idea, maybe.
Select two particularly tall, study trees, on an E-W axis, above the height of surrounding trees.
Have an arborist mount a pulley high on each tree, with a sturdy nylon rope between them.
Build a rig for the solar panels such that, when hung from the rope, the panels are optimally oriented.

Use the pulleys to hoist the rig+panels above the other trees.  The assembly will tend to swing in the breeze, but  another rope and pulley system could be used to dampen the oscillations of the swinging. 

Pros:  solar power suitable for many wooded areas
Cons:  eyesore
          very labor-intensive setup
          possible damage to panels in strong winds
          hazardous tree-climbing to build the setup.

Maybe worth it, maybe not.  But material costs would be far less than a wind turbine.

P.S.  Sorry, that was off-topic for the thread.  To make the idea on-topic, lets use the solar roadway pieces to hang off the rope!

Sigmetnow

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12028
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 88
  • Likes Given: 33
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #357 on: January 27, 2018, 08:55:42 PM »
Oh! And solar roadways will never become a significant contributor to our efforts to eliminate our reliance on fossil fuels, an impact so infinitesimal as to escape notice.

Perhaps. But that’s better than carbon-positive, right? ;)  If the technology has the potential to reduce morbidity and mortality, and has net energy use that is less than a competing product, it deserves serious consideration for those aspects alone.
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Sleepy

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 942
  • Every day you live, something else dies.
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 34
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #358 on: January 27, 2018, 08:58:22 PM »
To make the idea on-topic, lets use the solar roadway pieces to hang off the rope!
That would be an improvement since the specs for the SolaRoad was 185W/m²!
Omnia mirari, etiam tritissima.

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1649
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 40
  • Likes Given: 41
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #359 on: January 30, 2018, 06:01:08 AM »
Not to rub anyone believer in the face, but Solar Freakin Roadways has produced a whopping 0.09 kWh of energy today ! With peak power (around noon) of, wait for it....  20 W. Which appears to be rather typical for a day in January.

https://enlighten.enphaseenergy.com/pv/public_systems/V3vh1173801/overview

Yes, folks, this entire array, which promised to show that Solar Freakin Roadway would change the world as we know it, produced 20 W at the peak today. A whopping 90 Wh over the whole day. About 1 dollar cent worth of electricity.

They did not produce any numbers for how much energy they used to power their disco lights, but an educated guess it something like 10 W/panel times 30 panels = 300 W, over 24 hours that is 7.2 kWh used. Even at the peak in July did they generate only 1 kWh/day, which means they are essentially showing off a very expensive ($60,000) energy negative disco light show.

The only thing that blows my mind is that there are still people out there believing the snake oil salesmen tactics of these scammers.

Sleepy

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 942
  • Every day you live, something else dies.
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 34
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #360 on: January 30, 2018, 08:37:13 AM »
Sandpoint Idaho is at ~48°N right? Here's from another ten degreees further north (panels at ground level and up to a maxiumum of ~2.5 metres above ground):
I had a bad day yesterday. 278W peak and 0.48kWh in total, due to a lot of snowfall, my satellite dish also stopped receiving signals.
This was Saturday:
We have a really simple rule of thumb here. 1000kWh per year for every 1000Wp (decently) installed. Panel efficiency determines area.
Inspired by this, I ordered a kit today, the sun will return... 2x270Wp and a dual inverter. 430 € inc VAT. That's less than 0.8 €/Wp.
This is probably one of the best hobbies I've ever had.
I pay ~150 € per 1000kWh for my electricity all in all, produced by wind.
It's pretty easy to see when a system will break even at <0.8 €/W, inverter included. Zero discounts on such a small order. Just above five years.

I actually had some sun shining through the clouds today (sun is still low at the horizon), peak 1300W and 3.23kWh in total. :)

February is coming and that's the mystery month here, Nov-Jan usually sucks, adding an image from an old system in Västerås (not mine, partly shaded by trees, used to be 3260Wp and upgraded since then) which shows this nicely when comparing monthly output between 2010-2014.
Omnia mirari, etiam tritissima.

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1649
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 40
  • Likes Given: 41
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #361 on: January 30, 2018, 09:48:12 AM »
No worries, Sleepy. You are still producing 10X what Solar Freakin Roadways is producing.
And your system did not cost $60,000.-.

