Who should be the Democratic nominee for President in 2020?

[budmantis]

This article about Joe Biden made me wonder whether it was time to open a thread about who would be the best candidate to earn the Democratic Presidential nomination in 2020. It may be a year, possibly more before anyone declares their candidacy, but I have been wondering for some time who would be best.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/joe-biden-2020-harvey-weinstein_us_5a0a0ba8e4b00a6eece3a13e?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009

Who should be the Democrat's nominee for President? Biden is considering a third attempt, Is Hillary Clinton? How about Eliz. Warren or Bernie Sanders? Who do you think would be the best choice for 2020?

[sidd]

Would like to add Sherrod Brown to the list.

Also, in case you didnt know, adding the icon for twitter or G+ (or facebook) triggers a whole lot of tracking. Please don't make me use blockers on this site also.

sidd

[budmantis]

Would like to add Sherrod Brown to the list.

Also, in case you didnt know, adding the icon for twitter or G+ (or facebook) triggers a whole lot of tracking. Please don't make me use blockers on this site also.

sidd

Didn't knowingly insert that, very annoying! How do I get rid of it?

BudM

[pileus]

Would like to see a credible and strong female candidate emerge.  America needs to have a female serve as POTUS, it's way overdue.  The appetite was proven with the 2016 vote tallies, with decisive results in both the Dem primary and general election.  Senator Warren is usually the first name mentioned, but I'm a bit skeptical she would have national appeal and be able to shake the attacks that Trump and the right wing have been directing towards her.  Senator Gillibrand is another high profile possibility.  Former Acting AG Yates has gotten some buzz, but it's unclear if she has national ambition.

Senator Merkely from Oregon is worth a look, and it's likely a few Californians will jockey for consideration, perhaps Gavin Newsome, maybe Rep Schiff.  VA Gov McAuliffe is know to have interest, and has been popular in the state.

[Neven]

Didn't knowingly insert that, very annoying! How do I get rid of it?

BudM

It's inserted in every opening post. I'll see if I can get rid of it as admin.

@ pileus

How about Kamala Harris? She's a woman AND she's black (don't know if she's lesbian and/or transgender). She doesn't have much of a track record - like Obama - so she can say just about anything, and she's sure not too swing too far left. After all, she made sure Steve Mnuchin wouldn't be prosecuted.

Warren is great, but she does tend to docilely toe the party line when she veers off too much from the center (which is right-wing everywhere else in the world).

[TerryM]

How about Tulsi Gabbard?
Whoever the Dems run, if running against Trump, should win. We should have a wide enough opening to fit a progressive through.
If Trump is impeached, or not nominated by the Reps, all bets are off.

Terry

[Neven]

How about Tulsi Gabbard?

I think she's a bit too stiff. For the presidency that is.

I think Nina Turner is great as a personality/speaker/inspirer (woman AND black), but I'm not sure she has the skills and experience for such a job.

Whoever it is, it is crucial that this person isn't completely tied to corporate interests, in the sense that they're effectively a puppet.

[Rob Dekker]

I still think Bernie should run again.

[budmantis]

I agree Rob, even at his advanced age!

BudM

[pileus]

I still think Bernie should run again.

Fully expected the thread to end up here, along with various and sundry snark from Northern Europeans that are out of touch with the American political landscape.

By all indications Bernie seems to be preparing to run, but Dems should again be cautious in entertaining the notion of a non-Democrat competing for the party nomination.  In addition to losing to HRC by 3.7 million votes, Bernie was unable to capture the votes of actual Democrats.  This could be a primary reason the Bro crowd is pushing to rig the process with more voter suppressing caucuses instead of democratic primaries.

Bernie also fails to appeal to the poor and working class, and lost to HRC at all income levels.

Bernie's only source of strength was the under 30 crowd, which includes a lot of the Bros.  This demographic is becoming a larger share of the electorate (although as the Bros age they may not be able to maintain their man-buns, so they will need to come up with a different look when they show up at the caucus to shout everyone down), so for Bernie to have any chance as the Dem nominee as a non-Dem, he would need to find a way to build and expand his appeal beyond one demographic.