Sleepy

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 942
  • Every day you live, something else dies.
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 34
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #362 on: February 28, 2018, 11:47:51 AM »
A rather old but still "pilot project" in Jönköping on a small strech of the road on a 7% incline, using pipes streching out on the sides of the asphalt to ensure drainage.
...
Also adding a webcam image from Saturday when there was some light snow. The temperature then was -1.5°C... :)
...

Had a look at their webcams today. Adding today's sunny images from that heated piece of road in Jönköping at -8°C. Both the upper and lower part.
Omnia mirari, etiam tritissima.

TerryM

  • ASIF Governor
  • Posts: 3631
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 16
  • Likes Given: 5
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #363 on: March 04, 2018, 10:30:36 PM »
The Chinese are apparently going ahead with a Solar Highway that will charge your car as you drive - at 120 kmph.


https://sputniknews.com/science/201803031062199376-china-solar-highway-2022/

Could cut way back on the size of battery each vehicle requires.

Terry

Sleepy

  • ASIF Middle Class
  • Posts: 942
  • Every day you live, something else dies.
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 34
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #364 on: March 05, 2018, 05:13:53 AM »
Maybe it will be more successful on those lower latitudes, Terry.
They really seem to need that new stretch of road anyway. From that article:
Quote
"I always leave some time for when I have to drive on the Hangzhou-Ningbo Expressway, as traffic jams are frequent," Shi Xiaobai, a businessman commuter on the Hangzhou-Ningbo Expressway told the Global Times on Sunday. "And it took me four hours to get from Hangzhou to Shaoxing on February 18."
That's 64.5 kilometres.
Omnia mirari, etiam tritissima.

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1649
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 40
  • Likes Given: 41
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #365 on: March 06, 2018, 08:45:55 AM »
The Chinese are apparently going ahead with a Solar Highway that will charge your car as you drive - at 120 kmph.


https://sputniknews.com/science/201803031062199376-china-solar-highway-2022/

Could cut way back on the size of battery each vehicle requires.

Terry

To "cut way back on the size of battery each vehicle requires" the entire road would have to be equipped with induction coils. And all the electric cars would have to be equipped with receiving induction coils as well. And the efficiency of the transfer would have to be close to or as good as charging a battery with a wire.

We are a long way from there.

From the article :

Quote
China's first solar expressway with a length of 1 kilometer was opened for testing in December 2017 in East China's Jinan. But it was vandalized and had sensitive parts stolen from it five days after opening, the Beijing Youth Daily said.

Sigmetnow

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12028
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 88
  • Likes Given: 33
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #366 on: March 06, 2018, 04:36:04 PM »
The Brusaw’s Solar Roadways team and one of their manufacturing partners were invited to speak in the UAE recently.

Quote
Solar Roadways was honored to accept a very exciting speaking engagement invitation in the UAE! Scott, one of our team members and an interested manufacturing partner have just returned from a wonderful trip to Dubai and Abu Dhabi. In addition to the speaking engagement, they had many meetings with interested customers and distributors in government and the private sector. Happy to have so much interest from this beautiful country! ... From the level of interest there, it sounds like there will be more opportunities in the near future.
https://www.facebook.com/solarroadways/posts/10154971694577126
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Rob Dekker

  • ASIF Upper Class
  • Posts: 1649
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 40
  • Likes Given: 41
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #367 on: March 07, 2018, 08:19:47 AM »
The Brusaw’s Solar Roadways team and one of their manufacturing partners were invited to speak in the UAE recently.

Well. What do you know.
Maybe the UAE took it serious when I suggested to put a solar roadway over their Hype-R-loop:
https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php/topic,1094.msg143777.html#msg143777

Sorry. I couldn't resist.