I remain skeptical the he would prevail, but if so I  fear he would alienate a large portion of the core Dem constituency, handing the presidency to Republicans.  I have voted straight Dem since 1988, but I would never cast a vote for Bernie Sanders.

[Rob Dekker]

I have voted straight Dem since 1988, but I would never cast a vote for Bernie Sanders.

Why not ?

[Sigmetnow]

Some interesting and entertaining picks (and opinions) from the folks at FiveThirtyEight:

Our Way-Too-Early 2020 Democratic Primary Draft
Bookmark this to see how idiotic we look in four years.
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/our-way-too-early-2020-democratic-primary-draft/

[Rob Dekker]

As late as 7:00pm on election night, FiveThirtyEight, a trusted prognosticator of the election, gave Clinton a 71 percent chance of winning the presidency.

[Sigmetnow]

As late as 7:00pm on election night, FiveThirtyEight, a trusted prognosticator of the election, gave Clinton a 71 percent chance of winning the presidency.

And they've done sooooo many articles since then to try to explain why.

[sidd]

Parnes at thehill has a list:

Deval Patrick was a new one to me, dunno much about him.

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/361607-how-dem-insiders-rank-the-2020-contenders

sidd

[pileus]

I have voted straight Dem since 1988, but I would never cast a vote for Bernie Sanders.

Why not ?

I vote Democratic, he’s not a Democrat.  He was a destructive force in 2016 election, and he helped undermine Hillary Clinton and hand the presidency to Trump.  Many of his ideas are fantastical and vaporware, in other words not based in reality.  He doesn’t have the temperament to be potus.  He alienates core Dem constituencies.  Underlying all of that, he’s simply too advanced in age for the 2020 cycle.

[pileus]

I have a strong preference for a female candidate, I just don’t know if Warren can generate enthusiasm at a national level and overcome the ready made platform of attacks by the Trump/GOP crowd (lefty liberal from Mass, professorial, the disgusting “Pocahontas” label).  At 71 tho she would be a young contrast to some of the near octogenarians in consideration.

Any female candidate will need to deal with similar headwinds Hillary faced.  There is plenty of misogynist energy among the Leftist Bro crew that would be unleashed if their sainted candidate is unable to overcome the rigged process again.

[pileus]

This is an instructive 10 part tweet thread on the fraud that is Bernie Sanders.  Democrats would be wise to not fall for his nonsense.

https://mobile.twitter.com/i/status/939867982158876673

Since Sanders diehards are determined to hijack the @DNC and torpedo other 2020 contenders, and since he refuses to become a Democrat but wants to hog their spotlight and attack them, let's take a closer look at who this man is. (1/10)

[jai mitchell]

Peter Daou is a propagandist and none of his assertions are legitimate, none.

For example, the 1994 crime bill won his support because of the Assault Weapons Ban and the Violence Against Women provisions.  Compare that with Daou's later assertions that Bernie was in the pocket of the NRA.

https://berniesanders.com/press-release/sanders-voted-for-1994-crime-bill-to-support-assault-weapons-ban-violence-against-women-provisions/

It is pathetic that this clown asserts himself to be a 'progressive' when he is clearly a neoliberal establishment hack.

[idunno]

Since it's now been 2 days since anybody on the "Arctic Sea Ice Forum" had anything to say about "Arctic Sea Ice", I hope I can be forgiven for pointing out that I don't give a flying fuck about who is the democratic candidate in 2020?

For every 100 posts about US domestic politics here, surely the rest of the world is allowed one, occasionally, just to express regret that this forum, which was once an interesting source of information on an issue of international interest, in the present moment, and in the future, including 3 years hence - Arctic Sea Ice - is no longer covered here.

As for whether US domestic politics is covered well here.. Well, I personally prefer to rely on sites which have staffs with 600+ years of combined experience inside the beltway, multiple PhDs, lavish entertaiment budgets, and daily, hourly contacts with the major players.