Sigmetnow

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12028
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 88
  • Likes Given: 33
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #368 on: April 21, 2018, 02:07:00 PM »
The Brusaw’s have finalized their version 4 design of their Solar Roadway modules and are preparing for manufacturing later this year.
Quote
Exciting News: Scott completed the SR4 design this week! That will be the model released to the public this year with the help of our manufacturing partners. First one is in Ohio. In negotiations now with second group in Idaho and in talks with others around the world.
https://www.facebook.com/solarroadways/posts/10155071230657126

Other recent progress:
Quote
Solar Roadways is having more and more meetings with international connections. Although we email with people from all over the world every week, there is nothing like meeting in person to move things forward. This week we had a wonderful visit from a South Korean company interested in Manufacturing/Distribution opportunities to bring SR to the Asian Market. Last month, we had a visitor from Australia wanting to help introduce SR to the Australian market. In February, SR went to Dubai and Abu Dhabi and met with interested Customers, Manufacturers and Distributors interested in introducing Solar Road panels to the Middle East Market. Next month we have visitors coming who are interested in the African Market. And we are in talks with our friends in Austria who want to introduce SR to the European Market. We are working to find the perfect partners to bring panels to each corner of the world. ...
https://www.facebook.com/solarroadways/posts/10155053971637126
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Sigmetnow

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12028
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 88
  • Likes Given: 33
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #369 on: July 05, 2018, 12:46:44 AM »
From Solar Roadways:
Quote
Great article about E-Mek, our first Manufacturing Partners in Ohio and the jobs they plan to create making Solar Road Panels. So glad they are getting help from their state too:

"With the help of the Dayton Development Coalition, E-Mek was awarded $40,000 in economic development grant funding from JobsOhio to invest in new production equipment, which will help create the dozens of new jobs it is projecting."

They are busy gearing up and believe they will have the first panels ready later this year. ...
https://www.facebook.com/41869107125/posts/10155213007397126/

Solar panel production bringing 50 jobs to Dayton, Ohio region
Quote
Vandalia-based E-Mek Technologies, a contract manufacturer that specializes in printed circuit boards, has entered into an agreement with Solar Roadways LLC to make solar roadway panels at its 50,000-square-foot facility. These modular panels include solar cells to generate energy, a heating element to melt snow and LED lights that can be programmed to direct automobile and foot traffic. They are designed to replace traditional asphalt and concrete surfaces. ...
https://www.bizjournals.com/dayton/news/2018/06/28/solar-panel-production-bringing-50-jobs-to-dayton.html
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Sigmetnow

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12028
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 88
  • Likes Given: 33
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #370 on: July 15, 2018, 02:08:35 PM »
Tokyo Announces Plan To Install Solar Roads In Time For 2020 Olympics
Quote
Some solar panelling has already been installed on a trial basis in the Sagamihara, Kanagawa Prefecture by a Seven-Eleven. The technology was only introduced in May, but a manager at the Seven-Eleven store told the Business Times that it's starting to pay off.

"(The solar road system) can generate 16,145 kilowatt-hours of electricity annually, covering about 9 per cent of the entire electricity the store consumes."

It's important that the roads begin generating power more quickly, because they are currently quite expensive to install. Both France and the Netherlands have been experimenting with solar roads, and in France, it costs about 5 million euros for ever kilometer of road.

Japan has decided to continue the introduction of solar roads on government owned property, and will more likely focus on parking lots. The wider surface area can generate more electricity and justify the cost of installation.

Installation is supposed to begin during the 2019 fiscal year, and the process is intensive.

The road is made of solar panels that are installed in the ground, then covered in a special resin that makes them durable under the weight of traffic.

If this technology were more widely used, it would greatly reduce the cost of installation, as the components could be more affordably mass produced. So implementing any usage is increasing the likelihood of solar roads everywhere.
https://www.greenmatters.com/news/2018/06/11/ZdfqoX/tokyo-solar-road-olympics
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.

Sigmetnow

  • ASIF Emperor
  • Posts: 12028
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 88
  • Likes Given: 33
Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #371 on: July 18, 2018, 02:16:13 PM »
Quote
Exciting news: Today Solar Roadways was selected as one of 25 semi-finalists out of over 800 entries from all over the world in the Postcard Lottery Green Challenge!

The Postcode Lottery Green Challenge is one of the world's largest competitions in the field of sustainable entrepreneurship.

Five finalists will be invited to present in Amsterdam in September.

"The results are in! These 25 start-ups are in the running to win €500k to develop their innovative plans to save the planet."
https://m.facebook.com/41869107125/posts/10155239930737126/

https://greenchallenge.info/info/946-25-green-start-ups-that-are-changing-the-world
People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.