Carry on, the rest of you, relying on Buddy's regular updates on why he cannot retune a television.

Meanwhile... IJIS. Severnaya I... (I forgot),j Chukchi, methane hydrate, wind off the ice thingy, has a name..., Does anybody reading this know whether ASI area today is low or high?

One day, a professional US political operator from, say, CAP, could visit this site. Is it useful to them to have to wade through 99 uninformed US political posts to reach the one actual factual scientific update

At present, AFAICT. this site has not reported any science WRT the Arctic Sea Ice for 48hours

[budmantis]

IDUNNO: I'm sure Neven will have something to add with regards to your post. Just so you're aware, I did ask Neven if political discussion had a place here in the Forum and he thought it did. Most or possibly even all of this discussion wouldn't be taking place here if it were not for Trump being the US president.

I don't think its fair for you to single out Buddy the way you have. If you don't like what he has to say, you can choose to ignore him.

BudM

[Pmt111500]

Since it's now been 2 days since anybody on the "Arctic Sea Ice Forum" had anything to say about "Arctic Sea Ice", I hope I can be forgiven for pointing out that I don't give a flying fuck about who is the democratic candidate in 2020?

For every 100 posts about US domestic politics here, surely the rest of the world is allowed one, occasionally, just to express regret that this forum, which was once an interesting source of information on an issue of international interest, in the present moment, and in the future, including 3 years hence - Arctic Sea Ice - is no longer covered here.

As for whether US domestic politics is covered well here.. Well, I personally prefer to rely on sites which have staffs with 600+ years of combined experience inside the beltway, multiple PhDs, lavish entertaiment budgets, and daily, hourly contacts with the major players.

Carry on, the rest of you, relying on Buddy's regular updates on why he cannot retune a television.

Meanwhile... IJIS. Severnaya I... (I forgot),j Chukchi, methane hydrate, wind off the ice thingy, has a name..., Does anybody reading this know whether ASI area today is low or high?

One day, a professional US political operator from, say, CAP, could visit this site. Is it useful to them to have to wade through 99 uninformed US political posts to reach the one actual factual scientific update

At present, AFAICT. this site has not reported any science WRT the Arctic Sea Ice for 48hours

:-) , it's been fun to follow how the signal-to-noise ratio here has been developing. No wonder actual scientists have somewhat abandoned us. Soon someone starts claiming this is a political site, which it was not for quite a while.

https://www.wired.com/story/two-melting-glaciers-could-decide-the-fate-of-our-coastlines/

But let it go to record, my opinion of the next candidate in 2018 elections for the democratic prez of Trumpistan is... Oh, I don't give a flying fuck either.

[wili]

"One day, a professional US political operator from, say, CAP, could visit this site. Is it useful to them to have to wade through 99 uninformed US political posts to reach the one actual factual scientific update"

I'm sure they would be able to figure out how to find the relevant threads and just look at those, without having to 'wade through' anything irrelevant to that topic. Are you having trouble doing the same? 

[Neven]

All of these discussions take place in the Off-Topic category and The Rest sub-category. Besides, it's hibernation time, an there simply isn't all that much to say about Arctic sea ice that can't be said in the monthly PIOMAS updates on the ASIB.

That said, I also regret that the political discussions have taken this turn and that most people can't think beyond mainstream/establishment narratives. I'm sorry for partaking in them, but I too have frustrations I need to vent, and US politics is one of the subjects that have my interest (less so during the melting season, I promise ).

[Pmt111500]

All of these discussions take place in the Off-Topic category and The Rest sub-category. Besides, it's hibernation time, an there simply isn't all that much to say about Arctic sea ice that can't be said in the monthly PIOMAS updates on the ASIB.

Well, imho it's kind of on topic in 'Policy and Solutions' and 'Walking the Walk'-sections, but it¨'s too bad Trumpistan has decided to rather destroy the coasts than enter the discussions about possibly saving those. I find it destructive and highly depressing. Just lately I noticed I've not read a scientific article for half a year since I've been politically busy dissing everything 'american' (by the meaning some talk of the USA). I still do not understand why a narcisissitic liar should be allowed nuclear codes. .

[Paddy]

This article may be of relevance here: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/09/08/the-top-15-possible-2020-democratic-nominees-ranked/

I'm a bit concerned regarding the age of some of the potential candidates. Jerry Brown, Bernie Sanders, and Joe Biden in particular.  The campaign trail is hard work, and the job itself still more so; it doesn't seem suitable for octogenarians. Plus all the made up stuff about Hillary's health in the last election could be only too easily recycled.

That said, I don't really know enough about most of the other candidates out there to really push for an alternative.

[oren]

I too dislike the political turn the forum has taken. Putting it OT is not enough. In the unread posts list which I use regularly, I need to wade through all the OT threads to get to the real stuff. And people here start hating each other over political issues, and bring it into the other threads, as it's one forum with one set of usernames. And worse of all, the posts in these threads are repetitive. I doubt anyone has changed his mind based on all these varying points of view. I keep seeing the same people always posting the same opinions. Totally useless.

[wili]

Paddy, can you quote relevant bits from the article. Some of us can't get WaPo without paying.

Oren, I hadn't noticed that phenomenon. I feel I can separate out political from scientific observations, usually.

[Paddy]

@Wili, the WP's top 10 were as follows (options 11 to 15 can likely be ignored):

10. Sen. Sherrod Brown (Ohio)

9. New York Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo

8. Sen. Cory Booker (N.J.)

7. Sen. Kamala D. Harris (Calif.)

6. Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (N.Y.)

5. California Gov. Jerry Brown

4. Sen. Elizabeth Warren (Mass.)

3. Sen. Chris Murphy (Conn.)

2. Former vice president Joe Biden

1. Sen. Bernie Sanders (Vt.)

@Oren,

Fair point, and I hold myself partly responsible since I wrote the poll that turned into a monster thread on the Trump presidency. I generally stay off these threads most of the time myself.

[colchonero]

" And worse of all, the posts in these threads are repetitive. I doubt anyone has changed his mind based on all these varying points of view. I keep seeing the same people always posting the same opinions. Totally useless."


Exactly.Because there almost aren't any different points of view. There was a poll "who are you going to vote for in 2016 election" and it was like 30-1 for HRC. I think, I am the only conservative on the forum, (not huge Trump fan to be fair) I'm very interested in politics, but I never write anything, cause I know,  I'll get many replies(not to be misunderstood, I don't mean it because someone will not let me write or attack me on that, no, it's just some people would disagree with my comments, because they have different POV and I don't want to get into discussion.

In fact I'm not a real conservative or liberal, it's just that I'm open minded in the way I like to hear different views than decide what do I find it makes more sense. For example I believe climate change is real, I am pro choice, but I really don't like socialism, people being offended by anything (this happens especially in the media and on internet, cause in the real life it hasn't gone exactly that far). Political correctness has gone to far for me personally. I want small government, less regulations, lower taxes etc.

Enough about me. I really think that if this forum wants to have political discussions other side has to be present too. Cause this doesn't make much sense. Someone is blaming Trump on XY issue and trying to convince people on forum that he is an idiot, but they already think that, so there is no actual achievement.

[Bruce Steele]

Charles Barkley
 Now OT. Oren , I too wish we were talking about something else besides Politics.( although ) I try to serve my time on committees and commit to the small time due diligence of Democratic processes. I am conflicted. I think my time is required because I question anyone who drawn to power. Damage control means sitting through all the days of pointless meetings until the one day arrives when your efforts ( your opinion ) might make a difference. Politics
 I am reduced into efforts at subsistence. So much seems preposterous , the knowledge of climate change in the detail contain herein, the ridiculous processes of politics. How is it we bridge the huge divide?
 
 

[Pmt111500]

I can't no more see a way to bridge the huge divide. Hence, I guess the extraordinary (for me) interest in politics. Maybe the side of those accepting science should just name their 'axis of evil' though it's a cheapo that will most certainly backfire (re:Al Gore plane)

[Rob Dekker]

And worse of all, the posts in these threads are repetitive. I doubt anyone has changed his mind based on all these varying points of view. I keep seeing the same people always posting the same opinions. Totally useless.

If we would all think alike then would it be more useful to have a discussion ?
Or would anyone change their mind ?

I think the political discussions on this forum are very helpful.
They tend to sharpen the mind, since they avoid "group think" and force to find out the facts more than any other topic of debate on this forum.

If we all agree with each other life would be rather dull.

[pileus]

Peter Daou is a propagandist and none of his assertions are legitimate, none.

For example, the 1994 crime bill won his support because of the Assault Weapons Ban and the Violence Against Women provisions.  Compare that with Daou's later assertions that Bernie was in the pocket of the NRA.

https://berniesanders.com/press-release/sanders-voted-for-1994-crime-bill-to-support-assault-weapons-ban-violence-against-women-provisions/

It is pathetic that this clown asserts himself to be a 'progressive' when he is clearly a neoliberal establishment hack.

“neoliberal,” the second most favorite conjuring term here after Corporate Democrat. 

The blind allegiance to Bernie by some is not very different than what is going on with Trump's core base.  Massive blind spots and a reflexive refusal to consider his flaws and weaknesses.

Bernie is a fraud and a phony.

[TerryM]

What an odd poll question, as matched by the odd responses.
Terry

[sidd]

Someone thinks Bernie will run in 2020 ... as a Democrat.

https://medium.com/@nikohouse/no-bernie-2020-will-not-be-the-same-as-2016-cd0dddde481a

Dunno if i agree. Bernie is getting old.

sidd

[sidd]

Let's hear it: Dimon in 2020

" I mean, I've said this before Trump was elected. You're not going to get a wealthy New Yorker elected president. Boy I was dead wrong. "

So here's Dimon making another prediction:

"I think I could beat Trump."

Why buy the king when you can be the king ?

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/12/jamie-dimon-says-he-could-beat-trump-in-an-election.html

sidd

[mostly_lurking]

She has fallen off the radar for quite a while. This would be a great idea!  Progressive, woman and a  vet... and I love her voice   

[jacksmith4tx]

and a  vet

I personally don't care for ex-military politicians. Too easy for them to fall back to 'military solutions' that justify huge defense budgets.

I nominate Beto O'Rourke. He's got Willie Nelson doing a benefit concert (his first ever for a politician!) for him in Austin on Sep. 29th.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beto_O%27Rourke

[TerryM]

Tulsi calls America's interference in Syria a "Betrayal of the American People"

She previously had called out Obama for the same thing.

Americans elected the last Presidential candidate who called for peace with Syria and Russia.
Who know, perhaps it will work this time round?

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-09-13/tulsi-gabbard-house-floor-slams-betrayal-american-people-after-911-over-syria

Terry

[sidd]

Here's an oddball:

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/09/26/hickenlooper-colorado-2020-democrats-842596

sidd

[SteveMDFP]

Here's an oddball:

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/09/26/hickenlooper-colorado-2020-democrats-842596

sidd

I think Dems could do a lot worse.  He's soft on fracking, but fracking will need to die from low oil prices anyway.  He could do well in the general election--Americans tend to prefer governors over senators.

The article acknowledges that his great hurdle will be in the primaries, not having a strong profile to suit the Democratic base. 

Thus, he's a prime choice to be VP.  Let him marinate in that post for 4-8 years, and he could then be a very good Presidential candidate, if he keeps a strong profile over those years.

[litesong]

In close assessments, the following candidates & reasons to elect, in any order democrats may want:
Senator Cory Booker (Has relations with both repubs & dems, constructing legislation with best chances of passage; Clarence Thomas bad-mouths him)
Joy Reid (Comprehensive knowledge & exceedingly fine ability to concisely present information; Knows how to counter re-pubic-lick-un flapjaw)
Rachael Maddow (Wide grasp of political backwaters; Has connections, unbeknownst to other journalists (& most politicians, too); First with details to "don'T rump" treasonous white-washing of russian stolen & illegal assets)
Lawrence O'Donnell (First to be attacked by "don'T rump"; Has politically eviscerated politicians so quickly, they are still standing, but dead)
///////
Of the above who would be president, the others would be powerful vice-presidents & members of the Cabinet.

[sidd]

Democratic candidate Avenatti ? Well, if Trump could win ...

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/08/10/michael-avenatti-presidential-run-iowa-2020-771291
https://www.mediaite.com/print/michael-avenatti-exploring-presidential-run/

I suggest Stormy Daniels for vice. What could go wrong ?

sidd

[SteveMDFP]

I suggest Stormy Daniels for vice. What could go wrong ?

sidd

Well, she does have good positions.
;-)

[TerryM]

I suggest Stormy Daniels for vice. What could go wrong ?

sidd

Well, she does have good positions.
;-)

And an intimate understanding of vice.
Terry

[sidd]

Biden leads in Iowa, 37% of respondents, N=500 likely caucus attendees.

"16 percent backed Sen. Elizabeth Warren, 12 percent supported Sen. Bernie Sanders, 10 percent picked Sen. Kamala Harris and Sen. Cory Booker received support from 8 percent."

Sherrod Brown not on the list.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/10/01/poll-biden-leads-iowa-democrats-854872

Full poll results:

https://www.politico.com/f/?id=00000166-30b4-d5d9-ab67-fef45d120000

If Biden is the nominee, it would reveal that the Democratic party has learned nothing from 2016. And a recipe for low turnout.

sidd

[TerryM]

Biden leads in Iowa, 37% of respondents, N=500 likely caucus attendees.

If Biden is the nominee, it would reveal that the Democratic party has learned nothing from 2016. And a recipe for low turnout.

sidd

I'm seeing no indication that the DNC, or the DCCC have learned a damn thing. The wrong candidates braying the wrong message, because it worked so well in the past?


"Hope & Change" at least won elections. "Your voters are Deplorable Dregs" wins enemies for life.


Screeching that the loyal opposition appoints rapists, and that those who support him sanction these activities might cause more than a few to take umbrage. One of the places they'll take their umbrage is to the voting booth.

Terry

[sidd]

Now here's an outsider: Ojeda

“The reason why the Democratic Party fell from grace is because they become nothing more than elitist. That was it. Goldman Sachs, that’s who they were. The Democratic Party is supposed to be the party that fights for the working class, and that’s exactly what I do. I will stand with unions wholeheartedly, and that’s the problem: the Democratic Party wants to say that, but their actions do not mirror that.”

"Members of Congress, he proposes, should be required to donate their net wealth above a certain threshold — Ojeda puts it at a million dollars — to discourage using public office for private gain. In return, retired members of Congress would get a pension of $130,000 a year and be able to earn additional income to reach $250,000. Anything above that would be donated."

“When you get into politics, that’s supposed to be a life of service, but that’s not what it’s been. You know, a person goes into politics, they win a seat in Congress or the Senate, and it’s a $174,000 [salary], but yet two years later, they’re worth $30 million, and that’s one of the problems that we have in society today. That’s how come no one trusts — or has very much respect for — politicians,”

Heeheehee. I like him already.

https://theintercept.com/2018/11/11/richard-ojeda-2020-president/

sidd

[sidd]

No surprise, Sherrod Brown is considering a bid:

https://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2018/11/sen_sherrod_brown_of_ohio_is_w.html

https://www.dispatch.com/news/20181112/sherrod-brown-for-president-hes-thinking-about-it

Might be three from Ahia: Tim Ryan (D) and John Kasich (R) are thinking about it too.

sidd